by Jane Hamsher
Len Downie appeared with Howard Kurtz this morning on CNN (Crooks and Liars has the video). It was the first time I heard anyone mention the exact date Bob Woodward came forward and told Downie about his role in TraitorGate: October 24, 2005 according to Downie.
Now, as Woodward told Time Magazine:
In the final weeks before the grand jury indicted vice presidential aide I. Lewis (“Scooter”) Libby on Oct. 28 for perjury and obstruction of justice, Woodward says he was asked by Downie to help report on the status of the probe.In the course of his reporting, Woodward says, “I learned something more” about the disclosure of Plame’s identity, which prompted him to admit to Downie for the first time that he had been told of Plameβs CIA job by a senior administration official in mid June 2003.
Well of course in Bob’s version of just about anything it’s All About Bob. But what are the odds that this “revelation” didn’t come as the result of Bob’s incredible sleuthing, but in fact was related to what was happening in the news? So I decided to go back to October 24 and take a look at what happened on that day, and I went “oh my word…”
From the NYT:
Cheney Told Aide of C.I.A. Officer, Notes Show
By DAVID JOHNSTON, RICHARD W. STEVENSON and DOUGLAS JEHL
Published: October 24, 2005
WASHINGTON, Oct. 24 – I. Lewis Libby Jr., Vice President Dick Cheney’s chief of staff, first learned about the C.I.A. officer at the heart of the leak investigation in a conversation with Mr. Cheney weeks before her identity became public in 2003, lawyers involved in the case said Monday.
It was a bombshell that shook everyone, the first indication the public had that there was hard evidence that this whole thing led back to the Vice President.
It appeared online on Sunday night, October 23, for the Monday edition of the NYT. Oh was there some celebrating in blogtopia that night, remember?
Then on Monday, Woodward says to Downie, “uh, Len, I think we need to talk…”
Big coindicence? Sure doesn’t feel like one. Seems more like Bob suddenly realized Fitzgerald was on the hunt for the Veep, and if it came out that Mr. Big Swinging Journalist had known all along and was ratholing a huge story to protect the administration, he could just kiss his sweet Pulitzers goodbye. Sure Bob is willing to keep a secret for 30 years when it accrues to his benefit, but to risk this kind of professional humiliation and be scooped by some scrappy Irish prosecutor? Not bloody likely.
The Times article was the first to reveal that Cheney told Libby on June 12, 2003 that Joe Wilson’s wife worked at the CIA. It was during this time that Woodward was doing interviews for Plan of Attack (which I finally realized I am going to have to read, so I bought it on Amazon last night for 35 cents, and I figure that’s just about right). Woodward has said that the topic came up in “casual” conversation, and “he did not believe the information to be classified or sensitive.”
If Bob wants to claim that somebody mentioned this to him “casually,” that’s fine. I’m sure Bob believes this. All this says to me is that Bob got played like a two dollar banjo.
One does not mention something like this to the biggest investigative journalist in the world “casually,” especially in the midst of a concerted effort. The notion that this was all just “idle chatter” is absurd. There was a coordinated, tag-team effort in place to make sure that everyone who got a leak also got a confirming source. Matt Cooper heard it from Rove one day and Libby confirmed it the next. Rove’s email to Hadley indicates that Hadley may have been some sort of point man for the “plot against Wilson” (Judge Tatel’s words, not mine).
What other evidence points to Cheney? Well the Washington Post has said that Woodward’s source has indeed testified in the investigation, but Adam Entous of Reuters says that “Mr. X” has not appeared before the grand jury.
If both facts are true, then anyone known to have appeared before the grand jury is “off” the suspect list.
The only two people who are known to have testified in the case, but not before the grand jury, are Richard B. Cheney and George W. Bush.
There are, of course, other possibilities. And right now the two other prime suspects are Stephen Hadley and Richard Armitage.
Up until the summer of 2004 people who testifying before they grand jury were often brought up in some secret back elevator to avoid press scrutiny, and I suppose that’s how they wheeled in Novak’s coffin undetected. But around that time Judge Hogan ruled that everyone who appeared before the gj had to walk in the front door (and wouldn’t I love to to know the series of events leading up to that). Anyway, from that point on it pretty much guaranteed that if someone was having an official Fitz gj interlude, the press knew about it.
