The problem at abu Ghraib was not some rogue reservists who stepped out of line. The problem was either a failure of command and control – or it was a specific policy by the Bush/Rumsfeld administration being carried out. I said that when the abu Ghraib pictures came out, and this report strongly demonstrates the truth of that statement. How can Americans be acting this way?
From the LA Times:
When Army Capt. Ian Fishback told his company and battalion commanders that soldiers were abusing Iraqi prisoners in violation of the Geneva Convention, he says, they told him those rules were easily skirted.
When he wrote a memo saying Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld was wrong in telling Congress that the Army follows the Geneva dictates, his lieutenant colonel responded only: “I am aware of Fishback’s concerns.”
And when Fishback found himself in the same room as Secretary of the Army Francis J. Harvey at Ft. Benning, Ga., he again complained about prisoner abuse. He said Harvey told him that “corrective action was already taken.”
At every turn, it seemed, the decorated young West Point graduate, the son of a Vietnam War veteran from Michigan’s Upper Peninsula, whose wife is serving with the Army in Iraq, felt that the military had shut him out.
The reports show that the same thing is happening in a lot more places than in just one military prison. That shows it is either policy or it is being condoned by the commanders.
Billmon wrote about it yesterday.
There was a time when I would have argued that the American people couldn’t stomach that kind of butchery — not for long anyway — even if their political leaders were willing to inflict it. But now I’m not so sure. As a nation, we may be so desensitized to violence, and so inured to mechanized carnage on a grand scale, that we’re psychologically capable of tolerating genocidal warfare against any one who can successfully be labeled as a “terrorist.” Or at least, a sizable enough fraction of the America public may be willing to tolerate it, or applaud it, to make the costs politically bearable.
Many Americans ask how the German people could accept the Nazi Final Solution without speaking out. Perhaps, looking at what some Americans are willing to do to Muslim prisoners, that question will be a little easier to answer. You fear speaking out, harden your heart and just look away – if you don’t join them.
Those decisions don’t seem much more difficult for a lot of people than for a tobacco executive to deny that cigarettes cause cancer in front of a Senate Committee.
Pogo: We have seen the enemy, and he is us.
I long wondered how the German people could have accepted the excesses of Hitler and the Final Solution. I do not accept that Hitler was a diabolical freak who grew out of the horrors of WW I and could not be duplicated. What kinds of people could do those things?
The events reported by Capt. Fishback and the abu Ghraib pictures tell us pretty clearly what kinds of people could do them. Most of us – with a few crazies mixed in to lead the way.
If you haven’t seen it yet, rent “Downfall.” It is a docudrama about Hitler’s last 10 days in the bunker in Berlin as the Russians close in. The movie is outstanding. You won’t even mind that it is in German with subtitles.
I absolutely believe this is now official policy..if Gonzales can state in a memo that the Geneva Conventions rules are ‘quaint’ then it’s obvious bushco has completely abandoned those rules. And ignored the repeated guidelines by the military that have said over/over that torture does not work.
And if torture did work then why wouldn’t all the torture being done have already gotten information on all the ‘insurgents’ and we’d have rounded them all up and everything would be going swell over in Iraq…but funny things are just getting worse and worse. Why is that? Maybe because these stories of torture are known far and wide by the Iraqi people and making more/more of them become ‘insurgents’, to get rid of their occupiers and torturers.
Some one tell me just what is the difference between the good guys torturing and the bad guys torturing? Particularly when it seems so many of the Iraqi’s that are rounded up and end up in these prisons are not insurgents but regular Iraqi’s simply swept up by our troops just ‘because’.
I’ve often wondered how so many German people allowed Hitler to carry out his plans or why they said after the war they didn’t know what he was doing. Well right now Americans are learning what we are doing as witnessed by that last round of photo’s and the response to that was pretty shocking as so many Americans seemed to think it either justified or didn’t even constitute abuse much less torture.
That what was really frightening and horrifying to me-the acceptance that these actions by our military are ok and condoned by so many Americans. Noble cause indeed.
Those anti-Semitic Germans were saying that exactly like so many racists in America these days say they are not racist. Since it is not socially acceptable to be racist we have in essence driven it underground. The same thing will happen again when our troops come home.