If Anthony Shadid’s reporting on Libya for the New York Times is accurate, my prediction has come true. The United States of America will get blamed for everything no matter what we do. And I find it very irritating.
Everyone here seems to have a gun these days, in a lawlessness tempered only by revolutionary ebullience. Young men at the front parade with the swagger that a rocket-propelled grenade launcher grants but hint privately that they will try to emigrate if they fail. Anti-American sentiments build, as rebels complain of Western inaction. And the hint of radicalization — religious or something more nihilist — gathers as the momentum in the three-week conflict clearly shifts to the forces of one of the world’s most bizarre leaders.
We have absolutely no responsibility for the fact that Gaddafi has been running Libya for over forty years. We didn’t tell people to revolt against his leadership. We do not have close relationships with the Libyan elite. We do not coddle them, empower them, or apologize for them. We have only the most tangential interests in what happens in Libya, and our main concern is that chaos there not lead to energy inflation that slows the world economy and cost us jobs.
Moreover, one of the most common Arab complaints about the USA is that we intervene in their internal affairs. So, when we don’t go racing to aid a hodgepodge of ill-trained, ill-led, poorly educated rebels, suddenly we’re the bad guys? I don’t like Gaddafi, but reading the rebels’ complaints almost makes me want to start rooting for him.
Shadid details just how disorganized the rebellion is, and it doesn’t inspire any confidence on my part that we should have anything to do with them, even if we share a common loathing for Gaddafi.
The fighting here feels less like combat in the conventional sense and more like another form of frustrated protest.
Some vehicles bear the inscription Joint Security Committee, but nothing is all that coordinated across a landscape that seems anarchic and lacking in leadership. Fighters don leather jackets from Turkey, Desert Fox-style goggles, ski masks, cowboy hats and World War II-era British waistcoats.
Slogans are scrawled in the street just miles from the fighting. “Muammar is a dog,” one reads. A man who bicycled for three days from Darnah, far to the east, became a local celebrity at the front. Free food is offered, as it was in the canteens in Tahrir, and fighters rummaged through donated clothes. “These are American jeans!” one shouted.
Young men revel in the novelty of having no one to tell them not to play with guns. “God is great!” rings out whenever a volley of bullets is fired into the air.
“Some guys consider this a lot of fun, and they’re hoping the war lasts a lot longer,” said Marwan Buhidma, a 21-year-old computer student who credited video games with helping him figure out how to operate a 14.5-millimeter antiaircraft battery.
An hour or so before Friday’s headlong retreat, a gaggle of young men in aviator sunglasses and knit caps danced on military hardware, thrusting weapons into the air.
War is all fun and games until someone gets killed.
You know what Shadid’s reporting doesn’t include? It doesn’t include any quotes from actual officers. Our own National Intelligence Director, James Clapper, was blunt in his testimony before Congress last week:
…in a blunt assessment to Congress, National Intelligence Director James Clapper said Gadhafi’s advantage in military force makes him likely to survive the revolt.
Clapper told the Senate Armed Services Committee that the rebels are “in for a tough row” against Gadhafi, who still commands warplanes, an air-defense network and loyal army brigades against the opposition forces. He cautioned that the situation is “very fluid,” but added, “I think, longer term, the regime will prevail.”
“I do believe Gadhafi is in this for the long haul,” Clapper said. “I don’t think he has any intention, despite some of the press speculation to the contrary, of leaving. From all evidence that we have — which I’d be prepared to discuss in closed session — he appears to be hunkering down for the duration.”
He was rewarded for his honest assessment with calls for him to resign led by Sen. Lindsey Graham of South Carolina. Maybe Sen. Graham wants rosy, bullshit assessments from our head of intelligence?
In any case, none of this prevented the president from upping the ante in his news conference on March 11:
I am absolutely clear that it is in the interest of the United States, and more importantly, in the interest of the Libyan people for Mr. Qaddafi to leave…
…Part of what we’re going to be wanting to do is to change the balance not just militarily inside of Libya, but also to change the balance in terms of those who are around Qaddafi and are thinking about what their future prospects are if they continue down the course that they’re on.
