ManfromMiddletown posted a diary today titled Spain Claims Universal Jurisdiction: Will Bush and Blair be tried in Madrid? It is about the Spanish government’s recent acceptance of the idea that:
According to the proponents of universal jurisdiction, certain crimes pose so serious a threat to the international community as a whole, that any state ought to be able to prosecute an individual responsible for it; no place should be a safe haven for war criminals (including criminals involved in genocides) and human rights violators. Amnesty International also includes torture, “disappearances” and extrajudicial executions in this list.
Read on for my own take on this.
But…
As Mao Tse Tung so aptly observed 60 or more years ago in another context, REAL “universal jurisdiction” only comes from the barrel of a gun.
Read this Guardian article about how several senior British generals see the policies and actions of US troops in Iraq. In short, they are saying that “the US army has developed over time a singular focus on conventional warfare, of a particularly swift and violent kind”. And they are disagreeing with this as a tactical approach.
But that is the only approach…the overall shock and awe idea…that is stopping any NUMBER of countries from bringing various types of pressure to bear on this country to back off.
I mean, if you have a military and a government that has proven to be absolutely dedicated to the idea of “a particularly swift and violent” kind of warfare, and that government possesses enough nuclear weapons and delivery systems to literally end life on earth as we know it a hundred times over…a swifter and more violent means of warfare having yet to be invented by human beings as far as we know…then it is time to be afraid.
VERY afraid.
So here we are.
The United States government is essentially holding the entire world hostage with the old “I’ve got the building wired and I’ll blow the whole place up if you try to stop me” idea.
Meanwhile, the cops are outside, afraid to come in.
“Universal jurisdiction” my ASS!!!
The US is working on the concept of eminent domain.
Over the whole world.
And when you live in an area where the government has proven that it will do whatever is necessary to take over property that it believes to be in its best interests to acquire…well, all you can really do is sit tight, hope that they do not not cast an eye on YOUR property, and play whatever politics is available to you to moderate their ambitions in your neighborhood.
Which is exactly what Spain and every other damned country in the world is doing right now. Sitting in a big restaurant trying to eat their dinner while there’s a table of truly dangerous mobsters off in the corner. Mobsters who appear to be in a particularly…expansive mood these days.
“Don’t look over there, Myrtle. NO EYE CONTACT!!! Maybe they’ll pick on somebody else.”
I got yer ‘universal jurisdiction’ right HERE!!!
Universal jurisdiction comes from the barrel of a gun.
And from NOWHERE else.
Yup.
And unless we can convince the real power in this country…the movers and the shakers, the possessors of trillions and trillions of dollars of property…that this is a counterproductive stance, that it is literally bad for business and will one way or another ultimately result in a collapse of the whole system, then this is the game that we will continue to play.
Start convincing…
Or sit at YOUR table and wait for the inevitable firefight to erupt.
Because the bad guys always use their weapons, eventually.
That’s why they’re the BAD guys.
Afraid yet?
I am.
I mean…I literally start every day with the thought (make it the meditation) that “This day is a good day to die.” And THEN I go on about my business. So I am NOT “afraid”, in one sense.
But I fear for my family.
For the work that I have done in my lifetime.
For the work my family has done.
Over hundreds of generations.
My extended family.
The HUMAN family.
I do.
We are at that point now.
We literally have a madman sitting in the White House. Someone who is surrounded and controlled by OTHER madmen.
And we sit here talking about “universal jurisdiction”?
Nice theory.
Please…talk to John Gotti or Ghengis Khan about “universal jurisdiction”.
Please.
The rest of the world IMPOSED “universal jurisdiction” on Adolf Hitler.
At the point of a gun.
Before HE imposed eminent domain on THEM.
We are one crisis away from the same situation.
One crisis.
Only…little Mr. Schicklgruber had no nukes.
OOOOOooooo….scaaaary!!!
AG
Well, nothing new here. Seen this time and time again. Furthermore, I have heard of more violent war campaign than this one.
How many genocidal monsters did Mao put behind bars?? Plus, we do not believe in the death penalty. And, if we did have the death penalty, we would first gave them a fair trial. We just wouldn’t go and execute them.
