The American people are understandably upset with their political leaders and they are growing more frustrated by the moment. But the trends in the polling show that, contra Peter Wehner, refusing to compromise isn’t hurting the president but is hurting the Republicans, badly. This is not the first time that facts have failed to permeate the right-wing media bubble.
About The Author
BooMan
Martin Longman a contributing editor at the Washington Monthly. He is also the founder of Booman Tribune and Progress Pond. He has a degree in philosophy from Western Michigan University.
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So let me get this straight, standing up to the Republicans is damaging the Republicans.
Well. Will wonders never cease.
Keep in mind that some of the Republican negatives are because true believers don’t think they’re being adherent to the defund strategy.
Anything below 27% has to be attributed to the rightists!
Ahahaha I wish you could edit posts. From the story:
that 27% continues to crack me up
It’s uncanny. It seems to be a universal constant, like the speed of light.
just like some of the people who show up in polls disapproving of the ACA is because it doesn’t go far enough
Yet another clue as to the growing revelation that the Rep brand insulates from a plan that works for more than one person; ie, a Cruzism.
And now that the monied base is retreating it points to the end of the solution that just shouted at every problem, ‘write a check, it’ll be ok’.
The whispers I’m hearing of the purported ‘deal’ being negotiated in the Senate smells like shit. Harry Reid should be coming back to the table with increasingly worse offers for the GOP each time they say no.
Teach those ‘Party of No’ fuckers what saying no all the time gets them.
The deal looks pretty clean to me. Roll Call has details:
Funds the government to 1-15-14, the date Dems wanted so to negotiate on the next round of sequester. Lifts debt ceiling to 2-15-14. R’s get income verification for ACA. Dems get a rollback of reinsurance tax. No medical device tax repeal.
http://blogs.rollcall.com/wgdb/senate-debt-limit-framework-emerges-medical-device-tax-off-table/
How does income verification work when there’s no time to implement another piece of bullshit bureaucracy?
Why with a web interface to the IRS. They should be able to get that up and
crashingrunning by 2016 or 2017.So we can go through this crap again after New Year’s. I’m underwhelmed.
The ONLY deal should be to eliminate the Debt ceiling altogether and a rolling CR with CPI indexing when Congress can’t agree on a budget. The only concession should be letting them make the CR indexed by chained CPI.
That reinsurance tax is a tip of the hat to the unions. It was one of their big complaints. I think it was clever by Harry Reid, Obama and Pelosi. They had to give a fig leaf that had something to do with health care, why not do something for your friends.
The hazard of having a great media Wurlitzer is that you enjoy the music from it too much.
BooMan, I think you said this in other terms quite recently.
“The GOP is badly damaged”.
I doubt it. the midterm is over a year away. plenty of time for the repugs to recover from this fiasco. all these predications regarding the GOP’s demise– I’ve heard it before, after Obama was elected in 2008– that is, until the shellacking the dems got in 2010.
The Tea Party is not going to suddenly become sane. I think the dissension within the party is just beginning.
Yes, but none of this means GOP voters are going to stop voting or start voting for democratic candidates.
See, that is where you are wrong.
During the Bush years, I watched various life-long Republicans reach a breaking point and leave the party, many of whom are now voting for the Democrats.
Some, not a lot, left over the decision to invade Iraq. More left over the Terri Schiavo incident. Others thought Katrina was the last straw. Then the financial collapse happened and some moved to the right, either out of the party altogether or into the insurgent Tea Party movement. Others moved to the left because they concluded the GOP is not a good steward of the economy.
People rarely change their political allegiances, but they sometimes do when big events happen. Some Democrats moved into the Republican camp when they saw people on the left not supporting the president after 9/11. It happens. People do change. Some people, anyway.
Thanks for your take, but my scoreboard is:
In 1999-2000, prior to “blogs” even being invented, I was posting almost daily at Salon’s Forum website.
there, numerous progressives were predicting a landslide victory for Gore, and they were laughing, guffawing loudly about the “stupid, hick Governor from Texas who had zero chance of winning”.
I and a few other predicted a Bush victory and were regularly flamed for doing to. I was right, they were wrong.
In 2004, I predicted Kerry would be the dem candidate and he would pick Edwards as his running mate– and I predicted they would lose to Bush. I was right on all counts and most everyone else in progressive bloggo world was wrong.
Yes, like the “Reagan democrats” after the Voting Rights Act was passed.
The current fiasco is not a big event in that sense. yes, a few people may switch parties, but it’s not going to be hundreds of thousands of people- enough to swing some congressional elections and get the democrats the House in 2014.
you appear to be overlooking the Disgust-O-Meter on full tilt; numerous people are furious with the bullshit going on in Washington. they will be voting “None of the Above” just like multiple millions of eligible voters who opted out of our weak system years ago.
