Prophet John Foundation Church
Welcomes you to the Powerful Healing Services.
We are inviting Christians from allover the world to come and visit our church in the powerful healing Sunday services during the month of December 2005. Bring the sick, those with brain damages, the deamon possesed, lame, unemployed, cursed, leprosy, asthma, deaf and dumb and those suffering from Aids. No matter what you have gone through Come and experience the miracles and power of God and then take back the good news home. Prophet John Foundation Church is located in the heart of Kampala City. Come in Nakivubo Settlement Primary School and ask for city centre main hall.
Why don’t you give yourself a try! Come and meet Jesus Christ for He has got an answer and a solution to all your problems.
Please send us your prayer requests for a special prayer. We are ready to pray for you even via the phone from wherever you reach us. God bless you Brother and Sister.
Here is the full address of the church:
Prophet John Foundation Church
P.O. Box 29248, Kampala – Uganda
East Africa.
Tel: Pastor Samuel Nsubuga +25677415884
Pastor Lincoln Joel Nsubuga +25677610441.
Email: prophetjohnfoundationchurch@yahoo.co.uk
pastorlincolnjoel@praize.com
evangelist_nsubuga@yahoo.ca
Home Page: www.prophetjohnfoundationchurch.4t.com
This is on your website and it is something I never understood.
Daniel 7:9-14
Revelation 1:12-18
I am a believe that God is created in our own image. I always found it curious to see blacks faces in a church praying up to an image of white man.
There are beautiful religious images available that are more consistent to the reality and times of Jesus.
What unnerves me about your image is that is comes from a culture that used religion as a means of imperialism.
There is the old saying:
When the missionaries came to Africa to teach the Africans how to pray, they had the bibles and the Africans had the land.
When the Africans looked up from praying the missionaries had the land and the Africans had the bible.
As you know this is a political blog but from the beginning of time politics and religion has co-existed side by side. In some eras more peacefully than others. In this day and age it is imperative that we must “TAKE BACK” Democracy and put it in the hands of the people…lest we live under tyranny. I believe the same has to happen with religion. And a first step is to “Take Back” the image of Jesus Christ our Savior from the hands of the imperialist and put it back into the hands of true believers.
There is no taking back. Religion belongs to anyone who wants it in any way they want it.
The content is not that important. Its the religious “feeling” that masses people into church and not the words OR the images.
There is nothing new under the sun. All is vanity and a striving after the wind.
Jesus, too. The good Pastor, too. Me and You and a dog named Boo, too.
Good luck.
I can go to get away from you superstitious nuts?
ANYWHERE?!?
I don’t care what you worship. You can do what the hell you want, but do you have to fucking inject it into every nook and cranny of the real world AND the fucking internet?
Why is it that you feel this need? You supposedly have the answers. You’re going to live forever in grace, or some such crap. Tons of people actively search out your promised miracles to fill their empty frightened lives. Isn’t that enough? If it isn’t, why not? What sick need does it fill, and don’t tell me that it’s just a loving need to “reach out”, because I’m not buying it. Agressive public piety is am narcissistic imposition of your will on other people. I, for one, am sick of it.
As I noted on LSF, Penn Jillette said it better than I can.
I agree with everything you’ve said here and am just as sick of it. But Licoln is a friend of Diane’s and, I believe, has a very big heart from what I have been able to glean from her writing about him.
This is not to say that you do not have the right to post your feelings about this kind of diary (personally, I see this as nothing more than an advertisement and wish that Licoln would post diaries about life in Uganda and/or his own experiences), but just a little harsh, no?
I love you and know you well enough (how presumptuous of me, eh?) that your raging indignation is all good, just feeling a tad bit protective of Lincoln (again, presumptuous of me, I know) — he may never come back and see any of these comments, but, so it goes.
Carry on!
ever since I moved back to the midwest I’ve had this crap rubbed in my face. I think organized religion, ESPECIALLY the Abrahamic Faiths, is intrinsically evil and anti-humanity. I think they make empty promises and maintain control by offering division masquerading as hope. I’m tired of tolerance being demanding of me, yet my initially polite demurrals are generally ignored. I know that isn’t what happened here, but I’m feeling particularly disgusted today.
We are, as a civilization, and by this I mean Western Judeo-Christian civilization, actively killing people, either by bombs, willful neglect or superstitious insistance that things like condoms are “sinful”.