You seem to fail to see that, in a way of speaking, we all live in the same building.the US will not end up winning. Technically speaking it will be a tie. but with the added flavour of a victory.
You have to understand that many of us worked long and hard to see the Universal Jurisdiction a reality. And it wasn’t a short and easy victory. It took 30 years.
And it is still a work in progress.
Spain sentenced Cavallo to 17.000 years in jail. He can only serve 30. But is not about how much time the bastard will serve. This is a symbolical sentence to try to equate the suffering caused.
You also have to understand that the Universal Jurisdiction was basically designed for us, those who had to suffer under truely brutal governments. In a world where they would go unpunished. It was a way of saying: don’t be so sure that you will get scott free. there MIGHT be a very high price to pay.
And now they are being so carefull. It is working.
In addition, I don’t think the US is holding hostage any country. On the contrary. The world will hold those who think that they can do whatever they want to,hostages in their own country. They have a medical problem, and the doctor is abroad and don’t want to come to the US? TOUGH! These all pawerfull people can not predict the future. They are at their mercy.
We have learned to be patient. We have learned that life has a lot of ironies. So, we will sit tight and wait for shit to happen. And then I will smile and think out loud: BUSTED!
I am not going to argue with you point by point here, cruz del sur. I do not believe that you got what I was saying in this post. Not even remotely. I am sorry that you think that I was in any way putting down the efforts of the people who worked for such a thing. I simply do not think that it will work unless it is backed up by force.
Superior force to that which the US has at its fingertips. Which itself is…force that can end ALL force.
Thus we live in a stalemate.
StalemateWorld.
Mutually Assured Destruction.
A fool’s game, with fools almost totally in control of one of the participating countries.
My own take on this?
The rest of the world is going to have to starve us out.
Break us.
Economically.
Which concept is precisely at the root of the tactics that are being used against the US by the Islamic opposition today. They learned how to do this against the USSR in Afghanistan, and now (as befits a MUCH stronger opponent) they have expanded the tactic throughout the whole Middle East. And by the extension of terrorist activities, right into the homelands of their enemies as well.
Are they “right”, these people?
I am not qualified to make that kind of judgment. I have not walked a mile in their shoes.
But I HAVE walked many miles as an American, as have 300+ years worth of my ancestors, …and WE are most certainly wrong here.
Wrong since after WWII, in the short term. (I won’t even begin to delve into our history previous to that time.) Since we allowed that entity about which Eisenhower tried to warn us, the military-industrial complex, to take over.
Lock, stock and secret pork barrel.
And we are going to have to pay the freight for that mistake.
Either we soon begin paying voluntarily…at the point of our OWN guns (military and/or otherwise) if necessary…or the world will have to enforce its concept of “universal jurisdiction”.
At which point the words “My ASS!!!” will no longer follow that phrase in any more of my posts.
Until then…it is just a remote dream.
A sweet dream, as are all dreams of retribution.
But REAL retribution comes hard. Especially against a truly powerful enemy.
Nothing sweet OR dreamlike about it.
It comes with blood.
Usually at the point of a gun.
We shall see.
I would MUCH rather see us frogmarch these sons of bitches out of the White House, give them a truly fair trial and then hang them from the nearest lamppost.
With TV cameras to document the action. Up close and personal.
But w/their control of the media…this is not likely.
So here we are.
Waiting.
For justice.
Like I said…we shall see.
May you be born into interesting times.
AG.
P.S. Check out my sig.
Says it all.
Guess I did miss that. My apologies 🙂
a lot of food for thought for all here. unless one has ever been held hostage for what ever eason it can be terribly humilating, stressful and even life threatening. for what ever reason one can determine this is just a bru ha ha or if this is real rhetoric to be given great thought, is to be living in todays world.
we are all being set back several century’s in our mind thought. I refuse to do this to get the job done. I as only one person need to evaluate the shape of the ship of which I am sailing in. This ship is slowly sinking unless we can find the methods to repair it intime to keep it afloat.
I am one who is not easily frightened by words or actions such as threats; however this nuclear threat is a real one that needs to be evaluated for the ones sitting by the red button to pursue this action is not level headed, in fact they are sick puppies, to be for sure!
Thank each of you for your opinions of this topic..it really does give one a lot of thoughts for the day, indeed…hugs to all..