Recent discourse in many threads on dkos and elsewhere has been dominated by a marked tendency to focus exclusively on the US’s deficiences, inadequacies and responsibilities for the many ill and evils of all parts of the known-to-be-inhabited universe.
Now, I don’t believe that there is anything inherently wrong with these types of discussions. But what I want to accomplish in this thread is very simply to open up a discussion on the faults and defects of OTHER countries besides the US. I wish in this context to hear only about the inadequacies of any and all nations on earth which have no causal relationship with US domestic or foriegn policy. This is not about passing blame, apologizing for the past or present crimes of one’s countries. The goal is very simply to learn from each other, as intelligent and responsible citizens of the international community, about the various and infinite political and social failings of [b]all[/b] nations:
- As a learning experience for myself and others who have very limited access to accurate and reliable information about what’s going on in places like China, India, Australia, ad infintum.
- To counterbalance the enormous anount of complaining and sometimes excessive US-bashing which often predominates on the many dkos-related sites.
I will go ahead and provide a very short list of the defects and shortcomings of the US and then I would very much appreciate the contributions of Brits, Germans, Italians, French, Chinese and others citizens of the world along the same or very similar lines.
My criticisms of the US are these, among so many others it would probably take at least a week to formulate them all:
- The barbaric practice of State execution of prisoners, many of whom are subsequently proven to be innocent.
- The unbelievable numbers of people incarcerated and the squalidity and brutality of their conditions in such institutions. The practical adandonment of any rehabilitative approach to the treatment and the prevention of crime and the almost exclusive emphasis on punishment and retribution. The US is an extraordinarily vindictive society in which 37% of citizens declare themsleves to be in favor of the Lex Talionis and 2/3 support the death penalty.
- The US has the largest military apparatus in the history of the known and charted universe. It spends more on military technology, materiel and human resources than the other nine richest nations combined. Almost half of all of the world’s military spending is attributable to the US.
- The US illegaly and immorally invaded and occupied a third-world country (Iraq) which it had previously suffocated practically to the point of annihilation though a harsh and relentless regime of trade sanctions. Historically, through the CIA and NSA it had funded, if not outright created, the Baathist dictatorship which gassed to death millions of Kurds in the North and Shiites in the south of Iraq.
- The EU provides over 70% of the funding for international reconstruction projects, 50% of development assistence and 47% of all the humanitarian aid provided to the developing world. The US, the richest country on earth in terms of GDP, provides only 36% of such developement aid funding.
- The enormous and increasing inequality in income distriution is a moral disgrace and a social time-bomb which is associated with the increasing crime rate. The US is now classified as 24th on the list of indutrialized nations WRT this particular indicator. All but one or two of the 25 member nations of the EU can vaunt a more fair and equal distribution of wealth.
- There are more people living in poverty in the US than in all 16 of the nations of the European Union for which their are data avaliable.
- 22% of US children have standards of living below the poverty rate. The US is currently in 22nd place in childhood poverty among industrialized nations. Only Mexico rates worse.
- The US is rated 24th or 25th among industrialized nations on infant mortality.
- There are 250 million guns in circulation in the US. The murder rate is almost four times higher in the US than in Europe.
- The US is sadly behind most of Europe on environmental protection. It refuses to sign the Global Warming Treaty, the Treaty on Biodiversity, and the Kyoto Protocal.
- The US has refused to adhere to the ICC and is a systematic violater of international law.
- It has recently established an international system of gulags in which it holds people suspected of terrorism (often innocent) and frequently uses torture to extract information in violation of international and domestic law and all human decency.
- The US has fifty million or more citizens who lack health insurance.
This list is not up for analyis or discussion, it is only here as a sort of template for the sort of thing I hope to see listed for other countries besides the US.
If all goes well, I will post another diary soon asking for input on the positive aspects and developments of the various nations of the world which are represented here and on other sites.
in case anyone is confused, I’m an expatriate American living in Italy. That’s why I focused my own criticism on the US. But I would be happy to list some of the probelms with Italy. There are quite a number. It pretty much goes on to infinity too, and I’ve only been here five years.
