I am of the mind that there are many parallels between the 60’s/70’s time period and now. I am hoping that ‘Elders’ on this site will write their rememberences of those years with an eye to comparing then to the present time.
What about those years led you to the political and world view you have now? How did those years profoundly change you? What effect did Vietnam have on your life?
I was 18 in 1961 when I graduated from high school, married my first husband and was pregnant with my first child.
I guess the first big tragedy to befall this country during the 60’s was the assassination of President Kennedy. All of us younger folks at the time were very excited about this president and this man who would now lead the country. We liked that he was young, we could relate to him, we could be excited about this country as we entered into our adulthood, we had hope for our future..
But alas that hope and excitement was short lived, this nation went into deep morning over his death and it seemed like our darkest hour was at hand.
Vietnam was on to make it even darker, and shortly there would be a draft,then the draft lottery, which was like spin the wheel and see who will be sent to die in Vietnam. My husband and I worried about his being drafted, but then they added if you were married and had one child, exempt, then later on I think it was changed to 2 children. Still we worried, things were getting worse over there, hopeless, and no one was trying to stop it. Later on they did, but it took awhile for people to get disgusted and fed up enough to get active and take to the streets.
At the same time there were dire warning about the economy, the end times, the Late GreatPlanet Earth, by Hal Linsey, was a big seller. We worried about gas prices and then later on in the 70’s we worried about getting gas at all as we sat in the long lines at service stations across this country.
We worried about global warming, dependence on fossil fuel, advancing work on solar power, wind power, etc.. We worried most of all that the powers that be in Washington were never going to get it together and do something to stop the abomination that was Vietnam.
In 1972 I married my second husband who was a Vietnam Vet, just out and back to US after 1 year over there.
It’s looking a lot like the same issue are present today as then.
Well enough about my story (I’ll add some more later), tell us yours, tell us what you remember, what you felt, how those years changed you. If you are too young to remember those years, what impact did it have on you through your parents and the stories you have read or any other way?
Let me think for a bit … I might have to censor what I write. Heavily.
I think the poll needs an “I don’t wanna think about it” option.
Well, there are lots of recollections, but maybe this very general note might serve.
People know the 60’s/70’s through pictures and film footage showing thousands, hundreds of thousands, at demonstrations like the March on the Pentagon in 1967 and the Democratic National Convention in 1968.
(I’m in twenty-second row back, fifty-fourth from the left.)
But what I recall is how small the groups were when the antiwar movement began. At CU-Boulder, it really was just a handful of people at the beginning. Meetings would draw ll of twelve or fourteen people, sometimes not even that. And the demonstrations themselves weren’t that much bigger. Twenty or thirty people standing around, getting verbal and sometimes physical abuse from students on their way to class.
But then strange things happened. Where we expected thirty people to show up, three hundred showed. When we expected a couple hundred, more than a thousand showed. And, after Kent State, it was several thousabd students massed to demand the university shut down in response.
To live through that time was to be trapped in a nightmare. But it was also to be part of a movement that grew with astonishing speed and that gave great hope.
I knew a good comment would be forthcoming from you and you did not disappoint.
I never demonstrated during the war, I was very busy with children, but certainly we were all aware of the movement building and growing. I am curious what you think about why this is not happening now, is it still early for the outrage to take over.
I also have a theory, that our generation settled into a somewhat ‘normal’ life after the end of the Vietnam war, and now we are roused again to lead the fight. Do you think we can, do you think anyone will step up to lead the fight, how many years will it have to take before someone like John Kerry testifies before Congress about the atrocity of the Iraq war. And will the cycle repeat itself.
Yes there was hope in the doing itself, the actions taken, gave the hope and so many were committed to going all the way, with the movement. At a certain point it could not be stopped. We need this now!!!!!!!
I have said many times If you can’t find a leader be one, When a better leader rises up, follow him/her.
But I’m not sure I have any particularly good answers to your very pertinent questions.
The nastier side of the Iraq war is emerging in the media much more quickly than the nastier side of the Viet Nam war did, with a notable exception. Pretty quickly after the Viet Nam war ramped up, the evening news shows were filled with footage of American wounded and dead. The military learned that lesson well. American casualities are now reported but, with few exceptions, never shown. This is a war where the American dead appear only as numbers or as those posed portraits against the background of the flag. To date, the media has not succeeded in showing the reality of the war. And I suspect that won’t change.
Why is there no massive antiwar movement? There are probably lots of reasons for that, including the fact that there is no draft. But I suspect one reason is that the war, for all the reporting, is still invisible.