I’m just feeling really, really sick of it, and I’m tired of being the one that has to be tolerant. Just once I want some of these people to heed the words of their supposed savior as relayed by Matthew:
Not that I have any hope that will ever happen. Matthew’s Gospel is probably the one LEAST referenced by most adherants of that faith, yet it’s by far the most admirable part of that whole messed up, stitched together book.
Gotta agree…
Did you see that Dobson has just met with Bolton to “approve” of the UN Reform plans.
Also that this look to be a hit and run diary. I would have like to ask the pastor about how his evangelical First Lady has all but outlawed condoms in Uganda. Which is very sad since Uganda is the ONLY AFRICAN COUNTRY that was actually LOWERING it’s AIDS rates.
Also this reminded me of Jerome’s diary:
My Q&A with Wolfowitz – there may still be WMD in Iraq
In which Wolfowitz summised that:
He notes that there are two groups in the USA that care about what’s going on in Africa (and what the WB does): the African immigrants, and the evangelicals.
This is beginning to sound like a confluence of interests… The World Bank and the UN letting loose Roberts and Dobson in Africa… scary shit.
exactly …
this particularly bothers me:
Well, no, “He” doesn’t. There are NO solutions to ALL of life’s problems, but I’d venture a guess that sex education, condoms, forgiving foreign debt, microcredit programs … THESE things will help people people far more than a pilgrimage looking for miracles.
Dobson and his ilk CREATE MORE DEATH AND SUFFERING. Which is their goal, since suffering serves as both punishment for our “sins” and a doorway to “redemption”.
Here is one of my first diaries on BMT that I wrote back in April about Uganda and it’s new policies on condomless prevention….
Faith based Genocide
Thank you Brinnaine, for your words here, I have been out today and only got to read one comment before I left or I would have posted sooner…
As I said down thread he has posted diaries about Uganda, but who read them???Not much notice at all. Anyway this is his culture, part of the culture of Africa and this is how they think and feel, this is real, this is life there, so desperate that any way out of the harshness is very appealing.
I celebrate the strides he has made thus far in his life to lift himself out of poverty to the level where he can have access to the internet through his job at internet cafe and did learn English on his own enough to come here some day and post diaries….and being willing to engage with others in a far distant land where I assured him with my invitation he would be treated well. These words are meant for all who posted here Brin…just happened to be on your comment as I want to get these words out and your comment seemed a good place to start.
Anyway thanks for you defense, I was happy to read that.
Hey I just got home and saw the hub bub in this diary….for whoever said hit and run diary…Lincoln lives in Uganda, it’s night there, remember…and he can only post when he is at work..
And lighten up a little folks, is this what you want to show American’s are like to Africans or anyone else in the world, and especially this one I invited here to post and be a member thinking he would be treated with respect…
He has written about Uganda before, but very little attention has been paid to those diaries…
Would some of you prefer he did not post here at all?
I will post more later, I have some things to do.
He posted this almost noonish his time.
is this what you want to show American’s are like to Africans
I don’t understand this..
Well I would consider some of the words spoken on this thread to be very unkind…How do you think he will feel reading some of them, esp. Madmans???.
Geesch, he can only post at work when there is time available for him, not whenever he feels like it and in the past and he has always responded to comments as soon as he gets the chance…
I didn’t get the idea that MM was trashing him because he is African but trashing him because of the drive by proselytizing.
And frankly missionarires are on a new crusade to re-colonizing Africa in a frightening way. You can’t even get a “good” job unless you pass through one of these churches first. One country I visted there was a new “back office” subcintracted from a sub contract from India but the only way you could be trainedfor these very well paid jobs was to go through this multi million dollar US church. You think it is bad in the US it the wingnuts are 100 time worse in Africa.
“is this what you want to show American’s are like to Africans or anyone else in the world,” my words, never said or implied that he was attacking for being African, but rather how it looks to other people in the world to treat them in this manner.
My understanding is this is a grass roots church of the people there, not missionaries, but in any case I expect Pastor will respond…
BTW I am in no way at all religious myself, so I have nothing to promote here, just allowing others to hold their own belief systems is my view of this…this is who and what he is, not for me to change…my efforts towards him are to help him find ways out of his poverty and giving him ideas that might help him find those ways which I have done extensively in my emails with him.
Diane I can feel that you are a warm and generous person. I have travelled to several countries in Africa and this dairy put up a warning flag for me and as I said I would have perferred to discuss this more with him.
I bothered to go to his site after reading this post… He is exhorting for what is clearly faith healing.