~ Excerpts from earlier diary ~
.
Q: Dutch Justice Well Organized & Exemplary? A: No.
by creve coeur Sun Mar 20th, 2005
A question was forwarded to me yesterday with the suggestion to put some thoughts in diary form. As most of you know, I am not the most talented writer, I myself prefer the lab setting doing research on the fundamentals before giving a comment. Reading the tips in a diary today: This Place Needs an Editor! by JaneKnowles. I for one could use a copy editor.
Luckily today’s request is about the Netherlands, a tiny country called the Low Lands, so I can keep this diary short and concise.
Dutch Justice & Law Enforcement
Involving the deaths of innocent lives.
Recent cases – see diary – an excerpt:
Solving crime is a major undertaking and shows responsibility of leadership in a city, state or country. Freedom for its citizens cannot be sustained when criminality is running rampant. That includes white collar crime, which apparently is non-existent in the Netherlands, because their standing as a tax haven seems more important.
Luckily for Dutch law enforcement, in absolute numbers, the murder rate is low. The majority of murders are in the relational sphere, where the perpetrator him-herself calls police with the message: “something serious has happened”.
Civil and Corporate Law
Largest case of corporate fraud, up to a $1bn, involving Dutch “Royal” Ahold concern. Case is still pending, and not much headway has been made in the investigation.
Delivery of basic, contaminated glycol for medicine to make cough syrup through VOS Chemie in Bodegraven, who had lab tested the glycol but left the labels unchanged. Goods originated from Sinochem, China’s largest state owned chemical trading company, who had certified the poison, diethelene glycol, as harmless pharmaceutical glycerin and sold it indiscriminately.
Vos Chemie shipped to Pharval laboratories on Haiti. Their products, two inexpensive fever syrups Valodon and Afebrile caused the deaths of more than sixty children. Dutch Justice failed to cooperate on an International basis to prosecute the Director and Buyer at VOS Chemie, a Dutch company with German affiliation. I believe in the end, Vos Chemie was probably fined that the paperwork did not meet export standards.
VOS Chemie did lab testing and forged documents, to indicate base was safe for medicine use. Pharval relied on this test, perhaps the company had no testing facility of their own available in Haiti.
International Affairs
Well known Dutch political cowardice before, during and after the Srebrenica mass murder by Serbian troops under leadership of Mladic and Karadzic. The Dutch UN forces were placed in an impossible military position to protect the enclave, surrounded by Serbian territory and troops.
In July 1995 under Serbian attack, the main concern of The Hague politicians was to get the Dutch UN forces to leave without casualties and to retreat from enclave of Srebrenica.
Men and boys over 12 were separated
Leaving behind the Bosnian civilians without any protection. During period of Dutch retreat, Mladic started the slaughter of 7 to 8000 boys, young men and able men of middle-age. Under Dutch UN supervision, women and men were separated, women were bussed to city of Tuzla to the North. The men were marched off to their execution. Reminds me of the lack of backbone of many Dutch during WWII, and the transport of too many Jews from the Amsterdam community to the extermination camps of Hitler.
The Srebrenica period and aftermath, the Dutch “Purple” coalition VVD, PvdA and D’66, was a show of inaptitude, lack of preparation and once again the failure when politicians try to run military affairs, when an armed conflict is at the level of full fledged war, with civilian lives at stake.
The military commanders did receive their promotions and medals. Where did I see that just recently, in Washington DC?
Pim Fortuyn Murder
In this same period leading up to new parliamentary elections, a political figure stands up and challenges the Dutch political establishment. In the months after the 9/11 attacks in Europe, new social conflicts and concerns with the Muslim population took hold of daily reports in newspapers and TV broadcasts. A growing sense, the Dutch had been too lenient on crime and avoided the social concerns to integrate large number of immigrants from Turkey and Marocco into Dutch society. Pim Fortuyn met that challenge as newcomer, to point to people’s concerns and problems the “Purple” administration had avoided to tackle. Without offering real solutions himself, Pim Fortuyn was seen to gain a major number of new seats in parliament.