But, Chuck [Todd], there’s no doubt that I am concerned about it. Qaddafi has a stash of weapons. He not only has some troops that remain loyal to him, but there have been reports that he’s also been hiring mercenaries. Even with the financial freeze that we’ve imposed, he still has some assets. The rebel groups are just now getting organized. And so we’re going to have to continue to apply pressure, and that’s why I say we have not taken any options off the table at this point…
…So let me be clear, again, about what our policy as determined by me, the President of the United States, is towards the situation there. I believe that Qaddafi is on the wrong side of history. I believe that the Libyan people are anxious for freedom and the removal of somebody who has suppressed them for decades now. And we are going to be in contact with the opposition, as well as in consultation with the international community, to try to achieve the goal of Mr. Qaddafi being removed from power.
Those quotes, taken in combination, pretty much commit the United States to pursuing regime change and to supporting the rag-tag gang of rebels who have failed to overthrow Gaddhafi and are now in retreat on the battlefield.
Let me say this again. We don’t know what kind of leadership would emerge from this opposition if they were to prevail, but they don’t even appear to have operational leadership in the field. We have no compelling reason to commit ourselves to this fight. It’s a mistake. And the president has been pushed very far out on a limb here, probably through a false sense of momentum arising from the successful revolutions in Tunisia and Egypt. It will be painful to walk this back, but unless Hillary Clinton discovers a compelling, organized opposition in Benghazi when she arrives there this week, our commitment to regime change in Libya should be scaled back. It’s not our problem. Obama is in the process of making it our problem. We should stand ready to prevent massacres and offer asylum, but should not commit our military to do what the rebels cannot do themselves. If we want to pursue other angles, like seeking out potential alternatives to Gaddafi from within his circle, that seems to me to be unwise but still preferable to getting into a civil war on the side that our intelligence director says is likely to lose. Once we commit a tiny bit, we’ll wind up doing the fighting because we can’t afford to lose.
But what will we have won? Good will? Don’t be silly.
From what I can see, we’ll have won an unholy mess.
With the US meeting with the international community on Libya, it will slow things down. Agreement will be hard to come by.
This isn’t a call to war.
The main concern is the assets that Gadaffi is getting his hands on. This is how he is keeping power.
Removal doesn’t mean we go in there and get him.
Obama was accused of not being serious about Libya and being a weak kneed president.
The US is not acting alone like Bush did.
All options on the table is standard fare for a situation like this. There was no ultimatium given to Gadaffi.
Hillary Clinton is really going to Behghazi? She’s mad, the president is insane to send her. What are they thinking of accomplishing? The only possible outcome is another disastrous war. Otherwise there’s nothing. Maybe arming the rebels and facilitating a protracted civil war? She might do better becoming a Buddhist monk. In Qaddhafi the Middle Eastern momentum has met a cement wall, as I said before. It’s over. Egypt is preparing a new military dominated government, Tunisia is something I can’t say anything about. Obama’s wisest choice would be to get the Arab countries like Saudi—yes, the great friends of the house of Saud—to engage their air force in a no-fly operation with, if necessary, the help of NATO, which includes the US. Let the Arabs do a bit more to solve this one. Then the US will no longer in a position to be blamed. But as they say there is an elephant in the room: Israel. If the US ever found the humanity to pressure Israel to end the colonial occupation policy which the US tacitly (and often quite verbally supports), it would gain the credibility it needs to act honestly and effectively in the Arab world. Never will happen—never. The last comment is not off topic.
Not sure where she’s meeting them. Perhaps not Benghazi. Perhaps in Tunisia?
It doesn’t matter where. The meeting will be no more than PR for her and her boss. And possibly end in war. I’ve heard that Prime Minister Cameron is going to Egypt but will not meet a representative of the Muslim Brotherhood. Democracy? My foot.
Fucker killed one of Meteor Blades’s kin.