But I’m not sure this is really the time for that sort of mass movement. The antiwar movement of the 60’s and 70’s developed when there was no hope at all for electoral politics. I have no idea what the numbers really were, but I suspect that, in 1967, public support for the war was well over 80%. Senators opposed to the war could be counted on one hand with fingers left over. When there’s no hope at the voting booth, you take to the streets.
A few more years (I shudder, along with the rest of you, at the thought) of the Republican right doing stupid and counterproductive (though productive for us) things, and the next election cycle could be very different than the last. So, in that sense, I don’t know if there’s all that much to be learned from the 60’s and 70’s–except that small groups of people, working their asses off, can sometimes bring about big changes.
After reading your comment /”60’s and 70’s developed when there was no hope at all for electoral politics. I have no idea what the numbers really were, but I suspect that, in 1967, public support for the war was well over 80%”/I did a quick search and found the following article. I do not recall that support for the war was high at all, ever, quite the opposite. It was not sold in the same way Iraq was, in fact it was more of a slip slide into it, the more that fall the harder we go at it.
http://allfreeessays.com/student/Vietnam_Essay_Public_Opinion_the_US_withdrawal.html
I sincerely hope that we do not have to wait 10 years for an anti war movement to build in this country. I predict that it will start to flame if no withdrawel is evident by the end of the year.
Reporting does make a difference, Vietnam was a daily barrage of injured men and crashed planes. It was very real to us.
First really concious memory of TV – Kennedy assassination November 1963
Had TV and watched everything that the major 3 networks put out for 10 years….tin foil hat permenantly attached during this time period.
Graduated from High School 1973
Joined the Army early 1974 – Nixon Resigned Aug 1974
Saigon fell 1975
I got married the first time in 1975 – the day after Patty Hearst was captured. Remember listening to her arrest information on the way to the Wedding Rehearsal.
Geez are any baby boomers rational having grown up with all that crap??
Your words:
No I don’t know if we are rational or not; those years were hard and I don’t think I really relaxed about the “world situation” until the Clinton Years, sigh, what I would give for those years back again.
But it appears we can still think and now we have this powerful new tool to use, the internet, and that gives us a new viability.
In all seriousness the 70’s just bring back vomit inducing memories of right dodgy clothes, early overindulgence on alcohol, and some right crappy music.
However, we could all do with a bit of that spirit of 68 right now.
It was a different America then, no doubt. People still had real “Values”, and family gatherings were in abundance.
People had Empathy, Civility, Compassion, all the things that have formed this country, and it’s people.
Somewhere that was lost, or stolen, by the evil monster known as Greed.
The draft, yeah, I remember it well, as when the lottery was drawn. My ol’ buddy and I sat at the nieghborhood water’n hole, and watched it on the boob tube that night, in particular. I remember us saying to each other, “if we make it past the 3rd number, we’re good for another year” Bingo, the first number drawn was ours. His birthday was a week after mine.
I remember the look on the bartender’s face when he saw the look on ours. He never said a word, just set up another round, and asked if there was anything else he could do. I said “yeah, set up the house” and we proceeded to get….well..loaded.
I didn’t think about leaving the country, or dressing up in women’s underwear, or playing the objector route. I stayed drunk for about two weeks, said my good bye’s, and enlisted. It was what you did, in my family (and area of the country)anyway.
I served my time, and a little more, and did my job, it was what you were supposed to do, no question.
I remember coming home from the jungles, and getting spit on, trash thrown at, and on me. Jeered, ridiculed, and being called baby killer.
What a strange time it was, for the vets. For you see, we had fought for that right of the people to do just that, and then bore the brunt of it.
Strange times indeed, for when I left, I had long hair, beard, wore buckskin coat and boots, ragged jeans, peace signs, and the people I knew jeered me for being a hippy. When I came home, they were the hippies, and I was the baby killer…hmmmm, amazing how things turn, for the crowds, when they are the “cool” one’s, huh?
During the 70’s, you would begin to see even the older generation letting their hair grow, being vocal about “rights”, now whether they actually believed in what they were saying, or just being cool, well, that’s another tale. In the meantime, I’ll just set on mine. ; )
Not just this country, but around the world, the evil monster of greed is consuming people at an alarming rate. What will become of mankind, well….time will tell.
If we live long enough, what will we look back on this era, and say?