Unless there is a condom in the religious tract he offers, this includes selling faith and miracles to treat HIV/AIDS in sub_Saharan Africa:
Dear Frog Family,
No one understands ire, contempt and dis-satisfaction with religions and religious comentary than I do. But really. I find it a bit disheartening to see Pastor Lincoln attacked in a rather personal way here. We seemed to have a great deal more tolerance for Pastor Dan who posted and commented here frequently. I am wondering what the difference is.
If religion and religious comments push your buttons, how hard is it to just ignore them and not read the darn stuff? And if you do read it and don’t like it, just move on and pay it no attention. Must we scream at those who believe differently than we do? Must we be right and they be wrong? Grow up please! And grow into your espoused freedom of speech and allow others theirs. We have quite a few members here who are members of tradional religious organizations/churches, will you treat them in the same manner? Isn’t the world and the internet big enough to encompass everyone regardless of what personal beliefs get them through their difficult lives? Obviously, I live in a different “world” than many of you.
As for hit and run diaries. . .frankly, I see them all the time here, but Pastor Lincoln can only post from his work and only when he has a few moments that he is NOT working. I think a little tolerance can go a long way. If you have sincere conversation you wish to have with him, then do so respectfully and he will respond when he is able.
Surely then, I see you feel there is no place for my “spiritual” diaries here on Booman either. And I have posted far more than Pastor Lincoln has.
If that is the case, then please let us come to an agreement that we want no spiritual or religious commentary on this site and I will certainly abide by it.
A disappointed
Shirl
I think that personally Pastor Dan is a good person but I am not a fan of the DK blog franchise concept. I find it hypocritical to bash “single issue” purists then produce and offshoot blog hoping to attract a single issue democragraphic. It demostrates that “Some special interest are more special than others”… also is not done for the sake of religion but as a political tool.
I would have loved to discuss with this person had he come back. There are some dire issues facing Africa today and particulary Uganda where the First Lady has all but outlawed condoms in a coutry rife with AIDS.
Africa is an extreme continent… this is why the African Anglican church is more Anglican than it mother church in England… don’t get me started on the African Roman Catholics…Frankly, it is the more indigenous religions that seem to be the most moderate like the Ethiopian Coptics and the most extreme are those transported in the wake of imperialism.
I did read his website before commenting and tried to ease into a conversation with the art…and wanted to take it from there.
But I have to say I agree with MM… it is time to speak out about proselytizing without fearing being damned to hell.
Some perspective. This is a person who has very minimal education and most of it self-taught. This is an unsophisticated, uncomplicated, straight forward person who has no understanding of what we smug Americans might view as inappropriate, or distasteful. He has found something that lifts him up out of devistating poverty and a very painful existance. . .he has found HOPE.
It will never be any of my business or yours or any others what has brought that hope to him. It may seem he makes it our business when he innocently placed this invitation on our blog.
I understand his zeal in sharing with others what has brought him a new and brighter perspective. I personally believe whatever gets any of us through this life with some sense of purpose and a measure of happiness is worthwhile for the person. And I will never discourage an individual away from something that brings that to them. Certainly, just like everyone else, I think MY WAY is the far better way to do that. But really. . .it is the best way for me and I have no possible way of knowing what is the best for any other.
Are atheists proselytizing when they continue to tell us that we who are not atheistic are believing in is superstition, mythological nonsense, folklore, nothing nearly as high minded and laudable as their total belief in and worship of science? If they are not, then why is that any different than others professing what they believe in?
We want to rail against religion? Then lets rail against the gargantuion megalithic Organizations and the ones who run them and control them and distort what they pretend are their tenants of faith. Let us not attack the individuals that for whatever reasons have not yet found a better way.
Your last line, is an interesting one. If there were a hell (and I certainly do not believe in one) could it be any more devastating than living on earth right now in this lying, deceitful, savage, inhumane, uncaring, blood thirsty, greed saturated, smug, me first, me always, condescending pretentious world we inhabit?
What we seem damned to (imo) is our total lack of caring about anyone or anything outside of our very small personal circle of experience. We reap the consequences of it every day. Hell, indeed!
I saw that Buffy episode!
I’m glad if he’s found some peace and hope in his life, but I’m watching religion destroy my country, and I’ve reached my breaking point with it.
Maybe this wasn’t the place to do it. I’m sure his faith will sustain him past my scorn.
Because there are a bunch of rampaging idiot lunatics tearing our country up, we should take it out on him.
Interesting view point. I get it. The only thing that matters is how it feels to you.
Fine. We couldn’t be any further apart in our views. Therefore, I agree to disagree with you.
Have you ever been to any African country? I have several times. Frankly, I find your attitude a bit condescending.
