With the Pope’s death expected sometime tonight, that’s a big question. The answer, of course, is: nobody really knows.
But certainly, these hints are not reassuring:
Reuters:
VATICAN CITY – Ailing Pope John Paul approved a flurry of Church appointments around the world on Friday in another possible indication he was approaching the end of his life.
A Vatican statement said the Pope had appointed 17 new bishops and archbishops and accepted the resignation of six others.
The nominations and resignations included bishops in Asia, Africa, Latin America, Europe, republics of the former Soviet Union and the Pacific.
The large number of appointments and resignations, unusual for one day, was an indication that the Pope, who appeared close to death on Friday, wanted to clear up unfinished business.
Despite popular impressions that the business of the papacy comes grinding to a halt when the pope is sick, the normal pace of activity during the pope’s recent illness has suffered barely a hiccup. According to official Vatican bulletins, during March John Paul II:
- Appointed 29 bishops;
- Issued 10 messages for various groups and occasions, totaling 5,891 words;
- Issued two telegrams;
- Participated in one ad limina visit, with the bishops of Tanzania;
- Prepared the text of four Sunday Angelus messages;
- Written his annual Holy Thursday letter to Priests, of 2,095 words;
- Appointed five officers for an upcoming Synod of Bishops;
- Appointed four new officers to the government of the Vatican city-state;
- Appointed a new member of the Prefecture of Economic Affairs;
- Appointed six members of the Pontifical Academy for Life.
Even with a pope in the flush of health, it would strain credibility to believe that he was personally responsible for all this activity. Given John Paul’s current fatigue and weakness, however, it is all the more impossible to maintain that the pope himself is personally engaged in the details of all these appointments and texts.
From the testimony of everyone who has seen him during this period, it’s clear that Pope John Paul II retains full lucidity and is capable of saying “yes” or “no” to proposals placed before him, and can still add some characteristic personal touches. At the same time, however, everyone concedes that, increasingly, the bulk of the work is being performed by others.
So, the $64,000 question: Who are these others? Who’s really running the show?
Let’s hope it’s the Holy Spirit.
and my speculation is that he has his ambitions, but I’m rooting for Oscar Rodriguez!
and here are some more pope pics 🙂
Gilgamesh a blogger who lives in Italy is sure it will be Ratzinger of one other ultra-conservative.
The Vatican will take a sharp turn to the right and if so will be quite in tune with the fundies in Washington. The Church may even begin to approve of the death penalty and pre-emptive war. Or maybe
I am just having a nightmare.
Protestants are making big inroads in Latin America, Islam is growing faster than any flavor of Christianity, so it would be better strategy to go with either Afrinze or Napier or my pick 🙂 Or Hummes, who was talked about a lot the last time the Pope got sick, but not so much now.
I think the big conflict will be not only left-right, but Europe-somewhere else!
No offense to those who believe that pope selection is a supernatural process 😛
A nightmare, to have a conservative at the head of a regressive church with a shrinking population and a long history of active and passive collaboration with fascists?
I would think, rather, that anything that would make the truth about the Catholic church clearer, would be a good thing.
Yes, cultivate our own garden. The death of the Pope won’t change anything much. The Church’s influence has declined significantly but still has millions of followers and can sway governments.
It’s no use making the truth clearer to people who refuse to accept the truth in the first place.
I see a right-wing Catholic Church as a nightmare because it would be an ally for the right-wing White House.
I don’t see Ratzinger getting the votes. He’s had a lot of power as the head of the Congregation for the Indoctrination of the Faith. I somehow don’t think his fellow cardinals are going to just line up behind him.
Ratzinger will likely have a lot of influence in the selection, but I doubt he’ll be the choice of many.
I believe I’ve heard that he’s not well liked in the highest circles; apparently he’s the authoritarian side of JP’s papacy. The speculation I’ve heard is that neither Ratzinger nor Arinze would get the nod.
according to a blurb at airamerica earlier (can’t find it now- maybe it was elsewhere) the Dali Lama is taking over…
btw, I find it really interesting that the pope has chosen to be in his apartment rather than at a hospital…(that’s what I just heard on the radio at any rate). Avoid the mess of having people debate your life support by not being in the hospital in the first place.
very clever man.
From this story by AP, we learn that
The article then concludes by stating that reporters who regularly cover the Vatican said that “Friday was the first time in memory that the press office had announced it would be open around the clock.” It certainly seems like the Vatican knows the end is very near. . .
they did eventually take a couple hours’ break. I’m listening to the World Service live stream so I can’t rewind and go back to listen to the details, though. Sorry.