Finally, the problem is the democratic party has to hope to pick up disgusted GOP voters instead of proposing/promoting bold ideas which would go much further in motivating potential new voters. this is great political strategy??
Or, this.
And that February date is likely to be much closer to a primary date if there is a challenge.
I don’t see any more in the deal than kicking the can down the road — again.
How is the debt ceiling stunt not repeatable?
Or is that the point make the Republicans repeat this stunt again at Christmas, which is about as cynical politics as one can work.
Well their debt ceiling strategy went so well for them this time maybe they’ll give it another go. But looks like February, not December is the timeline. Government funding runs to January 14 – Dems didn’t want it to go longer and lock in sequester numbers.
December 13 on appropriations. February on debt ceiling is what I saw.
In principle, if there is agreement the debt ceiling could be set at the time of appropriations and avoid February altogether. But this is the negotiate-in-bad-faith Republicans that we are talking about here.
Robert Kuttner thinks the Republicans can recover from this by November 2014 by focusing on the IT mess in Obamacare (even admitting that GOP actions helped cause it).
If – if they get the website fixed and hit close to the number of enrollees they need, the IT mess will fade. Sounds like some states – California, Washington, Kentucky – have made substantial progress. Hope that is a sign that they’re getting it under control.
The states that are doing it themselves are mostly OK.
It’s the federal exchange that red state governors actively tried to sabotage that is the problem. In 2010, the assumption was that there likely would not need to be a federal exchange because all of the states would set up their own or engage in regional compacts to set up joint exchanges.
The federal system was seen mostly as back-end processing for state exchanges.
Not cheapskate Illinois. I guess Madigan and Cullerton couldn’t agree on splitting the graft. Or maybe they knew it would be staffed by ghost payrollers and never be finished. Sort of like the Elgin-O’Hare Expressway that goes to neither.
How did that get to be sacrosanct?
Because on January 15 the budget automatically goes from 988 to 967 which is a huge cut on top of what already has taken place. And it is my understanding that the most of those cuts are to the military which the republicans are interested in adjusting. I think they would be happy to just accomplish that in these talks. I don’t see any way they will agree to addressing social security and medicare because that would involve revenue. Don’t see that happening.
But that budget restriction is a matter of law that can be changed as a matter of law in whatever the Congress does to deal with the continuing resolution/appropriations and the debt ceiling.
Why does Social Security have to be addressed at all? Social Security is a creditor who holds US debt. And Medicare should be involving less revenue as result of more effective regulation of providers as a result of the implementation of Obamacare, is that not true? When hospitals don’t have to cover unpaid bills for non-elderly patients, their Medicare charges should reflect those savings shouldn’t they? Those two items look more like symbolically screwing Democratic constituencies than actually dealing with budget issues.
By adjusting military cuts, you are saying that Republicans want to raise spending instead of lowering it, regardless of the national security situation of the country. Right?
“Those two items look more like symbolically screwing Democratic constituencies than actually dealing with budget issues.”
The sequester is heavily screwing with Democratic constituencies. Increasing Federal revenues will be necessary to hold up the entire New Deal/Great Society enterprise. We will have to give something to get these things. Otherwise, the Republicans will continue to drown the government in Norquist’s bathtub until 2022.
“By adjusting military cuts, you are saying that Republicans want to raise spending instead of lowering it, regardless of the national security situation of the country. Right?”
But of course. The Republicans don’t care about lowering government spending or the debt/deficit. They want to pour every single dollar they steal from the poor and middle class into the pockets of their rich buddies, not into deficit reduction. The Balanced Budget rhetoric is one of their many scams.
Yes, the only reason it didn’t succeed is that the people pushing it WEREN’T CONSERVATIVE ENOUGH.
From a practical standpoint, can someone explain to me what, in this rumored deal, actually defangs the Republicans in any way from just repeating their intransigence on these same issues when the first opportunity presents itself?
I have been hearing how Democrats have to take this to the wall in order to drive a spike through the heart of this zombie which the Tea Party is using to overrun the constitutional workings of our government. But other than continuing to make themselves extremely unpopular in polls, which they don’t seem to give a rats ass about, nothing moves them. They are on what amounts to a religious crusade.
I know Dems want to position themselves to get rid of the sequester, or at least begin to move away from the Ryan Budget number, but that will take actual negotiations once this initial crisis is passed, which can only mean that the knife will be sharpened and out for Social Security and Medicare cuts, which we already know both sides are primed to move on.
I see all the Washington pundits getting a Big Johnson now at the prospect that we are finally going to get a chance to hack away at those dreaded “entitlements”, which in their world is the only way that things will once again reach the proper equilibrium in their universe; meaning that the little people will finally be suffering that pain that the David Gregorys of the world feel is necessary in order to prove that we are a “serious country”.
There is no conclusion to this whole thing yet. But forgive me for not having a lot of confidence that this is going to work out in a fashion that doesn’t place an even heavier burden on those with the least ability to shoulder it. It is all just very damn depressing.