No, I have never been to Africa, any of it. But I am looking forward to it if WHO or the UN or anyone else, even one of those despicable so-called Christian churches, will have me. I have a lot that I am willing to personally offer and I know there are 11,000,000 orphaned children that could use a crazy old story-telling grandma who cares about them to offer love and what small portions of physical sustanance I might be able to share with them. Yes, I know I can’t fix it all for them. But I can do whatever I can do if it is only offer love and caring. There isn’t anyone on this planet that doesn’t need that.
I am not certain why my never having been to Africa means I am condescending, but if that is your perception, I am sure you know better than I.
I personally have great contempt for religions and what they have done in this world. But that is my kettle of fish to stew in and if others find hope, and comfort there then who the hell am I to try to take it from them.
Seared in my mind is the picture of a 29 year old mother who looked 90, dying of aids in a makeshift clinic in an African Country. The great savior MEDICINE was there to care for her. She was being given and IV with anti-dysentary medication. NO MEDICINE FOR AIDS IS AVAILABLE, THE GOVERNMENT WILL NOT ALLOW IT AND THE US GOVERNMENT WON’T BE BOTHERED TO HELP! Her 7 year old daughter was crying at her bedside at what turned out to be the last time she would see her alive.
Now homeless, orphaned and hungry, that little girl wanders the roads and pathways a perfect prey for the uneducated, superstitious men who believe sex with a virgin child will cure there aids. So one day soon it will most likely be her lying in a tent or shelter somewhere, or perhaps in the street dying of aids.
So I yell angrily at my TV that brings me this inexcusable story, I cry, my heart aches, I rant and rave all over the blogs while sitting in my warm and safe home in front of my computer screen, I donate money to what seem to be reliable and honest causes that are doing their best to help.
But why is my fat comfortable butt still sitting in my chair when so many helping hands are needed on the ground there?
Yes, I suppose To some I might sound condescending. I apologize for my haughtiness.
Shirl, I pokd around his site. It shows a photo of a women paying her “tithe”. To a faith healer. However much he uses Christ… However much you say he derives hope, he is selling a con.
I am spectacularly disinterested in his spirituality… I don’t discuss mine, but I DO take issue with faith healing and even the slightlest expectation (which is what I get off this post) of money for such “work”.
Uganda is one country that had an effective campaign of education and condom use and was lowering their HIV/AIDS rates… but now is deep in the USAID and other campaigns that funnel money to the ”faith based” incentives – and to abstinence. HIV AIDS is now rising again in UGanda.
This is so distasteful. He is not writing about Uganda nor about sprituality but about furthering ignorance.
Not that it matters to anyone, but I am an animist. I don’t proselytise.
That is your opinion. It is all a con. We pay thousands upon thousands of $ to doctors and drug companies in the US, for the “miracle” of their supposed cures. . .and you know as well as I do they promise everything under the sun and put all the pertanent stuff in print too small to read. They are selling a con too and we buy into it faster than they can make new “miracle cures” for us.
If we are all so righteously indignant about this that is going on in Africa, then what are WE doing about it? Not one damned thing! How about you? How about others on this site? How about all us bleeding liberal heart professors of TRUTH and SCIENCE. . .what are you/we/any of us doing about it? Pretty easy to sit in our nice comfortable homes in front of our computers and denounce others for their ways. Pretty easy to know however small our incomes are, they are more than the $30 a month Pastor Lincoln earns. Pretty comfortable to know that we don’t have a wife, children, a mother, ourselves and a brother all living in ONE ROOM and very glad that we have it, even though most of the food has to come from scraps from the cafe, if there are any.
At this very moment I am very seriously considering giving up my selfish dream of retiring to the beach in Belize to go to Africa and offer what I can, even if it is helping to educate these people who have to BUY uniforms in order to go to school and God knows they don’t have any money to buy food let alone uniforms.
I volunteered several months ago through WHO (world health organization), so I guess I will be bugging them to find a spot for me, since I haven’t heard back from them yet.
We are the most pompus, self-centered, I am right you are wrong, group of people on the face of the earth, we Americans are.
I hear you loud and clear. We agree to disagree. I find it extremely difficult how anyone can teach something they don’t know yet, as in Pastor Lincoln’s case. . .but it seems easy enough to tell him he is wrong, and we know so much more than he does he should just take us at our word.
We disagree. I leave it at that
Shirl, you raise a thousand issues. None excuses this diary.
The diary is not about Uganda nor about some transcendental religious experience nor about doing good works for the sick and dying.
It is about selling faith healing in sub Saharan Africa. Again, I did go thru the website.