Rove’s memo to Hadley about his conversation with Matt Cooper didn’t materialize until early in 2005. The NYT indicates that Hadley is “known to have been interviewed by investigators,” but nothing more. If he was questioned about the Rove email, it’s hard to imagine he appeared before the grand jury in the process — at this point it would be like trying to sneak in to Fort Knox and hoping nobody noticed.
Then there’s Richard Armitage, whom Michael Isikoff helpfully points the finger at in Newsweek this morning. Armitage is certainly reputed to be someone that Woodward spoke to extensively in the past, and he was part of the chain of events that led to putting the INR memo (which contained info on Valerie Wilson as part of a discussion of the Niger uranium claims) into Colin Powell’s hands.
But in June of 2003, Armitage and Powell were traveling when the document was prepared at the direction of Carl Ford, head of INR. Marc Grossman was Undersecretary of State and in charge of the department while Powell and Armitage were gone, and it was Grossman who finally told Libby that Wilson’s wife worked at the CIA on June 11 or 12 according to the indictment.
By one account in an LA Times article by Tom Hamburger and Sonni Efron, Armitage called Ford after the June 12 Walter Pincus story in the WaPo made reference to Niger Uranium and wanted to know what was up, so Ford forwarded him a copy of the INR memo.
But by other accounts, Armitage doesn’t enter the picture until after Wilson’s op-ed piece in the NYT on July 6, 2003. He thereafter called Ford and requested that Colin Powell be provided with information about Wilson, thus the INR memo was faxed to the White House for delivery to Powell on Air Force One. Due to the fact that Armitage is unfortunately out of the country and just about the only one of the major players not to have issued a denial, coupled with the fact that he is a Powell loyalist and not known to have been questioned by anyone up to this point, it has made him the right wing suspect of choice.
This isn’t like Watergate, in that Bob Woodward doesn’t have the loyalty and/or trust for Len Downie he felt toward Ben Bradlee, in whom he confided the identity of Deep Throat. It also isn’t like the Judy Miller affair, because the NYT decided that the release her source gave allowing her to testify also allowed them to print his name, which they did.
The Post has decided their loyalty is to keeping Bob Woodward’s personal secret, and Bob Woodward has decided his loyalty sure ain’t to the Post. Regardless, too many people are on the hunt for the identity of “Mr. X.,” and since Libby’s lawyers have loudly announced that this will play a big part in his defense we will probably all know his secret a whole lot sooner than 30 years.
Personally, I’ve got a side bet on Big Time in the pantry with the candlestick. But as the curtain rises inch by inch on the dirty little drama being played out in the BushCo. drawing room, one thing’s for certain — nobody is “wrapping up” anything anytime soon.
(cross-posted at firedoglake)
PS: Best wishes to Susan and her family during this time. Our thoughts and prayers are with you.
Front page here? I read your stuff often, and opening Firefox to my homepage was a pleasant surprise!
Welcome to the Booman Tribune Jane Hamsher! Don’t know if this is a guest thing, or if I missed another announcement… But welcome anyways. π
Now I should actually go back and read the diary, huh? lmao
CTMan, see this diary:
http://www.boomantribune.com/story/2005/11/20/17742/360
Thanks MLK,
I saw the diary below afterwards…
I feel for susan.
I was just honestly surprised (and a little pleased) when I saw the top of the frontpage and had to make a quick “asdf” comment before I even read the diary.
Thanks, Connecticut Man1. I’m guesting for Susan while she’s with her family after her mom passed away. My pleasure to be here.
Lately many of the links or quotes on other blogs all seem to lead back to your blog. Mighty rightous of you to jump in like this given the situation.
In case no one has mentioned it to you yet, the Froggy Bottom Cafe is over on the right of your screen about 3 times per day. Feel free to stop in and check it out if you ever have the time to just talk about “whatever”.
Welcome Jane.
I’m a big lurker over at firedoglake. You all rock!
Welcome to the frog pond. I’m sure you’ll fit right in.
Thanks for the welcome. Good to be at the frog pond.
.
It’s great to find you here.
Thanks for your support, much appreciated. Great writing!
Frogs Go Silent …
Why did Ashcroft cloak the statue of Justice?
“Treason doth never prosper: what’s the reason?
For if it prosper, none dare call it treason.”
▼▼▼ READ MY DIARY
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I got to catch some sleep! See you all after breakfast – pleasant evening.
“Treason doth never prosper: what’s the reason?
For if it prosper, none dare call it treason.”
▼▼▼ READ MY DIARY
Thank you, Oui. Get some sleep!
