In 1972, Richard Nixon won reelection by dominating the Electoral College 520-17, destroying George McGovern by eighteen million votes. The Democrats bounced back in 1976, thanks to Watergate, but the victory papered over fatal weaknesses. Jimmy Carter lost every state west of the Missouri River except Texas and Hawai’i. Meanwhile, he won every state in the former Confederacy except Virginia. Whatever that election coalition was, it certainly wasn’t sustainable. He was defeated in 1980 by over eight million votes and carried only six states.
In 1984, Walter Mondale was crushed by a 525-13 Electoral College margin, and by seventeen million votes. He carried only his home state of Minnesota and the District of Columbia. In 1988, in what should have been a strong year for the out-party, Michael Dukakis was demolished 426-111 in the Electoral College, and by about seven million votes.
This is the context in which Bill Clinton rose as a political figure. He figured out a way to turn those numbers around, he won two presidential elections and held the White House for eight critical years in the midst of the high-water mark of the conservative-backlash Reagan Revolution. He put Stephen Breyer and Ruth Bader Ginsburg on the Supreme Court, thereby preserving constitutionally protected reproductive rights for women, among many other things.
The starting point for judging Clintonism is to put it in its historical context. The crime rate then was double what it is now. The welfare program, as it existed, was so vastly unpopular that it went a long way, by itself, toward explaining those lopsided presidential defeats the Democrats had suffered over the previous twenty years. The Rainbow Coalition that Jesse Jackson was promoting in those years has pretty much come into existence during the Obama Era, but it was a totally unrealistic recipe in 1984 or 1988 or 1992.
So, part of understanding the historical context is understanding why the Democrats were doing so poorly and why Clinton did so well.
Once Clinton was elected, he embarked on a pretty liberal agenda despite winning with only 43% of the vote. He had his successes (the stimulus package, gun regulations, the Family Leave Act) and his failures (settling for Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell, enacting universal health care), but he didn’t initially shrink from pushing a controversial and contentious left-wing agenda. His reward was low polling numbers and bruising defeats in the 1994 midterms that cost his party control of both houses of Congress.
We can debate the part NAFTA played in all this, and we can pick at the parts of the crime bill that we don’t like while ignoring the parts that were good enough to win the support of Rep. Bernie Sanders. But, the overall story of Clinton’s first two years was one of a mostly conventional Democrat pushing a broadly liberal agenda that had pent up after twelve years of Republicans in the White House.
Obviously, everything changed after the 1994 midterms and the emergence of Newt Gingrich as a political force. Clinton had to fight a defensive battle just to keep liberal priorities funded during multiple government shutdown battles. He was increasingly dogged by Kenneth Starr. Raising the money to match the millions flowing to the Republicans seemed like an all-consuming and potentially impossible task.
This is the context in which to fairly judge the last six years of the Clinton presidency.
When I compare the decisions Bill Clinton made to the decisions Barack Obama made in near-identical circumstances, it’s not a close call. Barack Obama did not bring in Dick Morris to advise him. Obama never signed anything as odious as the Welfare Reform Bill turned out to be. Obama did not give free rein to Wall Street to deregulate financial banking and the packaging of over-the-counter (OTC) derivatives.
Barack Obama also didn’t cheat on his wife with a White House intern, lie about it under oath, and force his political allies to rally to his defense. He didn’t fund the DNC with Chinese money or otherwise violate the spirit or the letter of campaign finance law.
Some of these decisions and failings were particular to Bill Clinton and don’t necessarily reflect on his wife. Others were defensive postures that made some sense at the time but don’t really apply to the current political climate. What’s clear in retrospect is that Bill Clinton acted one way when he had congressional majorities and another way when he did not. Liberals liked the Clinton with congressional majorities a lot better than they liked the Clinton who was fighting Gingrich and Dole and Starr. The important point for today is that context matters a lot, and so does character.
Clinton did not come into office looking to sell out the New Deal. He enacted Family Leave and tried to give everyone health care. Insofar as he punched some hippies to get elected, that coalition needed a bit of a reality check. They have the numbers to win a presidential election today, but they did not have the numbers in 1992 or 1996. By 2008, the same demographics that were so weak in 1988 were strong enough that Michael Dukakis might have won. Today, I’m pretty sure Dukakis’s coalition has grown big enough that he would win.
So, lesson one is that we don’t need to be running the same kind of defensive campaign that we ran in 1992. Lesson two is that we can’t apply our current standards to condemn the choices that were made twenty-four years ago.