If that is acceptable then Brother Bob who is on the air here in the middle of night and asks viewers to place their hand over his on the TV screen… and send in money for healing and prosperity (his) is acceptable as well.
Last comment.
I am curious why this diary needs excusing? We don’t feel the need to rampage over the silly, nonsense that is posted here frequently if not daily. We don’t mind at all that some found the Sex Toys diary very offensive, we don’t mind that some are terribly offended by the mentions of Paganism and Witches. But we mind this innocent mistake by an unsophisticated barely educated man in Uganda. I am truly puzzled.
And the rest of us don’t send our money to the Doctors, practitioners, hospitals, drug companies who we extole as OUR “Faith healers?” Interesting.
We place our faith, most of us, in Science and Medicine, and therefore, everything else is outside of the realm of possibility. Science and medicine don’t know everything, and often they know very damn little except they are excellent at knowing how to get our money by the Billions. In many ways, in my opinion, the “Dying Care Industry”, because it certainly cannot be called health care, is just as fraudulent as Brother Bob is. Want a news flash? THERE WILL NEVER BE A CURE FOR CANCER. . .not because it isn’t possible, but because the “searching for the cure” is a multi Billion dollar industry. And I have seen many cancers cured outside of the mainstream using herbs and other methods. Deadly melanomas with “3 months to live” pronounced and verified by our Science only medical Gods. I have seen far more healing by people of faith in other things besides science than I have seen or personally experienced in our worship of medicine.
Five years ago I could have had both my knees replaced. Certainly the xrays and medical gurus proclaimed it was the only answer to my excruciating pain from arthritis and no cartlege in my knees. Just saw the femor above the knee, saw the fibula and tibula below the knee, and presto a new plastic or metal joint is attached and six months later you will be pain free and walking.
I chose another solution. Something you and most here won’t understand nor ever care to understand. I gathered “Energy Workers” around me, Bowen Therapists, EMF practitioners, Zero Point Balancers, Theta Level healers, all loving friends and members of my spiritual family. I paid nothing for this help, though even if I had, it would have been many tens of thousands less than the doctor, hospital, surgery, anesthesia, walkers and Rx medicines.
January 1st, 2002, after an evening of wonderful togetherness and sharing between our little spiritual family members, I got up off the floor (why I got down there in the first place is another story and rather incomprehensible to most)unassisted, and walked across the room, pain free.
I have had no pain since and my bone on bone knees carried me very nicely on a six mile trail in the Tetons in June of 2002. There have been too many things like this that have happened to me, my family, my close friends and my acquaintences for me to scoff at what will or will not effect healing.
I do not suggest that people do not go to doctors or take their nasty chemical medicines. If that is where you place your “faith” then that is what will do you the most good. I have no faith in them for me. It would not be best for me to spend my time and precious little money with them What you believe in is what will work for you. And I have no desire to get into any arguments about that statement. Read Dr Berie Segal’s book Love, Medicine and Miracles. He’s an Oncologist, he knows a thing or two.
Yes, I certainly despise and am disgusted by Scam artists that are touting there “cures and healings” and all that charade entails.
This is not where Pastor Lincoln is coming from.
We have many views of how things work and how things should work and what we “know” to be the one and only RIGHT way. And we are just as full of it as these maniac bible thumping crooks.
All I am trying, obviously without much success, to relate to you is Your problems and My problems with religions and religious scam hacks are not Lincoln’s problems. No, he did not know that he should not post this type of material here. And Many of us found it appropriate to excoriate him, to pronounce him a fake, a scam artist, to project all our hatred of mainstream religion onto him and feel big and proud of ourselves because we called out a simple man from Uganda and we showed him.
I thought this was a different type of site than that. Apparently I am wrong. Not the first time I have been wrong, so there you have it.
“We have many views of how things work and how things should work and what we “know” to be the one and only RIGHT way. And we are just as full of it as these maniac bible thumping crooks.”
AMEN!
To Madmen in the Marketplace: I read most of your diaries (though I rarely comment on them; I do think I’ve rec’d quite a number of them;) you are truly a voice of great sanity, and I agree with your assessment of Judeo-Christian religion. I totally understand your frustration.
BUT, I don’t consider this a very productive reaction to it:
I haven’t gone to pastor lincoln’s site. It doesn’t interest me and not one of the battle’s I would chose to fight.
I’m of the “if you don’t want to read it, don’t” school, but don’t challenge its very right to exist or to be here or to be of interest to others. There are plenty of places on the net you can go to get away from whatever you want to get away from.