Returning to the murder of Pim Fortuyn on May 6th, 2002. During the campaign it became clear, Fortuyn was a controversial political figure, taking a bashing from the left-wingers, animal-rights extremist groups as well as from groups involved with the integration of immigrants into the Netherlands. There were clear indications Fortuyn got death threats.
Crime Statistics
Due to privacy concerns, there are no statistics on cause of death in the Netherlands. Deaths in hospitals and medical facilities do not list the nature and circumstances of deaths. When someone at home passes away, usually a local GP is called to establish the cause of death. A conclusion of “natural cause” probably offers the least red tape and everyone is satisfied. Law enforcement does not need to be involved. Identical are the circumstances of “legal” euthanasia by doctors in the Netherlands, who often fill out forms with the conclusion “natural cause” to avoid embarrassment of a routine investigation whether all provisions of euthanasia law were met.
Oh yes, don’t bother to call in for a burglary in your home outside “office hours” of the local police. The theft of goods is usually covered by insurance, so you can come in at a convenient hour for the paper work, necessary to get the costs recovered from your insurance company. A new rule of operation by Dutch law enforcement trumps all other: “It’s not a police priority and we lack the funds and manpower”.
A recent paper on research of the Dutch police and investigations compares the efficiency with their German counterparts. For the equivalent work performance, the Germans are 100% more efficient.
Road Accidents and Deaths
Latest statistics over 2004, shows an amazing and surprising decrease of nearly 20%, from 1060 down to 870. The Dutch population is 16 million, the present Dutch government have banned radar sensors for cars, increased speed controls, banned hand-held mobile phone calls and more efficient control to diminish drinking while driving.
CONCLUSION
Asking questions or pointing to concerns of lapses in the Justice system of the Netherlands, offers by itself a starting point to realize it’s not all blue under a clear sky of a liberal place to live and work. Still work to be done – the Dutch cannot be satisfied as yet.
But other than these issues, the Netherlands belongs to my TOP 6 favorite countries to live and work!
VVD – liberals to the right in Dutch political spectrum
D’66 – liberals centrum-left
PvdA – labor party left-socialists
Wim Kok, PvdA as Prime Minister from 1994-2002
Edited: I meant to be kind to the Dutch!
A. Didn’t mention the issue on coke transport through Schiphol airport.
B. Ambiguity with immigrants, asylum seekers and their imprisonment.
C. Nor the “Bouwfraude”, immense cartel with price-fixing in the Construction and Builders Industry, costing the Dutch taxpayer 1bn during a decade.
COMPLETE DIARY WITH COMMENTS AT dKOS —
Q: Dutch Justice Well Organized & Exemplary? A: No.
by creve coeur Sun Mar 20th, 2005
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
Absolutely magificent, OUI!!!!! UMMM..the comment, I mean, not the bad news about the Netherlands (;. Thank’s for your thouhgful contribution. I would prefer that someodcy else did it, but i’m working on Italy myself.
i’ll try to tackle this monster of scandal, mistery and corruption called Italy.
substantial ties to the top organized crime families.
It is even suspected that his Party (Forza Italia) was created specifically by the mob in order to reverse the laws established during the Mani Pulite investigations,
after the legenedary Tangentopoli (Bribegate) scandals, resulted in the arrest and prosecution of almost the enire political establishement which monoplozied power for the previous 40 to 50 years (Christian Democrats and Craxi Socialists).. Berlusconi has spent the last four years doing precisly that: passing ad-personam legislation which will protect him and his corrupt business chums in Parliamnt from ever beng held responsibke for their crimes.
3) Italy has practially no conflict-of-interest laws.
Berlusconi controlls,either personally or through his family, three of the six majpr televions stations. He controols the other three through his minister of communications who exercises tight control over appointemnt and programming at the state (Berlusoni) owned RAI. He owns the soccer team AC Milam;, Mondadori, the major book publishing house in Italy; he
has intersts in several major newpapers and newsmagazines.
have the dealth penalty, most people support its reintroduction.