Bill Clinton had (and has) many faults, but he didn’t cause the ascendancy of conservatism in the 1980’s and 1990’s, and he found a way to win twice in that hostile climate. In doing so, he left a legacy that in some ways weakened the left, but I can’t even imagine what this country would look like if the Republicans had held the White House from 1981 to 2001.
The Democratic Leadership Council is no more. It’s not needed anymore. It would be a mistake to think that Hillary Clinton is running to revive it. She’s running to win the nomination of a party that exists, not a party that existed a quarter century ago.
She’s on track to succeed, despite some bad results that she’s likely to get today.
If you want to know why most Democrats are supporting her, you need to understand that most Democrats see a lot more of this side of the story than they see the side being promoted by the Sanders side of the battle.
That doesn’t mean young people are wrong to prefer Sanders. They have no reason to prefer the policies of the 1990’s. They have reason to resent a lot of the product of those years. But older people, who lived through those battles, know that it’s a complicated story.
I’ve always been a Rainbow Coalition kind of guy, and I’m happy to be in the ascendency now. That doesn’t mean I’m completely ungrateful that someone was willing and able to figure out how to win when my side was too weak to prevail.
The choice between Clinton and Sanders is not a choice between today and 1992; it’s a choice about who you think is best prepared to be president and who can win by the biggest margin. It’s also a bet, or a gamble on how much change you think the system can bear. And it’s a guess about which candidate can get more out of a reluctant Congress.
It’s no easy choice, and I don’t want to pretend that it is, but it’s not a choice between good and evil, and it’s not obvious who is right.
This sounds dead-on-target to me.
Nevertheless I’m waiting for Marie3 to drop the other shoe. (And I’m not being remotely facetious; I really do think of her commentary as providing the most robust possible Hegelian balance to this kind of historically-grounded, essentially optimistic framework.)
To be clear: I understand that the oppositional lines are drawn and there’s Tiabbi and the previous post. But I want to see Marie3 (or equivalent, although I think she’s best at it) rebut these points; because if BooMan’s argument here can survive a Marie3 attack then it’s bulletproof.
To some degree, I think that there are a couple of generation’s worth of (broadly speaking) Liberals that are so used to defending the barricades that they’ve forgotten that the purpose of defending the walls is to ultimately counter-attack from that redoubt and clear the field outside those walls.
There is a real argument to be made on both sides as to whether now is the proper moment to sally forth and clear the besiegers from the gates, or not.
The younger set, and a few of the more radical in the older generations clearly thinks now is the time to drop the defensive stance and attack.
The older set, and a large portion of the always-besieged communities of color, women, and LGBT are not convinced that is so, and are advocating for continuing to hold the line.
What does this look like in practice, when both Houses and the lion’s share of state legislatures and state house, are in opposition hands?
Are we seeing it? If not, why not?
Nominating and electing an unapologetic left-winger with an explicitly Scandinavian-style economic outlook who is a pro-choice absolutist and who clearly articulates a social, racial, and gender worldview that is well to the left of anything seen on the national stage for a long, long time…
Doing so in the face of strong resistance from the moderate wing of the party, and with the enthusiastic support of a massive percentage of the youth.
Explicitly committing to leveraging this base of support in the general election toward engineering a wave election, flipping the senate, and trying to flip the house… and committing to do what Obama should have done, which is to use the power of the Bully Pulpit and the Presidential Bullhorn to pressure recalcitrant legislators and to explicitly organize toward and sustain enthusiasm for the mid-term election and the state elections (that almost all occur in off years).
The demographers have long shown that we’ve got the numbers, despite the attempts to gerrymander and suppress… the only thing that is really needed is the enthusiasm and the coordination and organizational intention, starting now.
That’s what the “come down from the barricades and sally forth” crowd is saying.
I happen to agree quite strongly with this stance, but I also recognize that there are a number of very intelligent and well-informed folks who disagree.
A lot of liberals in the Democratic Party just plain don’t like the ideas that:
A.) They’re viewed as, regardless of their true ideological affilation, some combination of grifters (Daou and Brock) / partisan sell-outs (Krugman and Kos) / bunglers (DWS) by the youth and less affluent members of the party.
B.) That they’re genuinely less leftist than the new generation. A lot of them have built up their worldview around being a brave and multicultural coalition of educated professionals fighting heroically against rural/poor white troglodytes and their Kochian puppetmasters. So criticisms about their wing’s bloodthirstiness / neoliberalism / passivity towards civil rights causes them to flip the fuck out, especially in combination with caveat A.
What makes this even worse is that the re-proletarianization of the middle and working class, regardless if HRC wins the Presidency and somehow wins the House, is going to continue in much the same manner and pace it did over the past 35+ years.