So, yeah, basically I agree with the critique I read between the lines of what you’ve written–but sheesh, who knows, maybe Pastorlincoln would come in here, get engaged in discussions with people who are interested, and maybe the whole nature of the project would ultimately change. You don’t necessarily have to join in those conversations if you don’t want to–but is that a reason to question why they are going on or if they should even be here?
Did you know that in that last election in Uganda one of the candidates told his “flock” that God told him that they should all take up their machetes and smite their enemies…
Religion is something I take EXTREMELY seriously in Africa.
I didn’t know that George W ran for office in Uganda. (that’s my attempt at a joke, so please don’t take it otherwise)
I understand that you have some extreme concerns about religion in Africa. I have those same concerns about America, Europe, well the whole damn world to be exact.
I am curious why you are so focused in Africa about these things, and what you are actively doing about your extreme concerns. It would be informative to me if you have the time or desire to explain it so I can know where you are coming from.
If you think I don’t you are seriously mistaken, I have watched the way Christianity destroyed the indigenous beliefs and systems in this country (and continues to). I have also watched as Christianity has spread in Africa and threatens to do the same (when I first arrived in Guinea, W. Africa [86], there was not a visible sign of Christian influence–last time I was there, 2001, there was a lot of it.)
Yes, I find it alarming. I also find the spread of capitalist consumerist crap in Africa very disturbing. Heartbreaking in fact. But my approach is more to try and talk to the people about it, to inform them about the dangers of western civilization and of Christianity.
Guess what? Most of them don’t want to hear about the dangers of Western civilization. All they see is: wow. Those people have x, y, z, and more x, y, z….and we don’t have anything….but we also want x,y,z.
In this case, we’re talking about Pastor Lincoln, who is apparently a friend of Diane’s. My approach would be to try and “re-direct” his energies, and if that still doesn’t work…I dunno. What’s a couple hundred bucks?
Today I cheered the Church of England’s selection of the first black archbishop, Ugandan-born John Sentamu
They are taking positive steps to curb the extremist religions in Africa.
Shirl, because one or two people go bonkers on a diary is not a reason for you to feel out of place. I and others would be tremendously disappointed if you did not bring your spiritual sensibilities to the Trib. The intolerant speech leval is running high here today. I hope the weekend brings peace.
First, it wasn’t the “hit and run nature” of the diary, and if I gave that impression I didn’t intend to.
It’s the prostelitizing.
Why I have to be tolerant is beyond me. As a non-believer, I am extremely unlikely to be able to hold office, or to see someone who shares my belief hold office. I am confronted w/ the idea that I can’t possibly have a moral compass or a system of ethics because some imaginary friend hasn’t given me one. I have to watch missionaries and Popes stand in front of starving masses of people and promise them miracles as they actively block simple lifesaving solutions to the suffering.
If there is a heaven, and if believers are so certain that it is there waiting for them, then WHY the constant exortations that everyone must “tolerate” their professions of certainty? Why isn’t the certainty enough? Why is it okay for them, in the name of god, to smear people with words like “sinner” and “harlot” … why isn’t that kind of intolerance deserving of condemnation, but my simple disgust with superstion some kind of terrible crime?
Have I offended you? Good. This kind of crap promising miracles in a world that already IS a miracle offends me. We can help one another, cure one another, love one another, embrace one another, learn and support and improve and understand one another if only we LOOK at each other as people LIVING IN THIS MIRACLE, and not sinners learning thru suffering awaiting some grace to bring us paradise.
“Why do you have to be tolerant of someone in Africa”, really, I have some advice for you, don’t read it, then it won’t offend you or do you object to others reading it at all….or do you object to it being written, or do you object to others having views other than yours….What is it.
It;s pretty obvious the extent of your intolerence, and “I” am offended by your attack on a friend of mine. In my opinion your behavior is a violation of the number one rule on this site and I am sure you know what that is.
you know, that would be fine if it wasn’t on CNN or MSNBC every time I turn it on, and even more and more on PBS and NPR. If it wasn’t on the back of every bumper of every car that drives by as I wait for the bus. If there weren’t prime time movies about an intolerant gay-bashing pope on TWO networks mere months after his funeral was relentlessly flogged everywhere. If “bless you” wasn’t followed by an expectant stare REQUIRING a blessing in return every where I go. If I didn’t have to watch a nut drive by with pictures of fetuses festooning his car, and if it wasn’t increasingly all over blogs that USED to talk about politics. The world is drowning in religion, and while I’m sure the pastor is a very nice man and trying to bring good to the world, religion causes more harm than good.