12)Iraq supported the war in Iraq.
ertc…
You mention the Italian immigration issue, which made me think of something. Several months back, I read an article in the Washington Post about Rome having an illegal immigration “problem”. By “problem”, I mean “the racists have their feathers ruffled”. Basically, it said that Rome has had a large influx of Chinese immigrants who would enter Romania, used the rather porous border of Hungary to enter the European Union, and then took advantage of the rather fluid EU policy on movement between member states.
What I had read was that these new immigrants were viewed as “not real Italians” (paraphrase) by not just conservative Italians, but even some left-wing Italians. Chinese Italians are somehow less than white Italians, similar to the way the American Taliban views Mexican immigrants. Discrimination is supposedly rampant against these new immigrants. And the attitude on Chinese Italians who had been there for two generations or more was just as bad.
What I wanted to ask was: Just how big are race issues in Italy? Because if what I hear is true, Italy is just as loony as America.
Excellent and astute comment as usual, DH.
The most recent trend in immigration is indeed coming from China. That’s absoutley true. But the overwhelmng majority and the most serious problems have still to do with African immigration through the island of Lampedusa.
In both cases, there is a great deal of racism and resentment from both left and right. WRT the Chinese in partcular, it’s probably more a phenomenon of the left job-protectionist labor union variety. The sentiment is that “they’re undercutting our textile industry with their sweat-shop labor over there and now they send them over here to steal our jobs.”
Yes, it’s very common and it’s very repulsive, just as it is in the US. Italy is a very fascinating sociological test case, in fact. It went, in a very short time, from being a society of emigrants to a society of immigrants. And the transition is not going altogether smoothly.
I think you have to look much deeper than at individual nations to find the source of this type of group formation and excusion behavior.
Anecdotal information:
We noticed (among relatives and friends) a general sympathy for the African immigrants coming to Italy, but concern regarding the effect on unemployment – with the usual comment being “we can’t employ enough of our own let alone these immigrants.”
However, there is/was little such sympathy for the Albanians. Several years ago, we heard from several people, in geographically diverse locations, that there was a serious rise in crime in their area due to the Albanians (said with straight faces).
Romanians (non-Roma people) seem to get a free pass – perhaps because of the language? Or because they are fellow Europeans? They come to work, send money back to their families, and go back to visit their home country – replicating the experience of Italians in France, Belgium, and later Germany, after WW2.
Is there still prejudice against the Albanians, and have they been able to integrate into Italian society? How are the Muslim immigrants perceived?
Because of the low Italian birth rate, I would think that they are going to have to face the question of immigration fairly soon. Unless most of Italian industry will be shifted offshore, following our glorious example.
I can only base myself primarily on anecotal evdience as well. I haven’t seen any recent scientific polls taken on Italian attitudes to the various group, but I think you’re about right.
Most of the really hard-core anti-immigration and racit sentiment as manifested in the Northen League and, more recently, in an extremist neo-Nazi offshoot of Natioal Alliance called “Forza Nuova” is fundamentally anti-Albanian as well as profoundly anti-Muslim. However, as most Muslims here are obviously of African origin that translates into anti-African. They’re pretty much synonymous. This phenonenom is certainly not exclusive to the north. The irrational paranoia about Muslims “taking over” and threatening the Italian Catholic traditions ad symbolism is very strong in the south as well.
I don’t hear much about Romanians. Perhaps they’re not considered “extra-communitarians” (i.e. otside of the EU which use to be called the EC or European COMMUNITY) anymore or something(;
Anti-Islam is very profound indeed. I’m glad you bright that upm in fact. It mught be worse here than in the States!!becaseu it is to large extent fostred by ignorant local priests who semrmonize weekly about the persecution of Chritians in the Muslim world, the horrible tranformation of Italian society away from Catholtism because of the low-birth rate, the Islamiztionation of Europe through “forced” conversion by marriage and adoption,etc…
The worst racism and xenophobia in Greece is reserved for the Albanians, possibly because there are so many of them and because of the details of how the Albanian ‘communist’ regime collapsed.
When the borders were opened on the Albanian side some 15 years ago, the first wave through were mainly released prisoners, who caused a crime wave and brought disrepute on all the hardworking Albanian economic migrants who followed. Albania is also probably the most backward country in Europe, having only acquired a written language within the last century and a half.