Who’s the fucker: Marabarak, Cameron, Qaddafi—Obama?
Gaddafi’s troop in eastern Libya.
perhaps ms clinton is hoping for
a realanother Tuzla moment…got to keep that secD macho charisma thing going.A couple of days ago Madame Clinton made a typical American statement to the effect that the United States would make certain that Libya would end up with the kind of government that the United States would consider acceptable – words to that effect. Typical American hubris. Not a hint of a thought that perhaps the Libyans should be allowed to evolve and adopt a form of government that suited Libyans, and that the United States had no standing and therefore no say in the matter.
It is true that the US does not have a national interest in Libya, but unfortunately individual Americans do have a national interest in Libya. Libya’s oil is of interest to some Americans. Libyan ex-pats are ex-pats primarily because of the repression of the regime and still have family in Libya. Although not large in numbers they vote and they protest and the draw the false comparison between the US eagerness to go into Iraq for no reason and its reluctance to go into Libya where they assert there is ample reason. And the part of the Arab street that cheered the revolutions in Tunisia and Egypt agree with them.
The paradox of sixty years of a Pax Americana is that the rest of the world wants that to continue–but on their terms. And that is to be expected.
But the US cannot bear the burden of a Pax Americana any longer. And the anger is at the US’s seeming eagerness to suppress democratic movements when they don’t serve US purposes and yet continue to lecture about democracy. The world has changed dramatically but neither the politicians in Washington nor the people in the street here and in other countries have caught up with that change. The US still spends more on defense than all countries in the world combined, and yet is powerless because those weapons can’t be used in the situations that the world needs dealt with. And US politicians are so dumb that they will look at a deterrent weapon and say, “We paid for those nukes, why can’t we use them.” The same with the US’s massive inventory of conventional, organized war-fighting weapons.
So both domestic politics and international pressure assume (1) a world that no longer exists and (2) a US military so powerful that it can do anything. So the obvious (and ridiculous, if you think about it) question is “Why does not the US get rid of bad actors that the world wants removed instead of throwing its weight against democratic movements?” In 1954 and through the Cold War, that was a valid question. Why was it that as the Cold War progressed the world liberated imperial colonies to dictatorial regimes more frequently than to democratic regimes? Was not the Cold War to show the advantages of democracy? To understand how the US went from being seen as the most benign and enviable power in 1945 to the most hated in 2005 is to see the drift of public opinion in the face of that question.
The regime in Libya has changed and will not be the same as before even if Gaddafi does re-exert his control over all of Libyan territory. What the world dismissed as mundane dictatorial control has been shown to be a reign of terror and extreme brutality that gives Saddam’s or Ceaucescu’s regime a good name and stops just shy of Idi Amin’s Uganda. That awareness cannot be put back in the box, either by the international community or by those Libyan people who benefited from the regime. In its visceral objection to the slaughter of peaceful protesters in Tripoli’s Green Square with anti-aircraft weapons by hired mercenaries, the UN Security Council came to rare unanimity in applying sanctions to the rulers and confining them to their country. The International Criminal Court will likely have a strong case for turning over Gaddafi and loyal members of his government for trial. Getting Gadaffi to the Hague might well take time, but Slobodan Milosevich finally went before the court, and so did Radovan Karadich, and now the trial of Charles Taylor is going on. The world decided that Gadaffi was no longer a legitimate ruler. And despite US media coverage the truth likely is that Hillary Clinton and Susan Rice were not the major engineers of the decision. And the willingness of the Arab League to follow suit shows that there are many different agendas at play.
Any time President Obama says that Muammar Gaddafi must step down, he is just re-emphasizing the UN Security Council decision. And is putting what diplomatic pressure is available on Gaddafi. Now, if he truly wants this to happen, he must be very firm with US corporations who might still be dealing directly or more importantly indirectly through foreign subsidiaries with the Libyan government.