Good work Jane. Excellent stuff.
Larry Johnson
Thanks, Larry. You’re my hero π
A most hearty welcome…very pleased to see you here. Hopefully, some of your compatriots will see fit to join in as well.
Peace
We all love the Booman.
Excited to see you posting here at BT, and looking forward to more!
Thanks, Olivia. Much appreciated.
Jane, let me add my welcome to the chorus. I love your site – I’m a regular lurker there. And I have your book too!
Given that it doesn’t yet seem to be irrefutably clear that Mr.”X” has not testified before the gj, as much as I’d like to see Cheney in shackles and leg irons, I’ll reserve judgement on who Woodward’s source might be.
I speculate however that David Wurmser would be a very likely candidate, especially if reports are true that he has been “cooperating” with Fitzgerald. Wurmser is a diehard neocon shitbird, but unlike Libby, I doubt he’d take a hit for Cheney. However, I wouldn’t be surprised if he said he told Woodward about Plame and says that Cheney “suggested” he do so.
.
Mr. X Is David Wurmser ME Advisor to VP Cheney ¶ Link to ISA John Bolton
“Treason doth never prosper: what’s the reason?
For if it prosper, none dare call it treason.”
▼ ▼ ▼ MY DIARY
Wurmser, definitely possible. I’ve kind of ruled out Wurmser because he’s never mentioned in Plan of Attack and the NYT indicated (I think) that Woodward’s source was someone he talked to extensively. Also, I don’t know that Wurmser qualifies as a “senior administration official.” But people play rather fast and furious with that title, so anything’s possible.
Given the terrible reputation the NYT and WAPo have for truth and accuracy, I never take what they say at face value, so whether the assertion that Mr.X has testified or not remains ambiguous to me.
There’s little doubt that Cheney is the chief player in this whole affair, but I just don’t see him using his own voice to do the outing. Even if he trusted Woodward, (an idea I find laughable given the nature of both he and Woodward), I still think he would have deployed someone else to commit the actual crime.
On another note, welcome! I find myself going to your site almost daily, but usuallyas a result of links from other places sending me there. I’m now going to make it a point to visit your blog directly and regularly everyday.
Thanks, sbj. Look forward to seeing you there.
and full of interesting details. I had never heard this one before, for instance:
Up until the summer of 2004 people who testifying before they grand jury were often brought up in some secret back elevator to avoid press scrutiny, and I suppose that’s how they wheeled in Novak’s coffin undetected. But around that time Judge Hogan ruled that everyone who appeared before the gj had to walk in the front door
I really want to know who brought the motion that resulted in that ruling!
I too hope it’s big time.
You and me both, Emma Anne! Probably whoever got tired of lugging Novak’s supply of virgin’s blood on the freight elevator.
I’d like to echo the happiness at seeing you here as a FP guest.
All kind thoughts also to Susan.
And as always, smart, experienced, and influential commentary from Jane and Redd, as well as a cadre of amazing commenters over at FDL, as well as here.
Thanks for helping me get 20% less done at work! Oh.
Gotta go, baby’s crying!
Thanks for the welcome. Best of luck with the baby, Redd has that same thing going on too, I have only big dogs.
Welcome to the pond and thanks for a very interesting diary!
Make sure you post a picture of the dogs on the dog blogging thread on Thursday (I think that’s when it is).
Wow …!
My favorite living woman blogger is SPLASHING in the pond. Sometimes … I think you’re channeling Hemingway’s anima …. sometimes Janis Joplin’s animus. Or is it Toulouse-Lautrec’s dog Lac du Feu speaking through you .. ?
Jeeeesh Jane .. I surrender …. I simply like you better’n licorice.
Wow thanks so much, I’m blushing.. I cite my early influence as Erma Bombeck.
Cheney was of course the obvious choice all along as he and Woodward share a special bond… and Woodward called him a “dark horse” (pun intended?) for 2008…
Original link isn’t working so I’m linking to RI for the quote.
rigorousintuition.blogspot.com :
A trial balloon for a Cheney for President run in 2008 is being launched by a surprising source, Washington Post star reporter (and White House insider) Bob Woodward.
Appearing on Chris Matthews’ NBC talk show on Sunday, Woodward labeled Vice President Cheney “a serious dark horse candidate.” He said that with “a number of people” going for the GOP nomination, “a guy named George Bush might come out and say ‘What about Dick?'”