I don’t even know where to begin, my memories go back to the 50s and I graduated high school in 1963. Martin Luther King is the only political leader I ever had any idolatry for and even there, as a SNCC kid, I was aware of organizaional tensions. When MLK was assassinated I saw that overt racism in that little town was going to last another generation and I made the decision to migrate. I refused induction into the service three times and they gave me a 1-Y exemption since I was crazy. 1968 was a year of near actual rebellion in a number of places. I could go on and on.
I don’t recall two more worrisome times politically than 1968-70 and now.
I was born in the late 50’s, so I grew up in the shadow of (and, living in Hollywood, CA, in the midst of) the civil rights movements, hippies, druggies, Vietnam war protests, pictures of war on the screen nightly, sit-ins, the Beatles and so on.
It was an extremely confusing time to be a kid, I’ll tell ya. There were many good points… the focus on an egalitarian society, social justice and so on, that I absorbed. Some not so good points, but I’m glad I was able to experience that period of history.
My, what an interesting time that was. I was just introducing myself to the gay world in the early 60’s, so my focus was intently on that as I discovered a whole world of people and a culture that I did not realize existed. I was devastated by Kennedy’s assassination as so many of us were in 1963. To me it was even more than the loss of the man that we all had such high hopes for, it was that such a thing could happen in my country. . .again. There was the civil rights movement and MLK, whom I thought was the closest living thing to a real prophet that walked the face of the earth. To me he was a truly “holy” man doing God’s own work. No, he wasn’t perfect, and I didn’t expect him to be. But he was so filled with the integrity of his calling and the greater purpose for mankind that I saw him as a shining light. The horrible things that were done to those peaceful protestors for equality deeply affected my heart.
I could never figure out why we were in Viet Nam. But then I could never figure out how wars had any good outcome or were justified, especially this one. I was in a strange place about the Armed Services. . .I could understand those who enlisted, those who were drafted and had no apparent problem with going, those who were scared to death but went anyway, those who burned their draft cards, those who fled to Canada, or those who were contentious objectors. I could see the value in each of their perspectives. I thought the hippies were fabulous in a lot of ways. Who could argue with LOVE being the most important goal? I admired their desire to thumb their noses at authority (something pretty close to my own heart). I loved the art work, I tried a little pot, I was too the “uptight, proper behavior, middle class, clean living, religiously trained, people pleasing” young woman who wouldn’t say “shit” if I had a handful of it to take to the streets and free love way of life. I lived in Reno at the time and in 1968 I was at the corner of Haight-Ashbury in San Francisco, taking a free copy of the underground newspaper from a less than clean totally drugged out hippie.
The assassinations of MLK and RFK ripped my heart out and I was very aggrieved and unable to comprehend how this could happen and happen in “my country”. The Black Panthers and other more violent movements were not things that seemed to me like the right way to go about things. Violence just never seemed the answer to me, regardless of how justified the cause. I always felt guilty that I hadn’t dropped everything in my life and taken myself to walk with those in Selma, Al. Just as I felt guilty that I didn’t get myself out there on the front lines of the marches for the ERA. I supported the women’s movement every other way I could and was vocal about it, but I did not put myself out on the front lines, and it felt shameful to me that I didn’t.
I hated the war, but in 1965 I joined the Women’s Army Corps and served 2 years. It seemed somehow a way to support all those young guys going off to Viet Nam yet many of them never coming home. By 1967 I was very much anti the war and pro supporting our soldiers who, for the most part, had no choice but to go. The returning Viet Nam vets were treated horribly and I was very angry about that treatment.
On the other hand, I was having the time of my life discovering gay society and getting to know my “people.” Too much drinking, lots of dancing and partying, bonding with a whole family of gay people that felt more like my family than my adoptive parents or my bio-brother. It was a “gay old time” to be sure.
How does this relate to now? It seemed to me that with the end of the war and the majority public coming to demand we end it and see that it was something we never should have been involved in in the first place, the ouster of Nixon, it looked like things might heal and we would be okay. What is happening now is far scarier to me. Never has there been a group in power more openly intent on destroying the constitution, full of arrogant power, lacking in any concern for their fellow humans, greedy beyond all concept, and intent on staying in power forever. I think Karl Rove’s statement that he intends that the Republicans will hold all 3 branches of government forever, and his alignment with the “it’s who counts the votes” that matters proponents, are the scariest ideas I have ever heard. I don’t normally tend to conspiracy theories, but unless we can insure our votes are counted and counted as accurately as possible, we have lost our democracy and we can start looking for the gay concentration camps, among other “undesirables.” The Homeland Security Department along with the Patriot act has already stripped us of protections we thought we could rely upon in our country. As long as these criminals are in power, we can only expect more and more abuses of our rights. If you dissent with anything this current pack of thieves does or wants to do, you can bet you are already on lists of “subversives” to watch. When, and if, we can take the government back I think it will take 20 years or more to undo the damage that has already been done.
