First off, I’m sorry for my lack of involvement in the Boomunity, but I was incredibly busy at work making up for time I was taking off to go on job interviews, but it all paid off and I now have a wonderful new job working for an awesome local non-profit here in Philly. But even with the craziness at the old job and the first few days at the new job, I couldn’t be kept at bay from commenting on the circus which is Meet the Press with a dash of insanity and clowniness provided by Sen. Man on Dog and the son of the former governor of Pennsylvania…
Is Tim Russert even part of “The Media” anymore? I’m not sure this should be categorized as such, but what the hell.
I’ve been busy lately and I’ll be getting busier, but that didn’t prevent me from watching the Casey-Santorum debate on Meet the Press on Sunday. Being busy did prevent me from posting ahead of time and watching it during it’s initial 10.30a airing, but I caught it at 10p and didn’t forget to do so. I hope others did too. Not to have learned anything or to have seen either candidate show themselves as valiant representatives of this state of Pennsylvania. Rather, to see the shit that is left over in the political system today. Representing the two sides [and of course, there are ONLY two sides to any debate] we had on the Right, Sen. Man on Dog who is so fucking crazy I don’t know where to begin, but as our governor, the Hoagiemeister himself proclaimed, that fucker delivers for PA like a motherfucker. And on the Right-of-Center, we had PA Treasurer Junior Casey who is so boring, I was eager to have him stop yapping so that Man on Dog could say something completely batshit crazy again. Now, onto my version of a recap and yes, a whole shitload of cursing will follow, this politics shit ain’t for the feint of heart nor ear. The full transcript is available here.
First off, let me describe the scene. There was Mr. Potato Head [Russert] sitting there with so much orange-red faux-tan makeup that he looked like he was about to explode. His Peter Griffin head popping out of his shirt which was fastened with a green and blue diagonally striped tie. Junior was seated furthest from the camera with a new haircut, short all over, with a light blue, weak, tie. Man on Dog looked like he’s let his hair grow out a bit, not as put together as normal, with a blood red tie.
The forty-five minutes of slapstick comedy started off with a very simple question from Mr. Potato Head to Junior: If you had known then what you know now, would you have supported the invasion of Iraq. It took about two minutes of muffled and bumbling stammering for Junior to not come up with a simple “Yes” or “No” to the answer. Stop trying to give some convoluted response to a simple fucking question. If I had my own television show, I’d need a shitload of insurance and a disclaimer that by coming onto my show, you put yourself in physical danger if you didn’t answer a direct question with a direct and clear cut answer. I would’ve slugged Junior four seconds into his response. His answer should’ve been “Fuck no Mr. Potato Head.” After the stammering he eventually said that if he had known then what he knew now [why the unnecessary repeating the question? It was like the old trick to buy yourself time while thinking of a lie] that he would not have supported the invasion of Iraq. He also added that he thought Rumsfeld should be replaced. The full bumbling:
MR. CASEY: Tim, on the war in Iraq, if, if, if a lot of Americans knew now—if they knew then what they know now, they would, they would have thought that this war was the war that shouldn’t have been fought based upon the misleading of this administration.
Here’s what I think has to happen in Iraq today.
MR. RUSSERT: So you would not vote for it today.
MR. RUSSERT: But in ’05 you said you’d vote for it. Would you today in ’06 vote for it?
MR. CASEY: Based upon the evidence that was presented then, yes, which I think has been—was misleading, and I think it was faulty. The intelligence was faulty.
MR. RUSSERT: But today, today is no. Today you would vote no.
MR. CASEY: Today—if we knew then what we know now, sure. I think there wouldn’t have been a vote and I think people would have changed.
What a way to start off a debate on national television. For what is supposed to be the highest priority Senate race for the Dems and the Repugs. The Dems have no message. Chroist.
I think Man on Dog mentioned something about how much of a pussy Junior was. Either that or something about him once losing a tongue ring while kissing so much ass down in the Beltway.