Enjoy the spectacle of longstanding leftist icons such as Krugman and Stewart and Chait being increasingly slandered as useless bourgeois grifters suckling on the sweet milk from the barns of the Democratic plantation. It’ll be pretty fucking funny.
I’ll suggest that calling the Clinton foreign policy record “bloodthirsty” and calling Krugman among the “bourgeois grifters” is no way to persuade Clinton supporters. Clinton supporters disagree with these claims, and stating them with the insult knob turned to 11 tends to push them away.
If one wants to feel superior while Sanders loses the primary, this is an excellent rhetorical strategy to achieve that.
Personally: I think that if your foreign policy is to the right of Margaret Thatcher, you deserve to be called bloodthirsty. As far as Krugman goes: he’s a tenured upper-middle class New Keynesian whose livelihood won’t be endangered anytime soon so long as he sticks his Alan Colmes role.
Actually, I’d be very happy if the Democratic Party started seriously alienating affulent centrists and got populist/centrist exurban whites in exchange. Both from an ideological and ‘let’s win some damn elections’ perspective.
Sooooo… I don’t think I’ll be working too hard on the ‘don’t alienate Clinton supporters’ angle. I beg your pardon.
I see that. The need to alienate those you need to persuade is more important than winning the primary, apparently. If Hillary were only gaining the affluent, she would be getting smashed right now. What of those with middle and lower incomes who support Hillary? They’re actually the larger portion of her voters.
I strongly question your belief that the loss of affluent centrists would be counterbalanced by gaining populist/centrist exurban whites. It would not happen automatically; in fact, the racist pandering and mountains of bullshit they recieve from the GOP makes it unlikely they would come our way at the moment. It would also toss away a constituency that votes more consistently than your exurban whites and has provided financial and electoral support to Bernie in his Congressional runs, as well as Elizabeth Warren and the rest of the most consistent progressives in Congress.
Most people, including most Sanders supporters, don’t vote by ideology; big surprise, right? Nonetheless, the affulent centrists are the ones fucking up our party with their clientelism and neoconservatism and neoliberalism. They have to go.
Those guys are the hardiest voters by demographics, but they’re also a minority. A coalition that keeps them comfortable is the reason why we’ve been in this political mess since 2010 with no real exit point until 2024.
Yeah, yeah. I know the standard affulent centrist spiel. ‘Overlook our neoliberalism and grifting because you NEED that money! Also because exurban whites are so fucking racist that you can’t appeal to them in any numbers! Those polls saying that they want more honest government and more economic liberalism are LIES! Racism will make your project unworkable.’ They may have had a point in 1994, but as of 2008 they have outlived their usefulness.
Just one of the reasons that the affulent centrists have to go. They want to fight an indefinite kulturkampf with tools that will only antagonize the opposing side. Not only that, they’re currently losing the war in the short and medium term and they’re also planning to scuttle any chance of long-term victory by alienating Millenials. Are they fucking stupid or something?
If winnable exurban whites really want more honest government and economic liberalism, they won’t gravitate to Trump or Cruz. If both of these desires were really the primary issues which these people will vote on in November, either Democrat would be the preferable choice for them.
Inferring the opposite suggests you believe that Trump and Cruz will be seen by these voters as honest and economically liberal.
I take your point. But just between you and me, I’ve been pretty taken aback at Krugman lately. He has written so many brilliant columns over the years, and even his average is way above average, but the stuff he writes about Bernie is pathetic.
He’s doesn’t understand Obama very well either, but that’s another story.
No. And I think that the answer can be found by studying the drop-off between 2008 Obama and 2012 Obama.
I find a generic ‘4 years of disillusionment from a slow recovery’ answer unsatisfying. Obama’s bleeding between the two elections was concentrated mostly with Millenials. With every other major non-Millenial cross-sectional demographic (35+ yr olds, non-Millenial POC and whites, by income, by region) Obama at worst only lost about 2% of them. Why was his weakness mostly concentrated in this demographic? While the Asian and Hispanic vote shot up by 12% and 4%, Asian and Hispanic Millenial vote percentage barely budge. And the Asian and Hispanic turnout barely increased at all. Moreover, Obama lost 14% of black male Millenials and 11% of white Millenials (about equal in both genders).
So given that Mr. Suave Super-Organized Badass Multicultural Obama was running up against Mr. Ebenezor “Liar” Pennybags who was heading a party that doubled down on racial revanchism, why were his numbers so bad with Millenials in particular?
Healthcare and healthy people?
