That’d be a hell of a precedent. The Chicago Sun-Times, via the AP, has the story which, oddly, doesn’t seem to have “legs” so far:
VATICAN CITY — Lawyers for Pope Benedict XVI have asked President Bush to declare the pontiff immune from liability in a lawsuit that accuses him of conspiring to cover up the molestation of three boys by a seminarian in Texas, court records show.
The Vatican’s embassy in Washington sent a diplomatic memo to the State Department on May 20 requesting the U.S. government grant the pope immunity because he is a head of state, according to a May 26 motion submitted by the pope’s lawyers in U.S. District Court for the Southern Division of Texas in Houston.
Joseph Ratzinger is named as a defendant in the civil lawsuit. Now Benedict XVI, he’s accused of conspiring with the Archdiocese of Galveston-Houston to cover up the abuse during the mid-1990s. … MORE BELOW:
Amy Goodman summarizes the story in today’s Democracy Now!:
Pope’s Lawyers Ask Bush for Immunity in Molestation Case
Pope Benedict the 16th is in his native Germany for the biggest worldwide gathering of Catholics since the funeral of his predecessor Pope John Paul II. More than 400,000 young Catholics from nearly 200 countries welcomed the new pope to the Catholic stronghold of Cologne for World Youth Day.But as he receives a warm welcome there, he faces serious charges in the United States. Lawyers for the Pope have asked President Bush to declare the pontiff immune from liability in a lawsuit that accuses him of conspiring to cover up the molestation of three boys by a seminarian in Texas. According to The Chicago Sun Times, the Vatican’s embassy in Washington sent a diplomatic memo to the State Department on May 20 requesting the U.S. government grant the pope immunity because he is a head of state. A State Department spokesperson said this week that the pope is considered a head of state and automatically has diplomatic immunity.
Sheesh.
OH GAWD! What great comments … ‘specially #2.
And if he gives the Pope immunity, what’s to stop him from giving god knows who else immunity … like Karl and Scooter and all …
Re number 2: It sounds like the pope is asking for government approval of his prior transgressions, rather than forgiveness…
AMEN, sister!
P.S. What Would Jesus Do?
I’m thinking Jesus would have gotten those abusive priests away from children, instead of moving them to new parishes with new victims and unsuspecting parents, how about you?
And Ratzinger is supposed to set a moral example for the world?
I feel bad for good Catholics everywhere.
I’m thinking Jesus would have gotten those abusive priests away from children, instead of moving them to new parishes with new victims and unsuspecting parents, how about you?
Duh. Like, HELLLLOOO! Damn straight.
Now if a heathen like me knows that, why can’t the religious folks get it?
I’ll be so pissed when King George puts his blessing on the Pope’s behavior and the Christian right sings his praises for doing so…you know it’s gonna happen.
Oh kewl … I’m a heathen too.
P.S. A close relative told me recently that he has HIS RELIGION to ease his suffering in times of tribulation … implying I am missing that component. I said something snarky. I forget now. What a pompous thing to say. Relatives … you know …
But the bigger point is that being religious quite obviously does NOT give one any more moral authority than anyone else, and it certainly is not the path, for many, to more moral behavior.
a goddamn co*ksucking heathen? I thought I heard someone accuse you of that…
Chill it, dude or I’ll start callin’ you a frog-faced f–k again!
I’m also a Heathen high fives
I personally think they’re going to be as mum as they can get away with on this one. That’s just a gut reaction of mine and it can so easily be wrong, but i just get the vibe that they aren’t going to want to advertise their stance on this too much. (what Blogostan wants and does I have no idea)
(though I’m not a Catholic either)…but I’m tired of seeing Christianity dragged through the mud. From the Religious Reich that preaches nothing other than hate and fear, to corrupt “men of God” who abuse their authority, to the self-righteous who claim to know who God has blessed (the rich) and who He has cursed (the poor)…the true message of Christ, who came that we might have Life and have it more abundantly, who looked at the self-righteous of his time and poked holes in their puffery, His message is being lost.
It’s said that Christ created the Perfect Church…but then people had to get involve and screw up everything.
Here’s a message from the Catholic Church’s purported Leader as to how He would view these incidents:
5 “And whoso shall receive one such little child in my name receiveth me.
6 “But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
7 “Woe unto the world because of offences! for it must needs be that offences come; but woe to that man by whom the offence cometh!”
(Matt. 18:5-7, KJV)
I wouldn’t mind having the millstone concession in the Catholic Church about now…
Here endeth the sermon…
Forgive me for this; but this pope is dragging the name Ratzinger through the mud 🙁
That pretty much says it all, doesn’t it?
My God, these people are evil. They want the right to destroy lives with total impunity. Well, we all know how Bush feels about accountability amongst the powerful. He’ll probably grant it. Then, can we all admit that the Catholic hierarchy and the Bush Administration is made up of frauds and hypocrites, who would surely burn in hell, if it existed?
to snark this one.
..for a bigger cowboy hat and a size larger jeans, to accomdate the swelled head and excitement of being asked to PARDON A POPE!
Diplomatic immunity for a molestation??? That just chaps me! Do they also give diplomatic immunity for killers?
What a load of crap. If that’s the case it’s high time they revised those idiotic immunities.