Bush uses the death of the Pope to his political advantage. He uses the death of the Pope to promote his phony culture-of-life agenda, which is the most degraded manifestation of Oswellian cynicism. His every-Pope-left-behind Rovian hypocritical manipulation of the media is astounding. Did I leave anything out here?
Definition of hypocrisy?
“The false claim to or pretense of having admirable principles, beliefs, or feelings.”
How wonderful to have the megalith corporate media bowing down to your hypocrisy! Where are we as a nation?
Someone once said, hypocrisy is the greatest sin. (Meher Baba.) What could that mean, I wonder?
lasted like 3 weeks? Also, do you think they would hold off announcing his death to take care of some business that they wanted him to do, but he didn’t or wouldn’t? You know…sneaky things getting done in the middle of the night…Changes that other higher ups desperately wanted done, but John Paul would budge. I also heard that their was speculation that if he died in the middle of the night (Rome time-9hrs later than PST)they would wait till morning to make the announcement. My first diary here was about the Confessionals, and how they scared the shit out of me as a kid. Lapsed Catholic that I am. Perhaps I just might pop in to one of Pastor Dans sermons, I hear he is one hell of a guy.
That when the last two popes died they did not tell for several days, and later admitted he had died earlier. But this time I think they will announce at sunrise Rome time. The same thing happened the last time where it was reported he was dead, then denied and then announced.
yeah…I think my fellow Italians got it right..I think he passed earlier today. They just had unfinished business to do…you know..protocal. Everyone on TV is talking about him like he is dead already. He was this and that…you know. I am almost sure there was a pope that lasted about 1 minute.
Yeah, I think that’s right, I am just waiting till 9 or so and expect to hear the announcement. I think they also may want to do all the after death stuff, before they announce, maybe get him all dressed, etc. so that the ceremony can take place.
Now, please come to my rant diary and join the discussion and get out any rants that may have built up, please, do I have to beg.
And no I am not drinking, just feeling like having a good debate, or discussion, I really enjoy a good one.
Expect to see your post there or at least a comment.
how is your freeper? is he still around? have you changed his ways? we need all the new votes we can get. What state is he in? Red/Blue?
He’s in blue and I’m in red country, ironic huh.
Just saw him post and invited him to the diary, hope to see you there, this is our chance to see if we can refine our case.
Nothing else to do tonight right, but wait to hear the death announcement.
See you over there. ok
I have been trying to convert him, but I need all your help, he has some big problems with Kerry, Bush, on foreign policy,Rove (boy that’s one we have to get into) but a lot of it is his age. Doesn’t have the history under his belt like old timers do.
That’s why we have to throw our knowledge at him, figuratively of course and see if it sticks.
But he seems willing to hear, and if we can make a case for our side he can agree with, well that would be the first time I’ve ever seen a conversion myself and it would give me hope.
See you there.
JP1 died on September 28, 1978 after being elected Pope on August 26, 1978.
there are a few possibilities here.
First, the most likely: these are people that have grown closest to him over the years, and are acting according to what he would want.
Second, and less likely: he laid out some things he wanted to do if he took a turn for the worse and ran out of time, and they are doing just that.
There may be others. But if it’s either of these two, they have one thing in common: these are “what the Pope would have wanted.”
So, in the wake of the Schiavo incident, who are we to criticize? If what someone “would have wanted” is reason enough to allow someone to die, shouldn’t it be enough to allow them to carry out a job that they are expected to hold until death or they choose otherwise?
Puts the right-to-die people squarely in his court.
Me? I’m a right-to-die supporter under some very specific circumstances, but that’s not why I have no problem with what’s going on. Again, I have two reasons.
One: I’m not a Catholic, and what goes on in their Church (at least until I finally make up my mind and convert) isn’t something I feel qualified to comment on too extensively.
Two: These are matters of faith, and all of the people close to the Pope believe in a divine will quite strongly. They believe, furthermore, that the Pope acts only according to God’s will. AND, taking it one step further, they believe that people other than the Pope are capable of distilling that will. So, even if they cannot get his express approval, as long as they are acting according to it, they believe they have the Pope’s implicit approval.
Of course, “interpreting” God’s will has definitely gotten the Church into trouble before. Anyone else remember the Inquisition?
“”Second, and less likely: he laid out some things he wanted to do if he took a turn for the worse and ran out of time, and they are doing just that.””
It was reported earlier that bishops were appointed, etc. this morning our time, by the Pope.
Yes I remember the Inquisition, although not that I was there or anything, but I do know a lot about it, a subject of interest to me some years back.
So Another, I hope you are going to take a trip to my diary about rants, and converse with us. What say.
The Catholic Church.
Just set for a minute and contemplate that. Especially if you hadn’t before. It’s almost impossible to grasp, isn’t it?
Something to consider in the midst of all this.