As far as I can tell, Senator Reid is preparing to ignore Senator Dodd’s ‘hold’ on any FISA bill that includes telecommunications corporations’ immunity. He will introduce the Intelligence Committee’s bill that includes immunity and then ‘automatically substitute’ the Judiciary Committee’s version that does not include immunity. This is intended to trick you and me into believing that Dodd’s ‘hold’ is being respected. The Senate will then debate the Judiciary bill and amendments to that bill.
If we succeed in defeating any and all amendments that seek to introduce immunity, the bill will go to a final vote (obviously preceded by a vote on cloture to cut off debate). At this point the Republicans may refuse to invoke cloture. If they do, the bill will probably be pulled and the Senate will move on to other things. But if the Republicans are smart, they will vote to invoke cloture. The Senate will then proceed to a vote. Perhaps the Democrats will remain united, and the FISA bill without immunity will pass. But then we’ll hit an improvised explosive device. The Senate will then have to vote to approve the just passed Judiciary version of the bill as the substitute for the underlying base bill…the Intelligence bill that provides for immunity. If the Republicans can defeat the substitution, then the bill will revert to the Intelligence version of the bill.
Why does this matter?
The key here is to give us the advantage. If we do this right, we can introduce a bill without immunity and it will be a choice of voting for that bill or getting nothing. If we do it wrong, we will introduce a bill with immunity and have to filibuster it to prevent passage.
If the base bill has no immunity, it will require sixty votes to introduce immunity. If the base bill has immunity, it will require 41 votes (because of the filibuster rules) to keep it from passing. Depending on how Reid introduces the bill, we can prevail with 41 votes, or fail because we cannot get 60.
The reason Reid is doing this in a way that requires 60 is because he wants to pass something. And the only way he can pass something is to pass exactly what the president wants…which includes immunity. So, he has decided to choose a path that will deceive us about whether or not he is honoring Senator Dodd’s hold, and deceive us about whether he made a good faith effort to prevent immunity.
I am not happy to come to these conclusions, and the reality probably is that Harry Reid doesn’t have the support within the caucus that he would need pursue a strategy of not passing a new FISA bill. The law will sunset in February and too many within the caucus are afraid to let the law sunset.
Nevertheless, we are being set up to not recognize this capitulation for what it is. And I am not happy about it.
“Nevertheless, we are being set up to not recognize this capitulation for what it is. And I am not happy about it.”
This has been posted for only a few minutes, & already that makes two of us.
See why voting makes no difference. There is only one party in the usa and it is the RSP! The Rubber Stamp Party!
BULLSHIT!
We need a new majority leader. Now how do we push for a new election and at least let Reid know we are not amused.
Energy Bill stripped of removal of ending of oil company tax break. Yeah, I’ll vote!
Sure- When pigs fly!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
these people, with few exceptions, are beneath contempt. way to go harry, yesterday it was going to be january before the bill came to the floor, now this, and as dodd comes back to filibuster he’s forced to do it over the weekend when as greenwald says:
but yhey can continue to pass really important stuff that caters to the religious right…you know, that 30% of the country that’s batshit crazy:
Bah, Humbug!
lTMF’sA
Anyone know who the 9 are that voted NO?
roll call…interesting that 50 others voted ‘present’ or abstained.
lTMF’sA
Thanks.
What a stupid rediculous thing to do. I can’t believe we elect these people over and over again….
They are feeling the heat at Reid’s office right now.
I called up Dodd’s office and explained that I support Dodd’s hold, and that I am angry with reid for ignoring it. I asked that if Dodd is unable to stop this bill that he use his position as chair of banking to retaliate against reid. Reid’s approval ratings in Nevada are shit right now, and that Dodd has a real opportunity to make Reid’s life hell if his will is thwarted.
Then I called reid’s office and told them about my conversation with Dodd’s office. I also told them that there’s going to be a campaign in Nevada to dislodge the Senator if the SIC bill is passed.
The woman on the phone was flustered and rude. She also sounded nervous.
Next call was to Casey: he’s leaning against immunity, and is on the Banking Committee with Dodd. I reminded him that if he doesn’t back up Dodd, Dodd can screw up his priorities, and that would be bad for Pennsylvanians. I’ll be calling up reid’s office again later today.
Keep the calls coming: 202-224-3542.
Reid’s gotta pay for this. Bush-loving Democrats need to go down: Landrieu looks like she might be losing her election, hahaha, maybe Reid can be next.
It’s interesting that Reid is a Mormon. He converted to Mormonism as a college student! That makes him wackier than Romney.
But liberals are not supposed to think that this kind of thing matters. If Democrats paid as much attention to religion as Republicans, Reid could never have become Majority Leader. A liberal Mormon is a contradiction in terms.
Booman, you’ve said that Christianity is just as irrational as Mormonism. You could only say that because you don’t know enough about Mormonism. Here is an enlightening piece by Lawrence O’Donnell that can help you on that score: Romney & Me.
A Mormon has to believe everything in the Book of Mormon. If he doesn’t, he stops being a Mormon. Christianity, except for its fundamentalist strands, is not like that. You should recognize this difference.
And it is perfectly legitimate to bring up Romney’s religious beliefs in a political discussion (if not Reid’s), because Romney himself brought his faith up.
Carnacki rocks.
Dear Senator (Casey & Specter):
I am dismayed to find that Sen. Reid is playing games with the FISA bill, attempting to sabotage Sen. Dodd’s commitment to filibuster any version that authorizes immunity for telecommunication companies that may have knowingly or unknowingly violated the law by assisting in the monitoring of US Persons without proper authority.
We must stand up for the rights guaranteed by the Fourth Amendment. We can not allow companies that violated those rights to walk away without explaining their actions and how those actions came about.
It is not that immunity is something unattainable, but is must be offered only in exchange for cooperation. It should be offered as a carrot, and if necessary used as a stick, but it should not be just given away for nothing.
Please encourage all parties involved to support only the Judiciary committee version as the basis for FISA legislation.
Thank you for your time.
Sincerely,
[me]
i’ve repeatedly implored my united states senator and the leader of the democratic majority in the united states senate to take a strong stand for the rule of law and the u.s. constitution and what follows is a good example of what i’ve gotten back…
he needs your call marcus, because he needs to go to the caucus with a list of thousands of calls and convince them to let the law sunset.