Yes, as near as I can tell, diplomatic immunity covers murder. However, in such serious cases the country of the diplomat will generally waive immunity. Obviously, that’d be unlikely in this case.
I am not a lawyer.
Anybody out there have a professional opinion?
One of the things that puzzles me about this is why they’re asking Bush for immunity if — as the State Dept spokesperson claims — “the pope is considered a head of state and automatically has diplomatic immunity.”
Also, does diplomatic immunity cover crimes (allegedly) committed before having the status?
As an aside, as arrogant as the Bush League is, they’re going to have to handle this carefully. They do not want to come off as being lenient with people who may have aided and abetted child molesters.
As an aside, as arrogant as the Bush League is, they’re going to have to handle this carefully. They do not want to come off as being lenient with people who may have aided and abetted child molesters.
Especially since the core of Bush’s support are low-church protestants embedded in the “Whore of Babylon” mindset.
And now let’s add:
The amusing part is this is coming during a time the GOP is trying to get Pope-worshipping conservative Catholics to become part of the GOP coalition.
is the Panama fiasco.
Remember when Bush 41 invaded and arrested Manuel Noriega for drug charges. He was the head of state.
… to grant immunity from civil liability. That possibility is alien to the doctrine of separation of powers.
Even blanket immunity from criminal prosecution absent specific criminal charges is dubious. It’s been done (for political crimes such as Nixon’s and the Iran-Contra scandal), but it’s not completely clear that it’s constitutional to do so. It’s conceivable such a pardon might not stand if challenged.
But for civil liability the law is crystal clear: the president’s power to interfere or immunize anyone in a civil case is absolute zero.
The Pope is clearly projecting his fantasies of absolute power and unaccountability to the public onto the American system. But he’s SOL on this one.
The case, Doe v. Roman Catholic Diocese of Galveston-Houston, is filed in the Southern District of Texas, docket number H-4:05-cv-01047. From various papers submitted on Ratzinger’s behalf, these are the legal arguments:
According to the most recent status report, filed with the court on July 26, the parties are still awaiting the decision from the State Department regarding the suggestion of immunity. This is what the “Pope asks Bush for immunity” statements are all about.
I cross-posted this at DKos after checking and seeing that no one else had diaried it … but now I can’t get to DKos.
It was very, very slow when I was posting my story. I’ve been trying to edit my story for the last 10 minutes, but I get no response from the Kos server. Is it dead?
DKos is back now .. LINK to diary
that they are asking for immunity/pardon, because in effect it is a pardon, is he has no immunity under the diplomatic act granting immunity, because these were prior acts to his becoming the head of state.
That these Criminal organizations of Bushco’s administration and the heirarchy of the Catholic Church continue to conspire together to infringe covertly upon the rights of all the citizens of the world is reprehensible.
Ratz the pope must be adjudged in a court of law for his culpability in these heinous crimes against children.
Good commentary.
This is incredibly bad for the church (if he did do those things). It taints the papacy, because theres no way he can be an intermediary for God and that means that he isn’t really a pope.
So, would it be in the interest of the Church to expell him before he irreparably tarnishes the Catholic faith? Not to open any boxes, Pandoric or otherwise, but what he stands accused of doing (and trying to weasel out of) is horrific….
… and is anyone else bemused much by the idea that the google ads are hawking Papal bracelets, tee-shirts, and books?
I especially found amusing the one about “Free to Join. 1000’s of pictures of Beautiful Catholic Singles.”
Like Booman, I can’t begin to trust myself to snark this one; it might turn into a MSOC-type rant…
ROTFLMAO
I can never call this one Pope… he will always be Ratzinger to me… a mere evil mortal.
Many of my liberal Catholic friends and I call him Pope Been a Dick!
As a Catholic I remember that popes are human beings – not God – and as such several in the past have hardly been saints! So what’s new?
The current pope is repulsive!
Bush has been a dick to Cindy Sheehan! One dick granting immunity to another! Sorry!
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Ratzinger of Child Molestation :: Some Fact Checking – Please?
Those seeking civil lawsuits – in which they are fully justified and more so – have done all to get media attention these past years. These articles by the Chicago Sun-Times are boulevard press quality, not news fact checking.
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Houston Voice Online April 29, 2005 — The letter in question, written in 2001, was sent to bishops of the Catholic Church and says, “cases of this kind are subject to the pontifical secret.”
The attorney for the plaintiffs is arguing that “pontifical secret” means that the bishops were being told not to tell anyone about cases of child sex abuse that were brought to their attention.
Officials of the Archdiocese of Galveston-Houston have argued that “pontifical secret” refers to matters within the church and not to whether or not a pedophile priest would be reported to authorities.
Does anyone have a different story on the pope being involved – or is this a Rovian distraction for the MSM?
~~~
Susan, I just accidentally came across your cross posting of this diary on dkos. I wish you would let us know when you do that… I like to skip on over ASAP and recommend. The same goes for BooMan.
By the way, Ratzinger nauseates me.
Oh like WOW !
I must thank you for posting this article, when I read it, I simply burst into uncontrolable laughter, I found it so difficult to even type this post, still laughin so hard.
The IRONY of it all .LOL.