Potato Head moved on to the increasing sectarian violence in Iraq. Man on Dog went on and on about how Iran is behind it all and that they’re the ones stoking the sectarian fire in Iraq. He said that Iran is at the heart of the problem of the entire Middle East. He said that Iran, today, has more influence in Iraq than when Saddam Hussein was in power – did he just admit that Iraq is better off with Saddam Hussein in power?!?
Potato Head turns to Junior and reads aloud all the crazy stupid things he’s said about the war. I’ll give Junior this much, he’s come a ways since the primary on Iraq, but not close to far enough. Maybe he was hardheaded before, now, he’s just plain stupid. He’s got no plan and he’s not in favor of a timeline of any sort. Man on Dog wants to drop clusterbombs of heathenish dog-fucking gay people who have been irradiated with depleted uranium on the entire Middle East.
Potato Head moved on to the crazy talk by Man on Dog recently that they had found WMD in Iraq to confuse the stupid American public further. They had found old WMD, no new ones. Man on Dog agreed that there were no new WMD in Iraq – the main [secondary, after the one about how Saddam Hussein was behind the 9/11 attacks] reason for rolling into Iraq. The real reasons lie closer to BushCo running on sweet crude and that they tried to kill his daddy. Man on Dog kept on harping about how Iraq was this big threat to America and that we just had to invade while agreeing with BushCo that Iraq had “nothing to do with September 11th.”
Junior started talking about how he’d be a truly independent voice in Washington. Blech. The true independent who turns away money from Dan Savage but takes, with no hesitation, money from groups like these. Really nice. Not to say that Man on Dog is better. That idiot is just as stupidly hypocritical with his K St project involvement.
Then came the balanced budget and Social Security talk. How to balance the budget Potato Head asked. Fiscal responsibility, fiscal discipline, estate tax, repeal tax cut for top 1% and continued economic growth were Junior’s plans. Potato Head pressed for a list of programs Junior would cut to make it happen. Junior had no answer and rabid Man on Dog jumped on him for evading the question and accused him of dodging questions for the entire campaign [he has, but so has Man on Dog].
Potato Head read a quote from a paper during the Congressional campaign for Man on dog from twelve years ago about how he firmly believed that the age of eligibility for Social Security should be pushed back to at least 70 and that he’d try to push for a higher age, but didn’t think it would pass on the floor. Man on Dog noted that in the dozen years he’s served in Congress [in the House and Senate] that he had never introduced such a bill because he thinks there are better ways to solve the crisis [he still believes there’s a fucking crisis!]:
I think there’s a third option now that I have been an advocate for which my opponent opposes, and that’s personal retirement accounts. I have a three-step concrete approach to dealing with Social Security. Number one, pass the Social Security Guarantee Act, which I’m the author of, which says that if you’re born before 1950, your benefits cannot be changed and your cost of living increases are guaranteed. Number two, stop the raid introduced by Jim DeMint which says take the surplus that’s coming in right now and actually put it into individual accounts so people have ownership of this surplus instead of the money being taken and raided to pay for, for current government expenditures. So number two is to stop the raid, give people their own personal accounts that, that will actually be there to pay for them down the road. And number three, give younger workers the opportunity to have personal retirement accounts. Those personal retirement accounts will grow faster and produce more than what the government, “investment in Social Security,” thus making up the difference between the two.
So my question to Mr. Casey is, if you’re not for personal retirement accounts, which he says he’s not, how much are you going to raise their taxes? Or how much are you going to cut benefits to fix the Social Security problem?
And be specific.
Junior countered with some bumbling stuff, but he did manage to get in that there was no Social Security crisis. The only thing that just about all Dems can agree on, that there is no fucking crisis, and Junior could barely annunciate the words.