Their mothers didn’t make them go out to vote (for those who voted in 2008). And for those new to voting, they were already convinced by the GOP that politics is too dirty to watch or to get involved in.
I know you’re just trying to be cute here, but if that or some similar psychoanalytic perspective is supposed to be the case then what is our (read: the affulent centrist wing’s) plan to deal with this? The only thing more useless than whining about inefficacy is the meta-whining about whining about inefficacy.
I’m not so smart as all that — to answer all the meta-questions. Deep. I’m just saying that mid-terms lost voters because the excitement in 2008 was really high, moms (Black moms in particular) made their kids register and vote, and that didn’t happen in 2010. By then politics wasn’t inspiring. It was filthy dirty. Watching the ACA being made. Ugh! Who wants a part of that? Stand clear.
A Democrat has to win. It’s imperative for so many reasons. Whoever is the nominee has my vote. My biggest fear is a repeat of the post-2008 slump in interest. Can anyone predict, with a Bernie win, if these same millennials go back to sleep? Or get on with their lives? How disappointed will they be when the big banks don’t get broken up? etc? I don’t anticipate them working and engaging. Where’s the bench?
There is nothing I’d like more than for this next generation to take charge and put their ideals to work. I’m with them on the ideals. But we have two candidates older than 68. Obama was the next generation. I always found that promising and full of hope for the future. It’s why (in part) I voted for him. I hoped he would clean up the mess we made! And basically, I’m tired of doing the work for others. I wanted the next age cohort to take on the world. Instead we have a choice of 20 years ago or New Deal?
The system is pretty entrenched. Voting patterns generally remain fairly constant, I think, short a crisis. So given the choice, I’m going with the Democrat, not the Independent. But, as I said earlier in this thread, I think there is a big job to do to bring along the next generation, to convince them that political activity is important, that it offers agency, and that turning away because their candidate lost in a primary is wrong-headed. For that reason, I avoid saying bad things about the candidate I prefer less, and try to put forward ideas about the candidate I prefer. But I don’t HATE either of them, don’t blame them for what their husband may have done, or for a trip to Russia, or any other such stuff. I’m looking ahead to the challenge of defeating Donald Trump, who is running on “America first” (a pretty compelling narrative) or beating Ted Cruz who has theocracy at the heart of his belief system. It’s that message that needs to be put out there — and in those respects there isn’t much daylight between Clinton and Sanders for all those young people who need cultivation to appear in presidential and off-year elections.
I just wish civics were taught in high school again!
I don’t like this kind of argument, because it’s unfalsifiable (thanks to it being unrepeatable — why was this true in 2008 and not 2004 or 2012 or 1988 for that matter?) and because of the previous caveat more importantly because its truth value is more-or-less independent of the underlying political landscape.
Do you that the final and the previous states might be related in some way? That is, the reason for the post-2008 slump in interest is because Democratic partisans have adopted a ‘no matter how bad the Democrat is, we must vote for them’?
Don’t you think that if a sinecure’d worker was told that the middle and upper management will support his performance no matter how poor so long as he was better than his supremely incompetent relatives in his age group — because the company must have a Morgan or Rockefeller in that position for quid quo pro reasons — that said worker would probably regress in performance?
To my perspective, Hillary Clinton is the apotheosis of that mentality. We’re appointing someone who’s a political bungler, viewed as a flip-flopping liar by a majority of the public, who has very sketchy finances, who is showing little promise in marshaling the must-have youth demographic, and is an unapologetic warhawk ideologically between George H. W. Bush and George W. Bush.
I think I have to repeat myself. I’m just not smart enough to follow your argument. Dumb it down a little. And, as someone above stated, your turning the dial to 11 does nothing to convince me — or even make me want to work to understand what you say.
I’m not here to convince you to vote for Clinton. Just to ask you to support your guy without taking down the other person on (I hope you feel this way) our team. So stop trying to convince everyone that she’s evil incarnate. You might be more persuasive.
I’m reminded of Obama’s warning Republicans that they are boxing themselves in by their rhetoric. You are doing the same for fellow Sanders supporters.
Earlier you said you’re willing to give up some portion of Democrats for some other portion. I don’t know why any have to be “given up.”
And as for the drop off in interest question (first paragraph), as I registered voters in 2008 it was clear that young people, especially young Black people where I was working, were excited or encouraged and then taken by the ear to the polls. Besides the normal drop off in interest in off-year elections, these people lost interest even more — perhaps because their initial interest was piqued by the first Black president, or by peer contagion, or by moms insisting. That’s not a bad thing. But he wasn’t on the ticket in 2010. The expected drop in turnout may very well have been compounded by the Republican’s attempts to make politics a brawl. Even high-minded people thought it was ugly. Some Dems contributed to that (eg. Max Baucus). Though a lot got done in the first 2 years of Obama’s presidency, it was painted as illegitimate, less than perfect, a sell-out, etc.