What are US interests in the region, unrelated to those of individual Americans? Well the answer to that one has to do with how much backstopping of Europe we want to do. Europe cannot long tolerate the chaos of changing regimes on the south side of the Mediterranean, and the foreign policy establishment in the EU is smart enough to recognize that continued dictatorship means recurrent bouts of instability. There however is a balancing US interest that eventually seeks disengagement from a stable region just because overseas commitments are a major component of the defense budget in a time of deficits. And the US does not have, nor most importantly do governments in the region have, a vision of how to create regional mutual security. On this score, the African Union is way down the road in vision (thanks to South Africa) but lacks sufficient resources to act everywhere action is needed.
France and Portugal might have acted too precipitously in recognizing the Libyan National Council. No doubt, Clinton’s visit to the region will discover the current state of events. I have not seen the US rush into engagement. Having “all options on the table” is just diplomatic talk that military operations should not be excluded from the thinking of the Gaddafi regime (as if anyone had to tell him). It also is a signal to see who else has all options on the table. We are not dealing with George W. Bush here in which “all options on the table” was a ruse for domestic consumption; the world was not fooled.
As for Congress, in this situation they are mostly irrelevant. Unless the President himself involves them, Lindsay Graham and John McCain can posture until the cows come home. John Kerry can play “bad cop” and say things that would be impolitic for the President to say (and yet plausibly deniable if necessary).
And Al Jazeera will push its audience’s agenda.
If we participate in no-fly zone enforcement, what will we have won. Not a whole lot beyond the knowledge that it was not technological superiority from Russian aircraft (only one French Mirage is left to Gaddafi) that allowed a revolution to be squashed. That there were indeed the weaknesses on the ground and the inability of the rebels to turn liberated areas into flipping of the elite army units of the regime. That the apparent collapse of the regime was only from elements that were the least rewarded in the regime. That is not worth the risk of going it alone; my sense is in spite of the rhetoric President Obama understands that and is seeking to see how firm and how broad the international consensus is.
Finally, the US has more leverage in Yemen, Bahrain, and especially Saudi Arabia than in Libya. And that leverage has to do with restraining violence and letting the on-the-ground political processes play out instead of intervention.
And none of it is easy. Or risk-free, no matter what the decision.
In my view, you’re the only one on this thread so far that’s making sense, TD.
How on earth you could take anything published in the NY Times as “accurate” reporting…especially on the North African/Middle Eastern/Islamic beat…after it has been plainly proven over several decades that said newspaper is a spokesman for the intelligence services of the United States (and quite possibly for those of Israel as well, if indeed the two groups are not inextricably intertwined in the first place) is totally beyond me.
The Judith Miller fiasco alone should have been enough to cure you of your NY Times addiction.
As Alexander Cockburn writes in Counterpunch today regarding the shameful PermaGov/corporate bias of the overall disinformation being reported regarding the severity of the ongoing Japanese nuclear disaster:
Expand that statement to include the idea “never believe anything that has been officially stated” and you have a good rule of thumb for understanding the news in general as it is disseminated by the mighty Wurlitzer of the US press.
The NY Times is the paper of record here.
It lies.
Always and everywhere.
And you keep falling for it.
Deep.
Libya is indeed “our problem.” As is the whole of the massively injured so-called Third World, a world that has been so cannibalized by the depredations of 300+ years of American/Western European economic imperialism that it is only now beginning to shake itself loose. And if “we”…the predators…are not very careful, the entire structure of our economy and thus our society is going to be shaken loose by the same movement.
With absolutely disastrous results.
Bet on it.
As the wonderful PermaGov spokesman Secretary of State Colin “Teflon” Powell muttered (quite truthfully, but on levels way past his intent) “You break it, you own it.”
The Pottery Barn Syndrome.
We broke it.
We will pay for that action, one way or another.
The only question left unanswered is…which way shall we pay?
Show a genuine interest in backing off of the feed trough and letting some others in for a bite is one way, a way that would entail helping the rebels no matter how primitive or disorganized they may seem to be. Backing off another way and letting our so-called allies continue to massacre their people if they are powerful enough to do so is another, as is of course the Kissinger/Nixon/BushCo approach…massacring said people ourselves in our own self-interest.