After the commercial break, Potato Head brought up the recent FDA decision to allow Plan B to be over the counter (OTC) for girls over 18. Man on Dog said that he was against it and that it could cause abortions. I’ll note here that while Asprin is supposed to relieve headaches and stuff, it can burn a hole through your liver stomach and also just plain kill you without warning. Junior said that he was in favor of the decision and said that OTC emergency contraceptives prevent unintended [he said “unwanted”] pregnancies. Now that’s good and all, but what happens if ECPs don’t work? Junior leaves the woman with no choice and wants to overturn Roe v Wade. Man on Dog would probably want to burn the woman at the stake regardless of, well, anything.
The final back and forth was about the issue of residency for Man on Dog over in Penn Hills. Man on Dog ran on the platform, back in 1990, that his opponent didn’t live in the district. He defended himself by saying that he did in fact own the house, pays taxes on the house and stays in the house spends approximately a month out of the year in the house. Yes, Man on Dog technically owns a house, but he lives in VA.
Junior had the final word and parted with his standby that Man on Dog votes 98% with Bush. Junior said very early on, or was it his smarmy Smar who said it, that this campaign wasn’t gonna be about issues [because there isn’t enough disagreement to make it so]. He wants this race to be about Man on Dog and his ass licking of BushCo. He may just pull it off. Man on Dog is that much of a fuckwad. But it’s sixty-four days before the election now and Junior is sinking like a hunk of lead. We’ll see what the pollsters say in the next couple of days after this national television appearance. Junior could’ve taken it to Man on Dog, but he’s chosen to just coast and not do anything. This is not the race to coast. But blame Ed Rendell, Chuck Schumer, Harry Reid and Peter Buttonweiser for the predicament Democrats in PA have right now.
Who else caught the insanity on the re-airs? Judging by this post many didn’t catch [or comment] before the 10p re-air. I’m gonna be out on the job for most of Labor Day, but I’ll check in as soon as I can on the thread and the rest of the site. I miss the gang.
I’m glad I missed it. I haven’t had any good feedback for any quarter.
As for the whole potato head thing…
I was watching Bush’s Brain this weekend. We’ll be promoting the movie and offering cheap downloads this week. And as I was watching it a fourteen year old looked at Rove and said:
“He looks like a potato. He’s Darth Tater.”
Now, that’s funny.
Darth Tater with flesh colored hair.
I was so tense waiting for Russert to finally shut-up so that I could hear someone else. Then Santorum would ramble on, and on, and on… I couldn’t wait to hear Casey’s remarks. And then he spoke …..I feel for the residents of PA.
Ugh, I’ve been hearing Casey stammer along for almost a year now.
you can see the debate at http://www.truthstream.org/?p=207
I do believe that I posted this yesterday but since you insist- here goes:
GOP=1
dem=0
Great start. the point you made that may well be the most important one is that the schumer, reid grouping has decided that it is better to be a shadow gov that try and openly govern!
We(the “progressives?) are going to suffer a loss of seats this Nov, NOT a gain.
billjpa
progressives lost this seat when Casey was nominated.
I’m sure glad I’m not in PA; this is a choice between two unacceptable options.
I’m in Cali where I get to worry about the Governator vs the invisible democrat. Not unacceptable but very uninspiring.
Junior did little to distinguish himself, true but Man on Dog came off a little rabid so that could have been a draw. I’m guessing Junior was told to coast, no waves, no mistakes (and with a lead, why not??) Also, what counts in these ‘debates’ is not what happens but the quotes they can pull out and use against each other. In this case Man on Dog may have lost on SS and the home thing. Junior hasn’t lost this race by any stretch, he just isn’t very compelling. Potato Head was terrible, like a third candidate instead of just asking the questions and drawing them out. The comment above on Darth Tater is great. Win the seat, then bring Junior around some.
And the lead is ever dwindling with the rabid Man on Dog firing up his base. It was supposedly an insurmountable 20 point margin. When it closed to around 10%, they said they knew the race would “tighten up” after the primaries. And now that it’s around 6% [margin of error was like 5%] they’re saying he’s still leading and that’s all that matters. Chroist that’s one hell of a drop. Coasting is just going to coast himself out of what was supposed to be a lock of a seat.