The good news is that I am willing to take to the streets now and I won’t mind being at the head of the line.
To take up your last point about the current state of affairs a la Washington, I agree it is the scariest time I have seen yet in my 61 years. Not the threat of terrorists, but the threat of Bush and Co. and the Republican machine that seems to throw all caution to the wind in every way they possibly can.
I personally don’t think the younger of the masses see the current times in the way we who have witnessed more of history see them. We know how things were, say in the 40’s, for me, and I can tell you, even coming out of World War II and all the communist threat propaganda, the cold war threat propaganda, V. etc. the progression of this country has been truly frightening in the last 5 years.
I am wondering if we will have to join the Republican party to change it from within. Staunch Rep. outraged at the direction of the party, is the role I would take, if necessary.
As an aside: Do you remember the boycotts against business, called by Jessie Jackson in the 70’s, 80’s , can’t remember, but they were very successful.
Take it to the streets in a way that paralyzes businesss for a day or whatever, to make a point works?
I’ll end this with your line:
Count me in!!!!!
I agree very much with you Diane. The climate right now is the worst nightmare I ever could have imagined, especially with the Corporate Media in full compliance with keeping any and all truth from us.
It also seems to me that the generations that have been raised on TV are dangerously lacking in truth seeking and curiosity. They seem to also be aligned with the “If it is in print it must be the truth” groups. The lack of or inability of critical thinking is very frightening indeed.
Unfortunately, it seems the “keep them so busy stuggling to survive in their daily lives” ideology is working. Most people are so tired and so deeply involved in their own personal struggles, the last thing they want to have to do is THINK, about anything, let alone how their government is being run.
Glad to see so many of us “Fine Wine, aged to perfection” folks here.
.
My dad’s business was ruined as a result of WWII, so he applied for consideration to emigrate to Australia, Canada or the United States. The Sunday’s were filled with my dad reciting the words from his English booklet, over and over, working on his pronunciation. At last, a large wooden crate was maneuvered into our living room to ship all of our belongings.
Through an immigration organization Catholic Welfare [CW], we shipped out from the port of Rotterdam on March 7th, by an ocean liner of the Holland-America Line -was a Dutch troops carrier after WWII to wage war in the colony of Indonesia-. The 10 day journey was of itself an adventure, as soon as the Dover straight meets the Atlantic Ocean, and the waves start to look pretty awesome. Via Halifax, Newfoundland, the Groote Beer arrived in Hoboken, NJ. Unfortunately, a thick fog prevented us from viewing Manhattan and the skyscrapers.
The next few hours, were spent to go through US Immigration Services and to find Central Station, as the final stage was by train to Missouri. The CW arranged a job, housing and a sponsor who guarantees the ticket to the old country by serious illness or failure. Soon darkness fell, and sight from the train was limited to the lights in homes, business or cars on the road. Through the Appalachian mountains and via Cincinnati, the train sped the next 24 hours towards the Mid-west of America. The main adjustment was the food, sandwiches and a struggle to get some shut-eye on the hard wooden seats in the train wagon.
Arrival in St. Louis, Union station, was a magnificent sight – 40 tracks ending in the main hall. The air you breath and the scent is so different, as we were used to the beaches, dunes and the sea coast. Next fourteen days we would settle in a hotel in downtown St. Louis, close to the large warehouses. During this period, my dad started working at his new job and arranged the small house at the plant & tree nursery where he worked. Meanwhile, my mom weary of four kids, tried to apply at the nearby Catholic parochial grade school, to get us educated. The discussion with the priest lasted longer than we expected. Apparently a difficulty, we were white, and the parochial school was all black, the teachers weren’t sure if they could cope. Us kids, we didn’t mind, as we roamed the streets in downtown for a few more days. Were invited at the nearby Fire Department, the men showed us all the beautiful fire engines.
After two weeks we moved to our new home at the nursery where my dad was employed. There was electricity, but no gas or running water. The kitchen had a wooden stove for cooking, we managed, but for my mom it was a difficult start. It was a rural area, with neighbors at a distance and the nearest town, school and shops at 5 mi. Fortunately, there was a local market – a true general store – not just groceries, but kitchen appliances, radio and TV, hardware section and a friendly sphere. Walking distance was twice 20 minutes, so close by. Via friends of CW, a ’49 Dodge was offered at a really low price, my dad couldn’t refuse, having taken driving lessons back home and he had been an adamant motor rider.