Obama has…as usual…chosen the second way. The middle path. That’s what he does; that’s what has gotten him to his current position, and that’s what he is going to continue to do. Let things play out sink-or-swim style, and then try to embrace the victors. Buy the victors, actually, but the cold-hearted embrace of cash is the only thing that we really have to offer. Cash and weaponry.
It’s a mistake . The fundamentalist Islamicists will eventually win, and “luke warm” they ain’t.
They are as hot as a two dollar pistol, actually.
Neutrality does not work on streets full of two dollar pistols.
Bet on it.
Eventually somebody succeeds in pumping a serious cap into your ass. Them two dollar pistols don’t always misfire, y’know.
Watch.
AG
Only one question, AG:
Which ones?
The ones with weapons and the capability and intent to use them to create Islamic states.
C’mon, Tarheel…you haven’t noticed?
AG
As opposed to the non-fundamentalist guys with weapons and intent to use them to create states that serve their interests.
Or the ex-pat and educated elites who have no weapons and the intent to create representative democracies.
Or the Christian fundamentalists with weapons and intent to use them to create Gilead.
What I’ve noticed is that old media frames are colliding with each other.
Of the three groups that you mention and the one of which I have spoken here:
Which group has successfully bankrupted one hugely powerful state…the U.S.S.R…sent another state into an economic and terrorist-based social decline…the U.S. of course…and is presently engaging that second state in at the very least a two-front land war?
Lemme see…
C’mon, Tarheel.
Political correctness in the face of real war is total foolishness.
I am not “anti-Muslim”. Hell, man, my world view is almost totally based on what I have learned from several Sufi-oriented teachers. But it really makes no difference how and why a powerful enemy arrived at its position of enmity. It doesn’t even make much difference if they are somehow morally “correct” in their position. I support a total change in how the U.S. does business with the rest of the world, especially the arising countries of the Third World. Economic imperialism is through. It can no longer be enforced by military means. But a nation must first defend itself in order to even have a chance of changing. And self-defense itself must first openly and accurately identify the enemy. I’m a Celt by heritage, and if was was some group of Irishmen who were running the same game as the Taliban/Al Qaeda folks I would be first in line to identify them with no dancing around the truth of the matter.
Ain’t about “Islam.” It’s about surviving long enough as a society to get some change happening.
Hurriah below is as prone to reacting to dog whistles of supposed anti-Islamic thought as are the Israelis to equally supposed anti-semitism. And both are full of shit.
I call it as I see it. I called the Egyptian uprising in that diary she mentions…I was less than a year off…and I’m calling this too. The real passion in the streets of the Islamic countries…the real anti-American, anti-Israeli, anti-Western European passion, the kind of passion that makes people put their lives on the line and causes true revolutions…is Islam-based. Islam is the glue that holds it together, no matter how just the economic and social grievances of the people may be. Sorry, but there it is. In Pakistan, In Afghanistan, in North Africa, in Iraq and Iran, in Saudi Arabia (It’s coming there, too, brother. bet on it.)…Islam is the glue that is holding the real fighters together. And we must first admit that to ourselves before we make any other plans.
“Know thine enemy.”
Yup.
Can’t fight or negotiate if you do not recognize who and what you are fighting.
Be on it.
AG
Islam is the glue, indeed. But Islam is no more monolithic than any other religion and even fundamentalist Islam is not monolithic. And going back to your original statement, there are a variety fundamentalist Islamist groups that are interested in armed struggle, who would have and have had serious problems working together. Politicized Wahabist Islam is what is holding some of the fighters together; politicized Shi’a Islam of several varieties is holding other fighters together.
As the US withdraws from Iraq and Afghanistan, the divisions within Islamist beliefs not the unity of Islam will be at play politically. It will be framed in Muslim scholarship but the appeal will be ideological, playing on a particular interpretation of a particular school of Muslim scholarship in order to achieve a pre-defined vision of power.