Junior’s gonna lose folks. I’ve been saying it for months. You poor saps in PA … the party fucked you good. Really good, hard and no damned lube for you. In fucking you, they’ve fucked us all.
It’s not enough to be NOT something. It’s not enough to be connected. It’s not enough to be a nicer CEO-owned whore.
Walk away, really. The national Donk party is dead … you’re voting for a walking corpse.
Furthermore, concerning the one possible bright spot about Casey’s social conservative positions on women’s rights, I now feel even more fearful of Mr. Casey. The argument between these 2 religious fundamentalists about at the moment of taking Plan B whether it works as a contraceptive of an abortion agent is absolutely scary and irrelevant to reality!!!!!! It’s a woman’s choice as to what happens to her body this early on in a potential pregnancy.
When two men vying for a powerful lawmaking office that effects everyone are arguing about an irrelevant point that can only be meaningful in fundamentalist religious circles, you know women and secular citizens are in deep shit no matter which one of these fundamentalist BOZOS wins.
If you’re a humanist, a feminist, a progressive or liberal or anarchist or socialist or pick-your-label voter in PA and you vote for Junior, you’re ratifying what they did to you. You’re cooperating in the continuing abandonment of REAL breathing born human beings in favor of big greedy organizations, whether they be businesses or churches.
Leave the line blank. Vote Green. Write in a local leader you admire. MAKE SURE YOU VOTE ON OTHER LINES WITH CANDIDATES YOU CAN SUPPORT.
Our only hope is to help, thru neglect, destroy the Reid/Clinton/Schumer/Emmanuel Demopublican Party. Our only hope is to understand that the national party is dead to us, to rebuild from the community up, to offer what support you can for the real leaders who’re fighting BOTH parties on our behalf in DC (rare as they are).
Vote for Casey, and you’re voting for a return to the 19th Century, for misogyny and patriarchy. Vote for Casey and you’re voting for an unjust world where your daughters, nieces and granddaughters will be slaves to their wombs.
You’re exactly right NG.
Good luck with the new job, Albert!
Thanks!
This should be funny. But its simply pathetic.
Two right hand only pencil necked geeks duking it out without either ever taking off their robes and showing their unsupportably frail intellectual frames.
I trust neither Casey nor Santorum with my wife’s constitutional rights.
I cannot trust either of them with my rights and the rights of the most oppressed peoples in America.
Right wing Casey vs. extreme right wing Santorum. No choice at all.
Casey was pathetic ill-prepared. Uninformed and thus disengaged from the issues which prevented him from offering the sound-bite answers needed to demonstrate depth in an issue. Anyone who understands their issues can define and defend them in debate style and format for the short attention span political consumer of today.
Santorum was his usual reprehensible self.
I am just glad that new voting machines make it easy to WRITE-IN None of the Above!
I’ll note here that while Asprin is supposed to relieve headaches and stuff, it can burn a hole through your liver
Other than the fact that ASA (Aspirin) can burn a whole in your stomach and not your liver, the dairy was marvelous! Sad in its truth, but marvelous to read.
Thank you, corrected.
ive said it along, jr is a cigar store indian,
he’s a fucking dunce.
This is an excellent post, Albert. As I was watching this demonstration of political idiocy and dysfunctionality I was recalling the time almost 2 years ago now when both Casey and Langevin were being shoved down our collective throats in the most insulting possible manner.
It was a telling moment. I distrust and question everything that comes out of the mouths of those operatives who promoted Casey so aggressively, every idiot who argued that running Casey “takes abortion off the table”. I despise them for their shallowness, their contempt for women and for their deliberate and cultivated ignorance. I want them to admit that they were wrong, that Casey is a disaster and that if they think about it it’s good that Langevin decided to drop out. I want them each to write ‘I was stupid and wrong’ 500 times on a chalk board. I want them to apologise directly to the women they insulted by telling us we were “selfish” if we didn’t vote for/financially support Casey.