I can’t even enjoy the gospel and bluegrass records I love right now b/c all of the relentless preaching has made it hard to hear it on music I love, where usually I can accept it as a personal expression of joy, as I’m sure this diary was intended.
I’m past my breaking point with this.
I’ll leave you in peace now.
Neither the word “sinner” nor the word “harlot” nor any derivation of either appear in this diary! Methinks you are projecting on Pastor Lincoln. Look I’m no Christian. If you knew me you would think it funny that I would be defending a faith healing invitation against an anti-proselytizer. Usually I’m the anti-p. I just think you’ve picked the wrong place for this particular rant. Like Shirl said,
I wish everyone would paste that on their computer and go have a drink in the Cafe. I think I hear McCoy Tyner…
http://www.villageblue.com/blog/18
http://www.boomantribune.com/user/uid:939/diary
These are links to some dairies Lincoln had previously posted, lots about Uganda, I have written some as well about him…but don’t have time now to go and search for them…
I would be very interested in discussing this more…
thanks for the links.
They are interesting and I wish only the best for him. I liked learning more about the day to day life in his homeland. I’m usually not able to check in here during the day, so I hadn’t seen them before.
I understand that people find strength in their faith .. it’s the insistance that others SHOULD as well that sets me off.
Please check out the link below of the diary I wrote about him, which explains how I came to meet him and why he came to this site…
Incidentally, just recently in the past few weeks there has been some trouble/unrest in Kampalla which he has written me about and perhaps he will write about here as well…very difficult country to live in and very hard to hear the stories he has told me without feeling his pain and desperation…He is one of the few that has risen above the life he may have been destined for, had it not been for religion which in his case, did save him..
His personal story is heroic and very moving and he has largley self educated, even to the extent of putting up his own web site, figured out all the techs. and so on..Figured out how to write and post on an American site in a foreign language, will be a long day till I would be capable of that.
I think we should feel most grateful that a voice of Uganda has come here to speak with us, this is the real world here, his real world.
http://www.boomantribune.com/story/2005/6/6/10625/05613
This is a link to a diary I wrote about Lincoln when he first came to this site.
I just want to add that Pastor is a ‘lay preacher’ or pastor in his church, maybe like a deacon here in some churches. He is not paid in other words and depends on his living from the internet cafe he works in.
…not a diary — it is not news or commentary.
It should be on the left column, not the right, and duly paid for.
Yes, exactly.
Pastor Lincoln has an interesting story and his life includes his religious beliefs and their influences… but there is nothing of Pastor Lincoln in this diary. It’s an ad for religious services.
Most likely he’ll realize this and post more personal or news type items next time, like he has before.
Months ago I asked Lincoln, my friend in Uganda, to come here and become a member, now I have written to him and asked that he not post here anymore due to the treatment he has received from some of you…not all, but embarrassing for me that anyone would treat him as he has been in this diary.
To Karen above, thanks so much for making your second comment ever here on this diary and your pronouncement that it was an ad and should be paid for. Yeah an ad fromUganda, and he sure has a lot to gain from that, right. I am sure you will go around to all the non commentary diaries and pronounce then as such and decide. Guess you did not read any of the comments.
Gee we have entirely frivilous diaries on this site that surely must be stamped out or paid for, and by the way 2 diaries about DK being down , now that is way out of line, where’s the outrage over that. But no slack for this man who no doubt thought he was offering something quite wonderful.
Also I want to let you all know, I am never inviting anyone to come to this site again as I cannot be sure how they will be treated and would not want to subject them to this abuse.
BTW for all those who wonder why he has not yet responded, it is because last night was Sunday for him and he does not work on Sunday and will have no internet access until he returns to work on Monday, which will be tonight, our time.
And yes I am mad and disappointed!!!!
wow, he’s that delicate? YOU’RE that delicate?
Why not come back and talk for himself?
Yes you are dammed right I am that delicate and sick and tired of the treatment some on this site are giving to some posters and especially in the last few weeks.
And gee if he could bust open the doors to the internet cafe he works in, I am sure he would be responding to this diary post haste, but alas he cannot. But cut him no slack for that or for anything else and surely none for me. Yes do go on with your smack down comments Madman, come on everyone, lets have a slap fest over here, let’s all set this man straight about what kind of people we are on this site. I am sure he will see the light!!!!
…but if a post like that appeared on my site, I would delete it as spam. What is this but an advertisement? If there were discussion, at least that would be expression. This seems to be sheer promotion.