Romanians are also viewed with great suspicion (possibly because of some high profile crimes carried out by Romanians in Greece) whereas the Poles are accorded real respect having a reputation as hardworking, honest and skilled laborers. Interestingly, there seems to be little animosity towards black Africans.
I suspect that the same causes of anti-Albanianism that you have identified for Greece are also at work in Italy.
There’s much talk about Albanian and Balkan crime. I guess Cosa Nostra(Sicily), la Cammorra (Naples and surroundings) and ‘Ndrangeta (Calabria) don’t enjoy having their monopoly domination of the underground world challenged by foriegn competition. Protectionists!!
I know!! No, you don’t have to type up a list of ten or eleven defects, just leave short list of 3 or 4 major crticisms if that will simplify things.
Unlike Oui and Gilgamesh, I won’t produce an exhaustive list, but here are my “big 3” of things I think are wrong in/with Germany:
1. Education
The Programme for International Student Assessment (2001, 2003) found the following deficits in German education, here as summarized by Klaus Feldmann of the University of Hannover (translations my own):
Performance in all categories is below that of the United States – in spite of the vastly greater disparities in resources, curricula and student backgrounds of the latter.
The public discussion has identified additional deficits, including:
Currently, the best predictor of success in higher education is family background: if your parents didn’t go to university, you probably won’t either.
IMO, the problem is one of adherence to outdated dogma that amounts to cognitive dissonance.
2. Nationality and citizenship
Until modernized by the current SPD/Green government, German law postulates that citizenship derives solely from “blood” or origin (“ius sanguis”) rather than from the place of birh. (This explains why Russians whose forefathers migrated to the Volga in the 17th century are frequently eligible for German citizenship). Even today, native-born children of foreign-born parents are automatically eligible, but still must apply.
Even today the wingnuts get all wound up about the “high” proportion of foreigners (around 6.5% nationwide, greater in urban areas) and proclaim at the top of their hysterical voices that “Germany is not a land of immigration”. Now on account of the current low birthrate of 1.4 children per women, a net immigration of 200,000 per year is required if the decline of the German population is to remain moderate (i.e. from 82.5 million now to 75 million in 2050 according to Germany’s Federal Statistical Office. Cognitive dissonance strikes again.
Lastly,
3. Right-wing extremists
In recent elections in the state of Saxony, Germany’s extreme right-wing NPD party (and they are as extreme as they can get without being banned) won over 5% of the vote, entitling them to seats in that state’s parliament. And unfortunately, unlike wingnuts of past eras, these characters are politically astute. (As an aside, they’re big on racism – no surprise, except “foreigners” make up only about 2.5 percent of the population in those parts.)
I could think of more, but this will do.
Very informative, especially on education. There’s much that I dinìt know about. thank you..
.
I was searching for a good political map.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
We are equal to the US in energy consumption.
(measured per capita)
We consume 3 times the energy that Italy consumes.
AND
The BC government encourages trophy hunting.
That “sport” takes the best of the breed of
bear, mountain goat, big horn sheep etc. which
decimates the good gene pool of each species.
– The country that gave you Hitler (and other Nazi high command) and population agreed to the Anschluß
– The country that gave you Arnold
– Very racist towards the Roma
– Unfair treatment and inequality of “guest workers” (mostly Turks)
– proud owner of the most sexist institutions in the western hemisphere; The Vienna Philharmonic and The Spanish Riding School
– though not holding a candle to Britain or Italy, we too have soccer hooligans
– privatized postal service
– high cost of living
– great contributer to The 30 Years war
– Greatly responsible for WWI
– Neo-Nazi party (FPÖ) has high membership
– unemployment rather high
– separation of Church and State dubious: religion is taught in classrooms, however State won’t recognize Church marriage
and while I’m brainstorming – they treated Mozart like shit
Crimes, Defects and Failings of Greece
Greece is both incredibly ancient and quite new. Four-thousand year-old Minoan plumbing would seem advanced to the British today.