Because this particular race is the best demonstration of ‘centrist’ operative stupidity and arrogance we’ve seen for a good long time and nobody, nobody who supported, promoted or encouraged this piece of crap ‘democrat’ in DC, PA or on the blogs has the right to brag that they’re ‘pragmatic’ or a leader.
And I’m sure Junior wouldn’t go on unless Roe v Wade was not to be brought up and it wasn’t brought up, nor abortion, aside from one quick mention of abortion during the Plan B discussion.
Based on what?
Despite not having to do so at all, Casey debated Pennacchio and Sandals twice. He’s signed up for at least four debates with Santorum.
I guess you’re still bitter that your candidate lost back in May, but that’s no excuse for making shit up.
I guess you’re still bitter that your candidate lost back in May, but that’s no excuse for making shit up.
Well, if you actually thought about it (rather than indulge in your characteristic personal attacks) you would see that Albert was not saying that Mr Casey hadn’t agreed to debates with Santorum, Albert was talking about the terms Mr Casey agrees to before he ‘debates’.
We all know that both Casey and Santorum would like to see abortion re criminalized. We likewise understand that Mr Casey and his supporters would prefer that the full creepy, religious right extent of his deeply unattractive wingnutism was not publicly displayed until after the election.
And you really believe that all the organizations whose debates were accepted agreed to such terms? Based on what? Has he ever ducked an abortion-based question?
Casey’s speaking at the Catholic University of American Law School in a week or so. I have a feeling this topic will come up.
And you really believe that all the organizations whose debates were accepted agreed to such terms?
what I believe is that Casey and his supporters would prefer that he expose his religious right wingnutitude as seldom as possible.
What I believe is that y’all hope to be able to lie and bully and triangulate enough to convince women voters in PA that Casey is God’s gift to their basic civil rights. Nothing like the big lie and a bit of bullying to ‘win’ an election.
What I also believe is that Albert’s a long time and well respected poster here and you’ve no business coming here and personally insulting him.
Albert and I have tussled elsewhere. We’re not exactly new to each other.
I agree with you that Casey would prefer to not discuss abortion during this race, and that his views on the issue are repugnant to both of us. But I think it takes a giant leap to go from that point to asserting that Casey therefore is forcing debate moderators to avoid the subject in order for him to appear. Neither Albert nor you nor anyone has presented any factual basis for such a claim.
Casey’s better than Santorum on women’s issues because of his support for Plan B, but that certainly doesn’t make him good.
I plan to vote for Casey on November 7 because he’s the best option available. How about you?
Albert and I have tussled elsewhere. We’re not exactly new to each other.
This is Booman’s blog and here Albert is well respected. The fact that you have ‘tussled’ with him (and me) elsewhere does not give you leave to personally insult him here or even remotely provide an excuse for such behavior.
The crack about “bitterness” may not have been called for, but I stand behind the basic assertion — there’s no support for his claim that Casey’s ducking any questions or any debate.
Pennacchio himself made similar false charges about Casey demading such terms prior to the primary debates, which he later recanted — and Casey certainly discussed abortion at those debates: “‘If you have that position on an important issue like abortion, you can’t say Roe v. Wade was rightly decided,’ Casey said”
People here in the burbs saw the MTP appearance, and are asking if Casey really is the best candidate they could come up with, especially in light of how badly everyone wants Santorum out. Anecdotal, but true.
This is about being bitter over the anointing of Casey in general, not about who won the primary. He had no real competition, thanks to the clearing of the field. If/when your anointed candidate follows his usual pattern of having a big lead in the polls, which he promptly blows by (a) not campaigning until the last minute, and (b) boring everyone to death when he opens his mouth, are you going to blame it on all the bitter Pennacchio/Sandals supporters?
Considering that they only comprised 15% of the folks voting in the Democratic primary, I think you need to come up with a better excuse.