And that’s not even getting into the merits of faith healing and abstinence dogma as effective tools against HIV/AIDS.
If the BooManagement wants spam or faith healers on their site, I’m not one to argue. But I think it’s a bit disingenuous to invite this kind of content and expect people not to cry bullsh–.
If I misread this post, I apologize for not being able to read between the lines that don’t even seem to be there.
Well I would just ask you Media Girl how many on this site promote their own agenda, books, sites and what nots.not to mention sex toys.and witches, did you object to those diaries or are they ok, just faith healing is out.
I am not saying anything other than he does not need to be treated in this manner, he made a mistake in posting this here, plain and simple, but he does not need to be raked through the coals.
Faith healers, well I do believe you can count me among those that believe faith can heal and Shirlstars as well,I guess a few of us at least will no longer feel comfortable posting about any sort of healing other than what passes for mainstream healing and what is that exactly pray tell. Yeah believe in your doctors and medicine, they have done well by many.
Yes, these pages should be filled with all the hate people want, but dare not post anything outside of that arena or anything that is offered with love.
And yes it is mostly hate, hate against the Republicans, that is posted on this site, but that’s ok…cause they deserve it, right.
These continuous comments about Aids and Hiv…are driving me nuts…what, he should only post on those subjects, is that correct? Living in the midst of an aids filled country is not enough, he should be writing about it only.
I made a mistake in thinking that a man from Uganda, unfamiliar with the ways of Western Countries, could be accepted and respected on this site and it’s my mistake for inviting him here in the first place.
I made a mistake in thinking that a man from Uganda, unfamiliar with the ways of Western Countries, could be accepted and respected on this site and it’s my mistake for inviting him here in the first place.
This really sucks. I suppose it was inevitable as the site grew, that civility would go by the wayside. It makes me very sad.
Librarylil, I do want to thank you for your words here, I am not religious in any sense of the word, but I for one do not condemn others for their offerings along those lines…
I too am sad, sadder than most will know or understand.
I am rethinking ‘liberal’ as in Dems, I guess it is only a narrow application not the broader application as defined here:
My credo is something along the lines of the late John Coltrane: “Once you become aware of that force that unifies everything, you can never forget it. It affects everything you do” (sort of a paraphrase from the liner notes of his album Meditations.
I did not object to his diary — BooMan can do what he wants, and I have no quibble with that. I commented only after the expressions of outrage that anyone would object to such a diary … as if some people are above criticism.
But as you brought it up, I’ll clarify: I consider the diary to be spam. It says nothing, offers no discussion, just an ad. I have asked people posting similar things on my site to refrain, including Bitch magazine, which is one I truly admire. Exceptions I have made have been for personal blog efforts (such as the Carnival of Feminists) and other things where the person is actually writing some content and placing the event or organization or product in a personal context. If people want to spam, there are plenty of ways to do it without posting on mediagirl.org.
I don’t think this reverend needs to write about HIV/AIDS (even if it’s killing millions every year), but in the diary in question he doesn’t write about anything. This isn’t an invitation to discuss anything. If he or anyone else came to talk about faith, I would either engage in the discussion or ignore it. (And you can be pretty darned sure I will engage if it involves recruiting the government to enforce Evangelical Christianity on everyone or invade people’s privacy and violate their human and civil rights.)
Personally, while I think spiritual and mental/emotional bearing can profoundly affect one’s health, I think faith healing as an institutional practice is a bunch of baloney, and preys upon people’s insecurities just when they are the most vulnerable — all the more objectionable when the US government adds millions of dollars to finance it. You can argue with straw men and say that if one is against faith healing, then one is for the corporate medical industry. But there you’re just doing a disservice to yourself, if you have any interest in engaging in a real discussion on the subject.
I object to an American policy that gives money to organizations that promote anti-science, and prohibits aid to any country that even advocates real sex education, condom usage and, yes, family planning. But that’s neither here nor there, for no discussion was invited, no statements were made.
Now you can just dismiss everyone’s comments here as “hate” — and as someone who tries to follow the path of the Dharma, I’m not insensitive to the conflict here or in American politics in general — but I think your objections do not demonstrate any variance from that which you condemn, and your criticism of BooTribbers as a class is unfair.
I don’t think it’s necessary to ask him to stop posting here. I’ll have to admit that I am a bit at a loss as to why this particular diary was posted here, but that’s usually how I feel about a fair number of diaries – and simply choose to ignore them. I would hope that Pastorlincoln would be willing to discuss life in Uganda. That would be of interest to me.
Salaam.