Wait. Nearly 70% of liberal Democrats support the president’s tax deal with the Republicans? Can anyone find one of them in nature? I haven’t seen or read anything from any liberal that is supportive of the deal beyond the most grudging acknowledgment that the deal is better than expected. Permanently low marginal tax rates on the rich means we get to pay for the operation of the government with debt and Social Security surplus money that won’t be paid back. And gutting the Estate Tax doesn’t mean smaller government, it means a more indebted government and a more stratified society. No, I do not believe that 70% of liberals support the deal. They may support the president, but not this deal.
About The Author
BooMan
Martin Longman a contributing editor at the Washington Monthly. He is also the founder of Booman Tribune and Progress Pond. He has a degree in philosophy from Western Michigan University.
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You need to install a carbon monoxide detector in your cabin, because something has clearly clouded your otherwise coherent thinking. Why can’t you accept that most Americans, including most so-called liberals, are more concerned with giving tax breaks to the middle class and more importantly giving as much safety net to the unemployed than keeping rich folks from getting them?! It’s not that you’re just in denial. You are acting uncharacteristically arrogant!
Geezus, you are a dumbfuck.
Tell that to the unemployed who have been unemployed for more than 99 weeks in states with unemployment over 8.5% this deal does nothing to them. The government still doesn’t care if they starve and die.
Give me a break are you kidding? You ignore every argument on how we should have made the Repugs show their asses by making them vote over and over against unemployment.
You ignore the fact these unemployed have may have just lost a significant amount of their Social security with this idiotic tax holiday. It will be used against us in the when they begin to dismantle it. You can freaking believe that. We are the ones that want to extend benefits it should never have been part of a “compromise.” The whole middle class has been compromised by this deal.
Why are you playing dumb on this?
Perhaps I do, NMP, if only to protect me from the smoke you’re trying to blow up my ass!
Number 1, I no longer live in your dumb fuck country, nor would I ever want to live there any longer, since the majority of you can neither think or act. You sniffle and wail about the most stupid shit I could ever imagine and for the most part you refuse to stand up and fight for your rights that you have managed to piss down the Reich Wing Drain.
I retired from the US Navy in 1974 after seeing where the Government and the Military were heading. I could have stayed in for another 10 years and increased my retirement more than double with all the bennies that were added and gained in the 10 years that I had been transferred to the Fleet Reserve. I saw the Religious Right begin their end run around the separation of Church and State and the start of the Repig idiots idol worship of St. Raygun the effing empty suit that destroyed the Air Controllers Union without a whimper from the general populace (Because, it WASN’T happening to them). I could see the handwriting on the wall and knew that it was only a matter of time before ignorance and stupidity would rule and the Country of my birth would become a Banana Republic.
I look today at the small percentile of Reich Wing Xtian Fundies who control your Senate and House with their Chaplains who in my opinion should be horsewhipped from their respective chambers, down the halls and down the steps of both the House and the Senate. From there they should be tarred and feathered and rode out of town on a rail and dumped unceremoniously in the first drainage ditch alongside the highway and told that if they ever returned to town they would be shot on sight. If it isn’t the effing Churches controlling you it is the Very Rich and the Corporations. You are totally lost and I doubt that there is even a million to one chance that you will ever be able to regain your footing. Your Education System is in Shambles, the Stupid South writes the school books and they teach NOTHING. You have the intellectual level today of a 10 year old in Europe. You are cowards for the most part and you allow the various Rich Repig Bullies to control everything without raising an eyebrow.
No, where I live now the government is both respectful and afraid of the Commons. We DO stand up to be counted and when we do we usually do some damage to those who oppose us.
Personally, I feel that all these gains that President Obama and his sidekicks in the Rethugliklann Party have managed to push to the forefront should be voted null and void and from there we can get back to a 75-90% taxation rate for the Rich, Throw the Corporations out of the Government and tax all that have moved their companies outside the country to avoid their true responsibilities.
No, in todays America the corporation rules all and with the latest Supreme Court’s ruling that Corporations can donate unlimited amounts to politicians, You will never have a just government for the people as the Corporations will never allow you to influence government again..
I would much rather be poor and live in Freedom than be even moderately wealthy and live in Fascism!
“A slender 11 percent of those polled back all four of the deal’s primary tax provisions: an across-the-board extension of Bush-era tax cuts, additional jobless benefits, a payroll tax holiday and a $5 million threshold for inheritance taxes. Just 38 percent support even two of the components. “
The poll indicates that 11% favor the bill. The reporter, who is a moron, interprets the statements in an OR clause. The bill is an AND clause.
No, the result of question 15 in the poll is that 69% of those polled back the deal taken as a whole.
you need to get outside the poutosphere.
I wouldn’t begin to know what most people think, or what the poll “really means”. I do think the fact that the Center for Budget and Policy Priorities has a study out saying the deal will keep 2 million people out of poverty next year is something we’ve got to take seriously. And by take seriously I mean: what’s a winnable (i.e., will pass both houses of Congress, including a 60 vote Senate supermajority) deal that will keep more people out of poverty next year?