Casey’s not my ideal candidate, and if he loses it’s his fault, not the 15% who chose to support a different primary candidate. That said, Santorum spent $5M uncontested on ads and couldn’t affect his favorables one bit, as I blogged on the orange site:
I’m not a huge Casey fan, but he is our nominee, and he’s doing pretty well. I’d just prefer that attacks on him be based on facts.
I’m not a huge Casey fan
This comes as news to me. Before the primaries you were filling me in on the Casey nom ‘strategy’ of ‘taking abortion off the table’ and joining those who trashed NARAL and personally attacked the women who were horrified to see a Democratic party so compromised and spineless as to actually try to sell us this piece of crap. Some of those were calling us “selfish” for refusing to support him. Was it after the primaries when you changed your mind?
but he is our nominee, and he’s doing pretty well.
I guess that you don’t understand. There is no ‘our’ in this case. Men who would sell out the basic civil rights of women are neither trustworthy or allies.
Go back to the first diary I think I posted about the race — I always wanted someone else to step in and challenge Casey.
I don’t believe I ever criticized Naral for its activities, either here or in Rhode Island (indeed, I’m one of the few who at the time who tried to justify its Chafee endorsement), and certainly don’t believe I attacked any women personally for opposing Casey.
Barbara Hafer fled this race a day after she swore she wouldn’t back down, and Joe Hoeffel was too loyal to Rendell and the establishment to stay and fight this one. They’re the ones to be disappointed in as well.
Given that these are the choices remaining, Casey and a Democratic Senate are more likely to protect against selling out the basic civil rights of women than would be reelecting Santorum, no?
I don’t believe I ever criticized Naral for its activities, either here or in Rhode Island (indeed, I’m one of the few who at the time who tried to justify its Chafee endorsement), and certainly don’t believe I attacked any women personally for opposing Casey.
I said you joined in with those who did.
What you did was try to triangulate.
How was anyone already established supposed to step in when he had the field cleared for him before entering?
Chuck and Alan were the only ones with the balls to do it.
Very simple — they didn’t have to agree to clear the field. No one put a gun to their heads, and people run against “annointed” candidates all the time.
Actually, it goes back even earlier, in a diary in which you commented.
I only supported Casey when the other viable Dems decided to back out of the race, but it has never been eagerly, and I haven’t given his campaign (or the DSCC) a dime.
Puh-lease, blaming people for not voting for a guy because he stands on the other side of so many issues from them? Voting for a Dem just because s/he calls her/himself a Dem is not a way to live. Running as “I’m not [fill in name here]” doesn’t work.
if he loses it’s his fault, not the 15% who chose to support a different primary candidate
Was that not clear?
I probably should’ve said I’m suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuure with some serious sarcasm involved.
No, I’m not bitter my candidate lost in May, I’m over that. Maybe you’re bitter that your candidate is shit?
But you gotta question why it wasn’t brought up, eh? It’s a rather hot topic.
Abortion was totally discussed during the debate. Read the transcript. The environment wasn’t, free trade wasn’t, labor issues weren’t, affirmative actions and civil rights weren’t, gay rights weren’t . . . . want to guess why?
been reading the “great debate” commentary and as sad as it is I think that it is quite illuminating on at least one point. The dems in this country are just as screwed up as the repugs! Pa is going to lead the way an after the dust has cleared, the dems will have to smell that fresh coffee and then get on with the job of forming a new party- one that will truly represent the 98% of the folks in this country that are getting screwed in one way or another by the pukes in the whitehouse!
billjpa
Bob Casey can’t be trusted with my wife’s rights. We all know that.
Considering the way he has obstructed the third party candidate’s ballot access, Casey can’t be trusted with my democratic choices and rights.
Constitutional and democratic values are all that is important to me in elections.
Bob Casey cannot be trusted to respect the democratic and constitutional rights of people. His record is consistent.
Rick Santorum is a non starter. A theo-fascist thug.
That leaves Carl Romanelli Carl Romanelli