I was literally forced into the computer world in 1990, when my boss said, “Learn it or leave!” I did not go gently, for my nightmares informed me that damned thing would somehow absorb my fingers, then my face, then the rest of me and I would be forever trapped in that little box. (too many Sci Fi films in my past)
Later, at a difficult time of having to leave the work due to disability, I discovered the internet and internet “communities.” Called forums then, they were literally a sanity saver for me, and I settled into a large one for women, and felt I had finally found a “home” in a harsh physical world that seemed to have on further use for me at all.
I was so grateful for the warm welcome, and their eagerness to accept my skills as a group facilitator and a writer. I gave that place my ALL for a very long time. I met friends there I still have and cherish.
Then it all went to hell in a hand basket. Internal conflicts all over the place, power struggles, warring divas, you name it, there it was. Like any good “family peacemaker,” I waded in up clear to my chinny-chin-chin, just positive I could help fix it all. For months, so afraid of losing my only “home” where I could belong, I lived life practically tethered to my keyboard. All for naught. The site finally went down for good. My “community”, so much of my “life” at that point in time, just went “poof, and I was devastated.
Then I found another “home” on line: this time in the recovery community, and guess what? Again I was welcomed with wide open arms, and in no time at all was given a Coordinator position and voted onto the BOD. Ahhh. Home again, in a place I belonged where I could feel useful, and wanted, and valued. Boy was I grateful. And did I ever work my buns off for almost two years, enjoying it all.
Until that is, I crossed swords with the it’s supreme guru (I never did “mind” well) and guess who ended up on the curb, once again, burned out, pissed to the max, and once again “homeless.”
Ok, I learn slowly, and hearly alwasys the hardest way possible, but eventually, I DO learn, and finally saw there was a need for a life in the 3D world, in addition to life online, and spent some time building one. I maintaied at a healthy emotional distance from any online community over involvement for quite awhile.
But then, I discovered a big liberal political blog, and thought for certain I’d died and gone to some kind of cyber heaven! NEVER had I see so many “like others”: people who felt like I did about the state of our nation. So, forgetting all the hard lessons learned, once again , my yearning to “belong” led me straight into another (subconscious) emotional over- attachment.
That “awakening” REALLY stung hard, and hit some very vulnerable scar tissue, when I was forced face to face with the harsh reality that so many of my trusted liberal brothers weren’t all that different from the other kind, and I really was only welcome there as long as I stayed in my reassigned “pew.”
OK. That REALLY was the last straw for this ol gal, in terms of believing in the illusion of online “community” as any kind of permanent place for ME. Three times and out!
I have very much enjoyed my time this particular pond place so far, and have written extensively about why I found it such a pleasant place to be. So many wonderful people I have come to know, through their contributions over time. I have learned much from you all, and hope to learn and share even more as time goes on. You have all made me feel welcome and valued on this website and in your midst.
But now I view `community sites” such as this more as meeting places, than a potential permanent community for myself. I hand out at community blogs as if they were meeting places where I can find others I can relate with, learn from, share with for as long as I want to stay. I usually choose to hang around awhile anywhere I can find stimulating, constructive discussions and interactions on issues that concern us all so much now. I like exchanging positive and constructive energies and info with good people in ways that just might actually do some GOOD in the larger world in time.
I just can’t do that if I get emotionally invested and embroiled in community conflicts, and there are ALWAYS going to be those, in all communities everywhere.
I like finally understanding that for me anyway, “community” is not a “place” or any one community website. It is a state of being “one with” like others. on the non material plane internally, in my own heart spaces and theirs.