Boo — I didn’t see a breakdown in the poll as to political persuasion.It’s probable that a smaller than 70% fraction of liberal democrats in the polling sample supported the plan. plan.
It’s really simple Booman. Most liberals remain invested in liberal ethics, like helping the poor and making the tax system more equitable, and in liberal economics like salvaging stimulus. Only in the poutosphere do you find a number of people who think of politics as some obscure test of manhood or metaphor for sexual domination or whatever it is that motivates these people.
How does this deal make the tax system more equitable?
Payroll tax holiday – payroll tax is grossly regressive.
The best way to make it less regressive is to extend the tax to income over the current cap.
that’s actually a terrible way to do it, because it cannot be passed by the congress.
I consider more regressive the exact opposite of equity. Equity here means fair and not equal.
This deal is not fair.
It comes down to how to how you define liberal. A liberal in 1975 is a socialist in today’s climate. A moderate Republican in 1975 is a liberal in today’s climate.
I would also ask what was the pol’s methodology re: how were the questions asked. That could have a lot to do with it.
For example: Do you support the President’s compromise with Republicans to extend the Bush tax cut for the people earning over $250,000 if it is the only way to ensure tax relief for people under $250,000?
Vs.
Do you agree with the President’s compromise with Republicans to extend the Bush tax cut for the people earning over $250,000?
The answer to the first could be quite a bit different than the answer to the latter.
Finally, how much do most people who don;t follow politics on a regular basis really know about the details of the tax cut deal, i.e.e, the estate tax benefits, the business tax cuts, the 1 year social security tax cut, etc.? A poll that asks open ended questions that identify what people actually know about the the deal would be useful. I suspect a majority or a at least a plurality of people do not know anything about the deal other than the tax cuts are extended and unemployment benefits are extended, but I’d like to see some data to indicate the general public’s awareness of all the items included in the bull.
Went and looked at the poll questions. They are of limited informational value, nor do they explore what the people who answered the questions knew about the deal before they were asked these questions.
Boo, should have included this statement from the Post story:
I also note that the answers to all the poll questions are not given but are “withheld for future release.” So we have no way to decide how they identified “liberal Democrats” vs. all Democrats.
my guess is because the overwhelming majority of people get their news in small doses from local media affiliates who don’t go into detail the repercussions of ever piece of the deal. All they hear is “lowers taxes for the middle class” and/or don’t believe that the GOP would actually succeed in killing off Social Security in the future.
“No, I do not believe that 70% of liberals support the deal.”
-poll is lawed.
-poll asks people to self-identiy as Liberals, but those that are for the deal by definition can’t be Liberals
Maybe it’s time to commission a poll to get the results we desire. I hear there’s a hungry, unemployed pollster working out of a Kinko’s.
Kevin Drum
I’m going with (e).
Young guy at work tells me “that money has already been taxed once.” If that is an argument against it the I won’t buy so much as a candy bar because my money was already taxed once and the only way not to have it taxed again is to bury it in the back yard.
Then, get this, he had never heard of the minimum amount before an estate tax kicks in. Be it 1 million, 3.5 million or the latest 5-10 million. He says “You mean if my grandmother leaves me $1500 dollars there is no tax?” They don’t understand and are bored by the details. Fox Spews neglected to fill him in on the minimum taxable amounts.
Patrick Moynihan said it best before he died. When asked the number one problem people will face in the future he replied “Dealing with complexity.”
I think it is how you identify “support.”
As a standalone, divorced from political realities, do I think this deal is any good? No.
Do I like the idea of extending the Bush tax cuts to the wealthy elite? Hell no!
Do I like the idea of reviving only a limited estate tax? Hell no, it should go back to 2001 levels adjusted for inflation.
However, would I vote for the compromise as a member of this Congress or tell a pollster that I support its passage? Yes.
Why?
Because it is the only realistic way, given continued Republican hostage taking, to get unemployment benefits extended for 7 million Americans, expansion of the EITC, and some economic stimulus. In addition, imagine what the next Congress, with a Republican House majority and six more seats in the Senate would do with the Bush tax cuts and the estate tax if we leave those issues to next year. Finally, getting this done may free up some time for the lame duck Senate to get DADT repeal, START ratification, passage of the DREAM Act, etc.
Yes. Compared to anything that was likely to pass in the next Congress, or has passed in this Congress, it was as good a deal as was going to happen.
And it sux.
But I support it.
I think you’re making a mistake assuming that the liberals you read and listen to are representative of all liberals.
After watching the Right and the Left try to destroy this president for 2 yrs by deligitimizing & emasculating him; well your DAMN RIGHT. I’m a fucking caveman liberal & I would absolutely support anything they polled me personally about. It has a lot more to do with fair treatment than anything! Simply not the norm! Truly sick of both sides!