The polling ought to be enough for Republicans to never try this stunt again; however if they (or a tea party faction) try to do it again – and the Dems stand up again – then it hurts the GOP.
You said it so I don’t have to.
Only the fact that every time the Republicans pull this stunt the assumption is that the public gets wiser about what is going on and angrier at the Republicans. It’s pure political gamble, once again the Democrats “keeping their powder dry”, just like when the allowed John Roberts and Samuel Alito on the Supreme Court.
It would appear to me it would likely be a gamble they probably feel is a net win for them almost every time. I cannot imagine a more stark demonstration of what their true agenda is and how ideologically fanatical they are. And yet, only now are some in the media actually deigning to hint at the completely radical party they have become.
It does not give me a sense of optimism for our future.
It does me. You just said it yourself: “it would likely be a gamble they probably feel is a net win for them almost every time. I cannot imagine a more stark demonstration of what their true agenda is and how ideologically fanatical they are.”
Reid and Obama are blinking. Now the MSM can continue to say both sides are at fault but are settling their differences. It’s sort of like Roosevelt striking a deal with Hitler to postpone the war for two months.
They’re not blinking. They had to work something out to end this.
As usual with you guys, if it’s not everything, it’s nothing. Life doesn’t work that way.
Is this what they teach you in “Critical Thinking”? If it’s not perfect, then it totally sucks?
They stood firm. Then they gave in. They said they would not negotiate with terrorist. Then they did.
The Tea Party won.
To say that you lack a sense of proportion would be a gross understatement.
What lack of proportion? The Tea Party threatened to destroy the economy unless they got concessions. Now they are getting concessions and another shot at blackmail after Christmas. The Democratic “victory” was to stand firm for two weeks before agreeing to concessions.
Look at the deal, really close.
What Obama and the Dems have been saying all along is that the GOP can’t “get” something in exchange for “giving” the reopening of the government and debt ceiling increase. Those are basic governing responsibilities, not bargaining chips.
The deal reopens the government and raises the debt ceiling. The other things included on top of that lean in favor of Democratic policy priorities. So, they got worse than nothing from shutting down the government. And, the Congressional GOP caucuses are split and fighting. And the Republicans are polling at gonorrhea levels. And we’re heading back to regular order on budget negotiations; the end of the Continuing Resolutions is nigh. If the deal is as described, it’s a rout.
Sure, the Cruz Caucus will want to gear up the hostage demands again in a few weeks. How are they going to get the votes to force their leadership’s hand again?
Exactly. And if Cruz et al. are planning to do that (and they probably are) it’s only going to help the Democrats. And it will exacerbate the tensions within the GOP, because even a lot of them are sick of it.
The Tea Party is not going to have things so easy from now on, even in some of its stronghold areas, as you can see here:
http://www.omaha.com/article/20131011/AP06/310119967
Come on , dude. You got to think a little harder than that.
Response from Pres. Obama to the GOP house proposal this morning:
“The President has said repeatedly that Members of Congress don’t get to demand ransom for fulfilling their basic responsibilities to pass a budget and pay the nation’s bills,” White House spokeswoman Amy Brundage said in a statement. “Unfortunately, the latest proposal from House Republicans does just that in a partisan attempt to appease a small group of Tea Party Republicans who forced the government shutdown in the first place. Democrats and Republicans in the Senate have been working in a bipartisan, good-faith effort to end the manufactured crises that have already harmed American families and business owners. With only a couple days remaining until the United States exhausts its borrowing authority, it’s time for the House to do the same.”
The announcement also follows reports that Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) is whipping support against the House GOP proposal, which suggests that President Obama will be urging his members to simply hold the line.
Actually, kicking the can down the road, closer to the midterms, might be better. The Party of unLincoln will be questioned every time we hit a deadline. Any stunts by them, (and they can’t really help themselves, can they) will just remind everyone of this current stunt.
And if the Gohmerts try to impeach Obama for them shutting down the government it just gets worse for Repubs in the civilized areas of the world.
They will still be damaging the country each time though. This was about breaking them decisively so they wouldn’t do that again.
Is Obama going to once again though them a lifeline?
A lifeline, or enough rope?
I’m becoming resigned to the idea that the only real resolution of this conflict will be a wave election that gives the Democrats control of the House. Everything before it is just preparing the way.
Well you may have a point but that will result in likely 2-3 more debt ceiling scares by then, enshrining this as the new normal, until someone fucks up and we breech.
I said this a couple weeks ago: This is Obama’s PATCO strike moment. Americans are sick of the tea party and are dying for Obama to destroy it at long last. I don’t think it can be underestimated how this will swing mainstream opinion behind the Democrats, who now would be seen not only as the sane choice, but also the choice of winners.
The realignment takes another big step this week. And just barely in time. Barring catastrophe over the next year, I honestly believe this.