Woodward observed that “there’s a serious vacuum right now,” with Senators Frist, Brownback, and Allen leading the field, some say.
There may be a precedent for this. Cheney, who was put in charge of finding a suitable VP candidate in 2000, ended up getting the nod himself.
Good link, I remember that – Woodward’s been pimping for Cheney for a while.
yeah, I remember reading that at the time and saying “huh”?? Darth Cheney, with all his health problems, is the dark horse for 2008??
Which undisclosed location would he be running from?
π
Okay that one made me laugh π
i must run for the bathroom at the thought of anyone promoting Cheney for Pres.
Cool.
Jane Hamsher, blogger extraordinaire.
Vast experience writing about crying babies who have pooped in their pants.
She also has a toddler — IIRC.
No that’s Redd who has the toddler. I just have dogs who crap with impunity when the mood strikes them and piss all over anything green, ergo my experience.
Welcome again, Jane! (After gushing in the other thread, I’ll refrain here π
Ain’t that the truth. The poor press actually thinks its smarter than the guys they’re covering. Its kind of ironic in Woodward’s case, since he made his career and reputation by being led by the nose through the Watergate scandal. After all, the ‘greatest press scoop in the universe’ was basically Mark Felt feeding them leads to follow, when you peel back the layers and pulitizers — regardless of the ‘goodness’ of the outcome, or motives of those involved.
Maybe one of the side effects of this whole thing will be the greatly overdue lesson to the press that things like ‘gossip’ and ‘coincidences’ are just one more way they’re played and manipulated on a daily basis.
Sure the Truth needs sources — but sometimes it pays to take a look at not only the ‘confirmability’ of the news, but also its actual newsworthiness, and the effects and benefits of the story on those ‘confidential sources’ vs the public.
Yeah truthfully, politics aside, I’ve always felt Woodward was kind of a dunce (the words “lucky bastard” always come to mind). I can well believe he sat there and bought the whole thing as casual conversation — and then because nobody underlined it for him he didn’t think it was a big deal, and so did nothing about it. Novak’s story comes out, everyone freaks, and now his source probably gives him a call and tells him not to mention anything, and like a good water carrying fool Bob says “okay.”
Not the sharpest tool in the shed.
welcome Jane. Good to have you here even under such serious times.
I am really getting tired of all this suspence….;o) I really want to know the rest of the story. Being kept in the dark this long is trying, to say the least!
Again welcome and you always do a great job. Have lurched onver on your spot from time to time.
Yeah well the suspense just allows them all plenty of time to form their circular firing squad and take aim.
A good show is in store for all, I believe.
Welcome!
And the perfect way to show off my new sig!!
(:<D
Perfect sig. And thanks.
It was inspired by this, unfortunately.
But hey … I’ll take my li’l bit of inspiration from anywhere.
Welcome Jane and thanks for filling in, and for this posting. Personally I think that Woodward came out with this because he felt he wasn’t getting nearly enough attention. π
Yeah I agree, I think he couldn’t stand not being in the center of this. Hence all his bloviating appearances bashing Patrick Fitzgerald. Boy he sure backed off that one quick, no?
Welcome Jane :o)
Nice diary. It helped to untie some of the knots my brain has gotten itself twisted into trying to keep up with this.
Thanks, supersoling. Much appreciated π
very excited to have you posting here at BooTrib. I’m a big fan of your work at firedoglake. I echo supersoling’s comment above, thanks for helping to pull another thread loose on the knot that has tangled in my head with TreasonGate. There are too many twists, but I think everything leads to the top. Here’s hoping!
Thanks for the kind words. Agreed it does all lead to the top. Teasing out the players and their loyalties can be damn tough, though.
for Posting here at the BoomanTrib. I love your stuff and am so deeply into the entire Plame drama that my Friends think I am CrAzY. I am thrilled you are front paging here at the Trib. I look forward to a lot more of your diaries. Keep on Rockin’ the waves at the Pond and let’s toss the entire Bush Admin the biggest anchor ever made and see who survives, who floats (sorry to the legit witches out there), who drowns or who uses others as a flotation device. I don’t care if it takes 3 more years..I want every Motherfucker held responsible for their criminal actions. Life in the Fed Pen is to leniant for these pathetic, money grubbing, chickhawk, coackroachlike cowards. Worst President and administration in the History of the United States EVER.