My own form of community is getting larger all the time, and it is full of those special others I have met and bonded with from all sorts of URL locations over the years. Some of you have settled permanently here at Boo, some in other online communities, where I know where to find you . Others, like me, tend to roam around hither and yon. where we often meet up at wonderful unexpected times. ( Cyber-gypsies of a sort? Itinerant bloggers? )
My clue as to when I need to make some space between myself and any particular online community for awhile, is when I begin to become over -invested emotionally, in whatever the current whitewater may be. When that old desire to “fix things” or “change how people feel” becomes somewhat of an emotional compulsion, it’s time. When I start feeling like I need to “convince” someone to stay, or to take sides between people fighting with each other, I’ve become too over-invested again, for my own good.
I am not saying anything negative here about the benefits of blog communities like BooTrib or about those who DO embrace them as “true community” for themselves. I love seeing this in action, and watching the warmth and sense of belongingness flow around places like the ol Froggy Bottom, and on the threads, bringing folks closer together.
It’s a bit harder to see and sense the pain some people feel so often, however, when something goes haywire, because I also know how badly that can hurt. Hard lessons usually do sting pretty bad for awhile, and we all have our share to master. I think that’s really ok, if difficult, as long as they’re “growing” pains.
What absolutely astonishes me is that with ONLY the written word, ( without any of the other 60% of the (non verbal) communication cues we get in face to face contact,) that everyone does SO WELL in being able to communicate enough TO form communities and to bond up with each other as we do! Says a lot about what is missing, and what we need to do more of, and how able to do so we really ARE, even if limited mediums like this.
For me, it’s all about taking responsibility for balancing my own life, overall. (Not yours or anyone else’s either, just mine!) I’d say I need at least a 70/30 distribution of my life energy, with 70% of my life lived out in my face to face world and face to face reltionships with others, and no more than 30% lived out in my online world. I admit this is not always easy to maintain, but easier when I remain aware of the addictive qualities of the internet. (for me) Then I can use my tried and true recovery maintenance tools…like the old self-awareness switch kept firmly in the “on” position! And so we each go “Onward”, on our own unique paths to learning whatever we need to learn, finding heart-mates all along the way.
Thank you dear wise one for another eye opening, heart opening post. What you write is so true. I so appreciate your sharing your experiences here with us. I have to take a deep breath, a step back and look at my part in all I say and do. I tend to over invest myself(another person in recovery)at times. Thank you for helping me see that once again.
I’ve noticed that recoverying folks tend to be pretty passionate about many things..:) I’ll hit a quarter centruy mark in June, and my conclusion is that an un=anesthetized life in one big long juggling act and you never get to put your balls down for long at a time! (grin)
Ain’t that the flipping truth!!
I’ve had similar investments. Like you I was forced from work due to a disability and internet communities seemed such a godsend. Over time I have learned not to place too much of my emotional well being in the hands of a url. People do not relate online the same way they do in person, and for those of us, like you and I, who wish to preserve, and moderate ill feeling, it can be very devastating emotionally. That may be part of the reason I tend to avoid squabbles that occasionally arise here: I’ve seen how easily they can turn into destructive spirals which does no one any good, least of all me and my own well being. Perhaps it’s selfish on my part or just a symptom of burnout but I feel less oif a desire to get deeply entangled in what I’ve come to see are inevitable conflicts.
I respect everyone here, including those who don’t agree with me, but I have no energy for flame wars, or for patching up wounds, mine or those of others. Ijn that sense I have burned out from my original instinct to jump in and try to help everyone stay friends. I admire those who perform that function, but it is too hard for me at this stage of my life.
Actually, I think your way is really more unselfish than selfish, Steve. Because if we get all whacked out via over-involvement emotionally, we weaken ouselves,our immunes systems, and our (alreadyu impaired) bodies. Then what good are we going to be to anyone..or even to ourselves?
At the end of that one experence, my doc asked me a wake up question, after taking a blood pressure reading. She said, casually..”I wonder. Is that stressful thing you are involved with online worth having a stroke over?” Duh! No.
Scribe, always thought your diary On Community Conflicts one of the more sane discussions of the evolution of any community/team, what can work, and what can tear them apart.