Despite the ability of essentially weak actors (after all that is what asymmetric warfare is about) to sucker the Bush administration and more importantly US public opinion into the idea that we are in an existential war, that never was the case. But what resulted was the definite end of American power to extend its imperial ambitions globally. Classic overreach.
But the security of the territorial US is not in danger from the current events in the Middle East. And the folks who were so good at terrorism fail miserably at government; one need look only at how quickly Yassar Arafat’s PLO became corrupt. And that is because the tight leadership and trust of a small group requited to carry out terrorist tactics produces crony governance.
The real struggle is to get open institutions into place while large groups of the public have the ability to overwhelm the security structures of oppression. Institutions that have institutional interests in checking each other’s power. The US cannot do that for other people, and seemingly in the current situation cannot seem to do that for itself either.
Bullshit, Tarheel!!!
It is a gestalt.
“If wishes were horses, brggars would ride” said my wise old Irish grandmother.
Often.
The “current events in the Middle East” are part of what is fueling the right wing putsch that is currently taking shape right here in the good ol’ US of A.
No?
Rewind to pre-9/11, pre-Iraq, pre-al Qaeda, pre-Taliban times. If conditions had remained as they were then, do you really believe that the U.S. would be experiencing the same economic tailspin that it is now experiencing?
Please.
Where is your fucking head at?
Take it down to the ground and transpose it to the U.S.
Imagine the various independent armed groups that reside within he U.S….say the Black and Central American/Caribean drug gangs, the white supremacist militias and biker groups, what;s let of the ld-line mafias (including the Central European/Russian gangs) etc.
“Divisions in unity?”
“Scholarship” of some kind?
Please.
You watch and read too much academic/bullshit psychobabble.
It’s only about power.
Who has it; who can use it and who controls it.
“Crony governance?”
Isn’t that that is happening in Washington DC right now? As it has been happening for nigh onto 60 years or more?
“We have met the crony governors, and they is us.”
Bet on it.
Tou overthink.
Oversconsume the hypnomedia.
Sorry, but there it is.
The guys with guns is nuts.
Ain’t no scholarship or power involved.
He knew.
That’s why he won.
Later…
AG
Ah yes, I do remember reading your expert report on your week in Egypt in which you spoke very knowledgeably about the content of Egyptian TV despite, I presume, not knowing a word of Arabic. Oddly, though I do understand Arabic, have spent a good deal more time in Egypt and other parts of the Arab world and have watched many more hours of Egyptian and other Arab-language TV, I found the content to be far different, and much more varied than you seemed to. Nevertheless, I am sure you know far more about the Arab world and its dynamics than I do. Therefore, I must bow to your expertise on the subject and accept that you are correct in predicting the creation of a string of evil Islamist extremist states ruled by (horror of horrors!) Sheriya law (sic).
Hurria…sometimes “understanding the language” can be a drawback. The smokescreen of “language” often hides many plain truths. I have walked hard streets in many different countries and cultures during my 40+ years as a performing jazz and latin musician, and I have been a “foreigner” in most of them. White in black streets, non-hispanic…visibly non-hispanic…is Spanish neighborhoods and countries, barely able to speak most of the languages of Europe and none of the languages of Africa, the Middle East or Asia. And yet I have identified and avoided trouble in nasty neighborhoods literally hundreds of times. So far…knock wood…no one has so much as laid a hand on me.
How?
Why?
I have become adept at reading people. Not what they say…which is mostly lies even from the best of us. Self-delusion at the very least.
What they do.
Body language.
Tone of voice.
The eyes are the mirror of the soul. As is the rest of the body. And above all, the sound of the voice.
This is not exactly news, Hurria.
Cicero (106-43 B.C.) is quoted as saying, ‘Ut imago est animi voltus sic indices oculi’ (The face is a picture of the mind as the eyes are its interpreter). The Latin proverbs, ‘Vultus est index animi’ or ‘Oculus animi index,’ are usually translated as ‘The face is the index of the mind.’ The French say, ‘Les yeux sont le miroir de l’dme (The eyes are the mirror of the soul). ‘The eyes are the window of the soul’ is a variant form of the proverb…”
If one were to analyze “the content” of say American TV…the words…how much of what is said is even partially relevant to what America and Americans really do and think?