To enroll in the local parochial school was no problem, and we learned the English language in a swift manner. As a sixth grader, twice a week I would sit in the English class of the 2nd grade to learn grammar. In addition a boy, Edwin from my classroom, would provide individual tutoring of English words and pronunciation. The seventh grade was a lot of fun, getting to know my classmates better, and trying to teach them more of the Dutch language than vice versa. The easiest lessons were math though, as no language barrier exists with numbers, and the grade school education I had was advanced in comparison.
Near the end of the school year, I was permitted to take the high school entrance tests, and scored enough points to skip the eight grade. After two years, we were rather well adjusted, lots of youthful ambition and hope in the future. Poor dad struggled with the English language, as he worked the nursery with two colleagues from Poland and Jesus from Mexico. The supervisor was of German descent, so the conversation turned daily to the German language. My mom was smart, early on she decided to invest in a b/w TV, tuned daily to the Price is Right and the soap As the World Turns and mastered the English language in her own way.
My dad was promoted, so we moved to the house up on the hill with running water from an outside tank and sufficient space to house all family members more comfortably. The house we left was struck by awful disaster to the next family that moved in. In the pond nearby, their 15yr old son drowned when a raft he build turned over. Hearing the screams of family and friends, we tried our best to find him under water, but the exact spot was not clear and we were already searching more than 15 minutes. A few months later, the mom of the family caught her dress on fire from the wooden kitchen stove, and also died.
In the sixties, St. Louis mayor and city council were ambitious, but the economic decay for this Mississippi river town had set in and seemed unstoppable. The housing renewal projects got started in mid-town, the Pruitt towers were build, and became a social disaster for the occupants and have been demolished already. The beautiful Union station still exists, but not with the 40+ tracks leading to the main hall and hustle with passengers.
The seventies was heavily influenced by resentment to loss of life in the Vietnam War, and the unbelievable hypocrisy by the media and the American public, to put blame on the individual men and women who fought the dirty war in Vietnam. Instead of putting the responsibility on the politicians: Nixon, Kissinger and DoD for their failures. The Watergate burglary and complete breakdown of people’s trust in the presidency and US government.
Today, we witness the failure of the US to lead the world based on moral principle, US cultural fortitude and generosity to the oppressed in the world. The US Eagle and it’s talons are grabbing world’s resources at an irresponsible rate without rationale toward nature and the environment.
Marx’s worst nightmare on capitalism is slowly being revealed by the Bush | Cheney | NeoCon dogma of the New American Century.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
IMHO, That was truly a joy to read, I will have to read it again to get more out of it.
It is so interesting to me to read the various entries on this diary, and the wonderful stories so far, I wish we could have had more.
I’m thinking some of these comments, which really end up to be stories, would make a great book or two, like collections of stories from the blogs. Tell us about you or recollections from the blogosphere, what we really are like, who we are.
I am just wondering if it would be possible to get a book together, with submissions from members, etc. and if it gets sold or published we could use the money as a collective to help or fund our causes and mabe tip Booman and this site a little. Sounds like a big dream I know, but dreams have to start somewhere and sometimes they come true.
I just have a sense that we are wasting a lot of these wonderful words said everyday, and they could be used for something more, many of the stories are inspiring and poignant and others would surely want to read them.
What do you think, Oui and others who may read this.
Does anyone have publishing connections.
There are so many great stories out there of “who we are,” I think a collection of them would be fabulous. Self publishing may be the only way to get it published, however, with all of the editors and professional writers here and on Kos, we should certainly try that route first.
Self published would cost about $900-$1200 and the books are printed as ordered. They are listed on Amazon and Barnes and Nobel, and others, copies to Library of Congress and an ISBN issued. Certainly those who have their own blogs could promote it there. Perhaps it is a topic (Blogs and who are the bloggers) that is currently gaining enough interest that some publisher may wish to take it on.
It would be a great project. I’d love to participate, and I am certain there are hundreds of very interesting stories to include (if not thousands).
I don’t have time and am not the best at heading up any projects right now, but I sure would be glad to participate.
Oui. . .wonderful and well written story.
I didn’t make that very clear. . .I think we should try the regular publishing route first, then consider self publishing with contributors chipping in for the costs.