I’d forgotten all about that diary. Thanks for bringing it back up here. (I see I chose there to only share the GOOD parts of that one expeience I referred to above..andleft out how it ended!)
Thanks for sharing your thoughts & experience here, scribe.
Yes indeed — in terms of OL community, as with all things, balance is key.
As another individual in recovery, I might venture to say that addictive types tend to have balance flaws that do need minding.
I’m also disabled, and the internet is something for which I am deeply grateful because it allows me both contact and connection with people that I need, and would have precious few other opportunities to get. Of course, I’m a huge geek, too, so I like it on its own pure merits as well.
I don’t mind debate and sometimes even enjoy it very much, but once things turn nasty, ugly, or hostile, I stay the hell out of it. I also grew up in an abusive home where there was near constant war, sometimes hot and sometimes cold, and I have no desire to spend my adult life this way, embroiled in open hostility and/or the kind of passive-aggressive hostility that people who engage in generally deny is actually hostility. It is not productive or good for me in any way, shape, or form.
I would feel this way anyway, I think, but I feel this way especially because one of the diseases I have is autoimmune adrenal disease, and stress can trigger adrenal crisis, which is damned serious. So avoiding hostile conflict, again whether the open sort or the passive-aggressive “plausibly deniable” sort, is a matter of health for me not just emotionally, but in a very real physical way. Again, I don’t mind a disagreement or a spirited debate — spice of life, and sometimes I enjoy those things very much — but I hate to fight with people, especially with people with whom I agree more than disagree, and I don’t get into flamewars, period. By and large, I’m here at political blogs (and other potentially contentious forums, like feminist blogs) to seek common ground so we can find the numbers to be a force for the kinds of changes we can all mostly agree on.
That said, to each their own. Just as I don’t need the hostility, neither do I have any need to tell someone else who is right or wrong, in which ways, or how they ought to behave. No matter what anyone else says or does, everyone else is ultimately going to decide for themselves how they’re going to behave anyway. Yeah, I’m one of those “be the change you’d like to see in the world” freaks. š
(Yeah, I’m one of those “be the change you’d like to see in the world” freaks. š
Oh, for more and more freaks like YOU! (grin)
Seriously, the kind of stress that can be caused by flame wars etc..isn’t good for ANYONE. The link between ongoing high stress levels and impairment of even healthy immuns systems is well established one as a cause of increased suseptability to illness.
You make alot of sense, dear scribe.
Communities are any group of people you find yourself in at any given moment. All of us circulate in and belong to many communities throughout our day. I’m in my family community, my neighborhood community, the community of people I work for and with, the community of people I see each day at the grocery store and post office, the community of parents of my kids friends, etc.
And I’m a member here and at dKos and MLW and occasionally at Street Prophets.
What I love is the almost infinite variety of people I have an opportunity to visit with through these online communities. Where else could I meet a famous author, a snotty old man who pisses people off regularly but who writes pure poetry while he’s doing it, assorted computer geeks, college professors, college students, pharmacists, and to be truthful here in my sheltered suburban life, lesbians and gay men with dogs named after divas?
And if that wasn’t awesome enough, I have met people that I want to have in my real life and fully intend on making sure that happens.
And I’ve met a few asshats, but they make things interesting.
The way I look at them is: what if an asshat gave a party and no one showed up?
Ah, isn’t it so, dear Scribe!
It is an interesting learning curve, but one most all of us seem to go through. I have found for myself that it is not only the “war of the words” and the hurt feelings of impassioned disagreement, but very often there are times the “star energy” in me just tells me I am being neglectful of things far more important to my personal growth. I honor the nudges and intuitive pulls that direct me elsewhere whenever they come. I know at times others are somewhat disappointed in my periods of absence when I seem to be not so actively involved here or other places. . .but it is the cycle of things in my particular life that lead me where I need to place my attention at any given moment in time.