March 25, 1821 marks Independence Day in Greece. The actual war ended some nine years later. It is customary among modern Greeks to blame the four centuries of Ottoman Turkish Occupation for all the ills of the Greek state and polity. Couple this with the pride of being the descendants of the people who ‘invented’ “Western Civilization” and were pretty instrumental in transferring Christianity to the West, and you get a prickly, proud and perplexing people.
Greeks mistrust authority and the feeling is mutual. They have been nurturing a sense victimhood which clashes horribly with their pride.
The country is not guilty of major crimes recently. Faults and defects, it has many. In many ways it is still more of a rich Third World country than a poor First World country.
More soon, it’s late.
…and four thousand year old Minoan women’s fashion would seem…?
Aside from it being impossible to get a taxi to take you to where you want to go, unless you know the cabbies brother, have various bribes obviously displayed or jump on the roof and hang on – I love Greece, it’s history, culture and people.
Spent a lot of time in Turkey as well – beautiful country (and no problem with cabs). Relations between Greece and Turkey do not seem as bad as between say, Armenia and Azerbaijan. (My husbands family is originally from Smyrna – they escaped to Kythera.)
Four thousand year old Minoan women’s fashion would not seem out of place on the catwalks of Milan. I’d love to see it make a comeback : )
Greece is easy to both love and hate, often at the same time. The country is infuriating and entrancing.
Relations with Turkey are tricky because there are at least three Turkeys: The Turkey of the generals who seem determined to provoke and inflame by flying their warplanes over Greek islands and sailing their warships into disputed areas; the Turkey of the government which seems to want to improve relations and economic ties and the Turkey of the actual Turks, who seem to realize that the two peoples are united by more history and blood and culture than they are divided by religion and nationalism.
Does your husband’s family still have a foothold on the island? My brother is building a house there.
Yes men do tend to like that fashion, I must say it appears a tad uncomfortable.
Yes all over the South of the island actually. Several olive and almond orchards – the best oil – I think most are being rented out since nobody farms anymore (Athenian winters). A house in Hora, another in Livadi and a shack in one of the orchards just outside Kapsali. I love that island. Whereabouts is your brother building?
Livadi. How often do you get to go?
Small world. Not nearly enough these days – before every 2-3 years. Haven’t been there since we started our own business about 5 years ago. We had made plans to go this year, but unfortunately we have a large contract coming up that can’t be avoided and with a child in school we’re limited to our travel times – and then there’s next year. Thinking about retiring there as our base.
What do you do there? You’re in Athens I assume…
I’m thinking about the food….
I’ve only been a couple of times to see my brother’s plot of land and explore the island but I imagine that as of this fall when the house will be ready that I’ll be going regularly.
It’s really nice because his best friend has a house nearby and thus there is an entire community of people both local and expats that we plug into.
It can be kind of hard to get to, especially in winter. Hope to see you there next year then.
I’m really just learning about the state of politics here…which operates much like the California citizen initiatives…something that I, as an expat California, distrust (eg., Arnold, anti-Immigrant initiatives, etc.). Anyway, Switzerland consists of 26 “Kantons”, and Kantons operate very independently throughout the country from the Federal government. On June 5th there will be a big vote here on whether the whole country 1. wants to adopt the Dublin & Shengen agreements of the EU, and 2. whether to allow a form of Gay/Lesbian marriage. But on the local level, here in St. Gallen, I was startled to hear from my wife, an attempt on the local ballot to 1. give the police more power to move along/detain/arrest anyone who appears to be a public hazard (aimed at the local punks, it seems to me, who hang out and panhandle, but otherwise are mellow), AND also will not allow anyone in any gathering (protest, or whatever) to march and cover their face. These both seem to me to be violations of civil liberties, giving the police a lot more power than they should have. Worrisome. I only hope that the Swiss voter, especially on these local issues, have a sense about civil liberties, and just don’t go along with decisions because the authorities want it. We will soon see. Any Swiss Nationals out there who can commnet further (and more authoritatively? Especially about the Federal issues?)
gotta catch some ZZZZs….I’ll try to respond to comment tommoroer morning..