Vey damned little.
And yet you can turn the sound off of most TV and the real content comes pouring out.
Try it.
You might learn something.
Watch the newscasters, the Sunday morning talkfests, the popular late night so-called entertainers with the sound off. Watch the cop shows, the adventure shows, the comedies, the ads and see how much more you will understand without the constant bleat of rationalization.
Of “language.”
I do it all the time.
Here in the U.S.
It can literally be revelatory.
I stand by what Ii am saying.
Sorry.
So it goes. Take it or leave it.
All the “good-hearted” Musilms in the world?
Are they any more important to how things really work than are the equal percentages of “good-hearted” Christians or Jews? Russians or Chinese?
I think not.
It’s the rabble rousers who run the world. Who really “make things happen.”
The nationalists, the rabid, uncompromising fundamentalists (of all religions); the dedicated thieves, the racists, the madmen like Hitler.
And where exactly have I predicted “the creation of a string of evil Islamist extremist states”, Hurria?
Show me.
As I said above in my reply to Tarheel…you are as sensitive to dog-whistles as are the Jews who panic at the mere whiff of criticism or even accurate analysis regarding Israel.
What?
You need to be able to speak Hebrew to understand the evil that is rampant in the upper echelons of Israel’s government and leadership?
Please.
AG
“sometimes “understanding the language” can be a drawback“
LOOOOOOL! Riiiight! Understanding what people are actually saying puts a pontificator at SUCH a disadvantage.
You listen to what you must.
I see what I must.
My bet?
My seeing is more accurate than your listening.
We shall soon “see”, Hurriah.
Soon enough.
Watch.
AG
Yeah, you are so right. The more ignorant you are about something, the more qualified you are to pontificate about it. The more knowledge you have the less qualified you are to analyze what is going on. And speaking, reading, and writing the language – well, that kills any chance you might have to ever understand anything.
Yep, the only way to really be qualified on a subject is to know nothing at all about it.
You know, I heard that a lot in 2002 and beyond from people who did not want to hear what I had to say about Iraq. Nothing I said was to be taken seriously because, after all, I had lived there, knew the language, the society, the history, the culture, the politics, was personally connected to some of the players, and had traveled the length and breadth of the country. Their inability to find Iraq on a map, or pronounce its name correctly trumped my years of insider knowledge every time.
PS I don’t listen to what I “must”, I listen to what people are actually saying. I listen to what they say on the TV, the radio, on the street, in the taxi, on the bus, on the train, on the plane, in the cafe, in the market, in the privacy of their homes, in the privacy of my home, in the schools, at the university, in the churches, in the mosques, and everywhere else I go.
And while I hear words, phrases, and sentences that have actual meaning and significance, you don’t hear a thing but foreign gobbledegook, which enables you to concoct any damned thing you want out of what you hear.
And yet you insist you know what people are saying, and even more fascinating, you pretend to know what it all the gobbledegook signifies.
And then you make pronouncements about it.
Right.
Yeah, Hurriah.
I’m a total fool.
A fake.
A faker.
A blowhard.
And more often than not…check out my previous many posts here…I’m right on the money.
There is some sort of disconnect going on here, seems to me.
Show me where I said anything even remotely like “evil Islamic empires.”
You can’t, of course, because I neither said that nor do I believe it. You have projected the face of anti-Islamism on a neutral observer.
You’re listening, alright.
Listening to the paranoid voices in your own head.
You appear to me to be in permanent defensive mode. Because you’re a Muslim? A woman?
Maybe. Maybe both.
But then again…maybe not.
Maybe you’re just paranoid and you’ve latched onto your own cultural heritage as a good excuse.
I went to your page here on Booman Tribune.