I get it, Chamonix1. If I’m away from the computer for too long I’m afraid I’ve missed some big story and that It’s All Happening Without Me. I think the thing that keeps me jazzed about this one — has from the start — is that I truly believe that they are going down. Maybe it’s just gut instinct, but I know where you’re coming from.
As somebody said — it’s not enough to get ’em out of office, we have to try them and put them in jail for this. The crimes are too big to simply say “well, glad that’s over with.”
Welcome, Jane. I, too, check in daily over at Firedoglake to see what great posts you and ReddHedd have up.
My candidate for Mr. X is Geedub.
But what I really want to know is this: What is the origin/significance of the name Firedoglake?
It’s the name of my loan out company, so named because I like to lie by the fire with the dogs and watch the Lakers.
Dumb name, I wasn’t thinking too hard when I started my blogger acct. and now I have to live with it.
It’s soooo not though… the more obscure the more mystique… damn, now you had to go and ruin it for me π
Seriously though, I know what you mean… I chose spiderleaf back in 1996 as a reminder of my dad and it’s tough to explain to people what a “Spiderleaf” is without saying… no, it’s not about smoking pot.
It’s so mysterious. I endowed you with god-like creativity when I heard of it. For someone who doesn’t know the back-story… it’s really evocative. And of what, you can’t say exactly, but it’s great.
So you know… my previous image was of a person at a cabin by the lake, watching the sun go down in a sky of fire-colored clouds, reflected in the lake.
Maybe it’s on Dog mountain, Last Dog road, or they have a dog by their side (pref a fire-red setter). Or they just threw that in to throw off those who’d try to pinpoint their location.
(No charge.)
It made me think of Fire in the Lake, one of the I Ching trigrams. And the title of Frances FitzGerald’s wonderful book on VietNam.
What’s a “loan out company”? Loan company, I understand. Is this something movie-related?
Heh heh heh.
Thanks.
book?
I keep wondering why no one adds that into the speculation.
And has anyone read the book? Wilson says he ran into Novak on the street days before Novak’s article, AND that Novak called him, and asked him to confirm his wife’s identity before Novak’s article! Wilson refused, of course.
What I find amazing is that nobody is commenting on the seemingly casual dissemination of classified information to uncleared individuals, which should be (and probably is) at the heart of Fitz’s investigation. I can understand why nobody in the administration has shown such concerns, but you would think it would be low-hanging fruit for the supposed journalists who are tasked with covering the story.
That the blogworld steps up to the plate and help one another in an emergency situation such as Susan had here. Jane you are one classy lady!
All this was happening when Woodward was writing his second book, right? He had total access to W. WOuld he not have asked W about the leak? W is such a putz he may have just spilled it without thinking because we all know he can’t think. Just a crazy thought I guess. I so hope it is Cheney and we march hin right out of the WH in handcuffs and straight to Gitmo where terrorists are held without trial.
Thanks again Jane for coming to the plate at Booman. Your post has real juice!
Two small points, or large, depending on the level with which you take the Plameology.
1) The Woodman himself says that he found the words “Yellowcake” and “Niger” amongst the 18 pages of questions he had prepared for his interview with Mr. Source.
It seems to me, as it has to others, that you don’t show up to David Wurmser’s with 18 pages of questions. For Woody, to have put that much time into something, he must have been talking to one of the principals, a big-shot. Hadley doesn’t really qualify at this point because all he is doing is carrying Rice’s gown train. There’s Cheney, there’s W, and maybe one or two others. I would not let the potential canard of “not having testified” before the Grand Jury throw us off. That kind of misinformation drops off these guy’s tongues like saliva from a dog. (No pun intended.)
2.) Just a little after the 24th, something gave Fitz pause… He was all ready to give Rove his pink slip and then something “gave him pause”. The media said it was about “new information” and Rove’s lawyer tried to claim success by saying he had presented the prosecutor with the new information. That was all PR designed to help Luskin get the next WH felon to sign on with him. I think it was the Woodward revelation that gave Fitz pause, not something out of Luskin’s files. After 4 GJ appearances and all the spinning he had done, I can’t see how anything that Luskin had would have changed Fitzgerald’s mind. No, it had to be big, and the size of Woodward’s revelation fits the bill. (Again, no pun.)
That’s why at the Press Conference Fitz said that Libby was the first “known” to have spilled the beans about Plame to the press. He went ahead with Libby’s indictment because it’s a no-brainer, and by letting on to what he knew, he thought it would free up some other tight lips in the Bush WH.