It does not mean I am any less concerned or passionate about the problems of the day. It merely means there are other things of great importance in my life and I must honor them as well.
Each of us goes through our own discovery of how to balance our life and our involvement in any community, whether virtual or face to face. If we listen to what we are hearing from our inner-self-guidance, we will know what needs we have that we will benefit from paying attention to.
None of us can “fix it” for another. Taking sides has not much benefit. Supporting those who are hurting is something our caring hearts reach out instinctively to do. Support does not mean fixing or taking sides. It just means loving.
When the elements of your life are keeping you in turmoil or anger, it is a good time to stop and take an honest look at what that is and how you should honor what your true needs are.
The heart connections made here and at other places are beautiful and worthy of my time and participation. It is the WONDERFUL part of online communities. Those are lasting, and makes all other aspects more than worthwhile.
Big hugs all
Shirl
Whether or not a group of people meeting regularly online can be a community is really something that can be debated. But what really interests me is that I think we in this culture are seriously struggling with the fact that we have lost most of the deep knowledge of what “community” means in any sense.
Again, this is my opinion, but I think we have evolved into a culture that is so individually focused and with such little tolerance for difference and conflict, that we have no sense of what community means.
Think about cultures in the past where members of a community could not just walk away. How did they do things differently and what might they know that we have forgotten? Or maybe being able to walk away is a positive evolutionary move. I don’t know. But these are the questions that I have.
Scribe, your writing is once again brilliant and to the point.
To use a musical metaphor, I think online communities are like Gamelan Orchestras…an ancient pre-islamic Javanese musical form with it’s roots in the 15 th. C., composed of tuned percussion instruments, sounding, to the western ear…impetuous and cacophonic.
Unlike these orchestras, the online communities have no historical
structures to guide them, and as such are establishing, through trial and error, a 21st.C. system of communication and dissemination of opinion, information, and, hopefully, influence.
One does not have to agree with the premise or opinion that has been expressed by the writer in any form of media. However, the responsive capabilities inherent in Scoop sites such as BT, MLW, dKos, and others can lead to issues, extraneous in my opinion, of people feeling attacked for their personal value(s), resulting in all manner of unpleasantness for all involved, either directly or indirectly.
The magic, if you will, of ‘online communities’ is the opportunity they present for interaction, learning and growth on an intellectual level. Personal insults, ad hominen attacks and GBCW missives serve no purpose, nor does it serve one well to become over involved emotionally. BT, in particular, is about sharing, exploring and learning from one another in an environment where manners are required.
Not having the experiences that others have had relative to it’s germinal manifestations, it is my opinion that the development of whatever strengths are inherent in the URL Media world is best served by civil discourse and open mindedness.
I do not agree with everyone here, but I do respect them and attempt to interact with, and treat them accordingly. I do not, and will not, take sides, engage in flame wars and rating abuse, nor do I condone the actions of those that do. I do expect that consideration in return.
AG has a very good diary at MLW regarding this issue that I highly recommend and hope that he sees fit to post here given the current discussions.
Since I started off with a musical metaphor, perhaps it is appropriate I end with one…a brief quote from an exchange between Miles Davis and ‘Trane”…goes like this (may not be exact):
Miles: “How come you play so long?”
Trane: “Sometimes I just don’t know how to end a solo.”
Miles: “Take the fucking horn out of your mouth!”
Done.
Peace
Ok, I’ve had a couple of beers, but your story resonates. The internet was a blessing for me when my spouse left me with a 2 yr old and all my friends decided I was uncool. After 10+ years, I have lond since learned not to get too close, though I was singed by the Pie Wars, too.
So, I met some Tribbers and it was great, but I do know that we will not always agree and that is ok by me. I am happy to have met them and all of you by extension.
I am on a Haiku kick tonight:
The pond sometimes screams
Harsh voices drown out reason
Are you listening?
Fours all around.
Thank you, Scribe…. and thank you all.
ONward!!