You have five posts up, and any number of comments. I only went through the 1st two pages of comments, but all five articles and almost every comment is about some form of Islamic problem, Israel being foremost. I am hardly an Israel supporter…I truly think that all Israelis ought to be offered land in the U.S. and staked to a new diaspora by the oil-rich lands that now surround them, and I further think that Israel’s own paranoia has turned it into a state that acts much like the Nazi state that massacred Jews by the millions.
But that’s neither here nor there. I observe certain things in the world, and I report on them. Not “certain things in Muslim countries,” but certain things everywhere. I use the same methods of observation all of the time. Any number of people regularly find my various observations and conclusions valuable to them, so I continue to write. You, however, seem to see things exclusively through Muslim-tinted glasses.
There are other colors out there.
Take off the filters and see the world. Everyone who disagrees with you is not anti-Muslim. Other people have other ways of seeing the world than do you.
Bet on it.
Check it out.
AG
P.S. There’s an old joke out there-“Just because you’re paranoid doesn’t mean they’re not out to get you.”
A useful corollary?
Sure.
Just because you’re paranoid doesn’t mean people are out to get you.
Wise the fuck up.
What do you want from me more than my admission that your ignorance about the Arab world trumps my years of direct experience?
My so-called “ignorance” of the inner workings of the PermaGov or what goes on behind the closed doors of corporate thieves does not stop me from understanding what is going on back there, Hurriah.
You seem to live behind some closed doors too.
But I can see right through them.
You don’t believe it?
Fine.
I will continue upon my path and you will continue upon yours. That’s how it works.
Best of luck to us all.
We’re all gonna need it.
AG
As long as you consider knowing Arabic an impediment to understanding what is going on in the Arab world, and not knowing Arabic a window into that world, we will definitely go our separate ways.
I repeat…
Not speaking English should certainly be no impediment to understanding the total fucked-upness of The United States. However, I would venture a guess that 90% or more of the people who do speak English in the U.S. still do not have a clue about what is happening here. The fact that you speak Arabic is meaningless in this context if you do not have the wherewithal to understand what I am saying or what is happening over a broad swathe of the Islamic world regarding the U.S. and other western powers.
It’s not “about” Islam, Hurriah. It’s about economic imperialism. Once again…Islam is merely the glue that is holding together a certain percentage of the third world in its quest to get out from underneath the imperialist powers.
The glue that is working in South/Central/Caribbean America to unite opposition to the same thing?
La Raza.
Are all Musilms of one mind? All South/Central/Caribbean Hispanics? Of course not. But it only takes a certain percentage of a population to make changes. That certain percentage needs an underlying, unifying idea or it breaks up into competing sects. Religion, race and communism have been the most effective unifying forces during my lifetime, and during much of the history of the world religion and race have run neck and neck in the unification derby as well. For good and for ill.
That is all that I am saying here. However, the faintest dog whistle of anti-Muslim thought sets you off in a frenzy of self-protection.
Relax.
You’re not under attack.
Not by me you aren’t.
Not until you try to run that paranoia game on me, anyway. I won’t stand for it from Jewish paranoids and I will not take it from you either.
Be on it.
AG
Just read the article and take from it what you will.
You cannot ever escape your past and that is where the US is today. It has positioned itself as the ultimate arbiter on what is acceptable in the Arab and Muslim worlds and has been involved time and time again in precipitating outcomes, and even today urges a little peaceful transition by its well armed murderous autocracy in Yemen.
With that history it is impossible to sit on the sideline and say it is nothing to do with us. Of course it is very much to do with the US. That, however, is not to say the US should not sit this out. It should and it should sit out every other conflict in the Arab world and sitting out on arming and funding the bankrupt and murderous regime of Israel would also help. They have massacred more civilians with US supplied arms and the money to buy them and the UN vetoes to stop them being blamed for human rights abuses among the worst in the region and they have massacred more than Gaddafi has managed with his mixed supply of arms and money.
Well said.
Again with the same tiresome whine! My god, man, stop sniveling, admit that the United States has brought this entirely on itself by its own hubris and aggressive imperialism, and move on.