I would contend that Democrats who think that governing is a pure endeavor have a shallow understanding of the political process. And they are falling into the same trap as far-right Republicans who couldn’t stomach Boehner or Cantor or others for lack of purity. I’d venture to guess (and Marie3 can provide the data, I’m sure) that the voters in the US are much more centrist and far less pure than either end of the spectrum.
She’s not evil incarnate. She’s a politically mediocre, flip-flopping grifter (yes, grifter; see her explosion in net worth since the mid-aughts) with no long-term foresight. Nonetheless, with her politically unpopular ideology and lack of any real plan to get us out of this mess other than to hope that the GOP keeps running Donald Trumps she’ll drive the Democratic Party further into ruin.
She’s only evil if you think that Mayor Quimby or the Zapp Brannigann was evil.
The affulent centrist wing wants unbowed social liberalism (with a couple of exceptions like the War on Drugs), neoliberalism, and neoconservatism. These things limit how much we can appeal to Independents and people on the margins of the GOP coalition as well as depressing the turnout and vote-% margins of the must-have demographic of Millenials. So either we have to take them on and reforge the party’s appeal, thus alienating them, or be content with the next 8-12 years (at LEAST) looking like 2015-2016.
I agree. So why are we letting the affulent centrist wing drive our party into the ground with their stupid insistence on neoliberal and neoconservative purity?
There indeed are purity trolls in the Democratic Party, people who are willing to shave down the margins and lose elections in order to advance an unpopular agenda. We call these people centrists/New Democrats/pragmatists.
So, Deathtongue, I really want to understand what you’re trying to say, but I’m afraid I have to give up. Too many neo-this and neo-that and affluent centrist this and that. I guess it’s a jargon with which I’m not familiar. These terms must mean something to you since you use them often. But I’m at a loss. Sorry.
I sort of want to wrap this up in a tight little bundle but am unsure it’s all that possible given the perspectives on either side.
In short, I think both of you have some large parts of the issue wrong and I think the original post is partly to blame.
The presented theories of what goes wrong during mid-term elections is IMHO trying to force-fit an explanation that benefits the larger story. While some of each of these theories may indeed be players, the larger reason for the mid-term losses seem to be more a matter of getting an otherwise non-voting segment of the public to the polls during the mid-terms. There are lots of reasons this is a problem, and each of yours seem logically to be part of the puzzle, just not all of it.
Yes, Obama’s numbers with millenials were so awful that he won them, and the election, by wide margins again.
Perhaps the 2008 numbers with these demographics were so historically aberrational that they would be difficult for any President to repeat in their re-election, particularly a President who had been forced to spend most of his first term cleaning up the preposterously large messes of the previous Administration.
How about a full-throated acknowledgement that their pro-corporate economics and free, but not fair-,trade policies are still crippling us?
The federal government would ordinarily be making transfer payment from tax revenues to the state to avoid the fire-sale of commons. Instead, we have Puerto Rico going on the block for the vultures in the next few months.
There IS economic opinion out there besides School of Chicago. Their record of failure keeps failing and they keep falling upwards.
So an attack is saying stuff that has no chance of going through Congress?
That’s not snark. For me, an attack means actions that have some chance of tangible results. i.e., legislation, policies, or executive action.
Executives choose their economic advisers, not Congress. And there are many ways to put a finger on the scale.
Why did it take Obama seven yrs to restore overtime by executive order when George Bush took it away by executive order?
Obama has been very clear about this from the beginning of his first term. He delayed taking executive action on many things because he wanted to try to get them through Congress, using them as a cudgel against Republicans where they delayed and getting some policy wins where he threatened executive action in coordination with Congressional Democrats to leverage successful action.
That’s a much more secure policy win. That the President was able to do away with W. Bush’s executive action on overtime with one unilateral action makes this clear. A future Republican President could do away with Obama’s overtime executive order, but making the Republicans defend their unpopular position for seven years makes it a bit easier to prevent the next election from going to the Republicans.
If the President had reversed Bush’s order in his first year, it would have drawn the issue into the partisan maw and would have been more easily argued against on policy grounds. When you’re losing 800,000 jobs a month, overtime rights is a marginal issue. It also would also have been forgotten by the electorate by now, instead of being a fresher issue on which the 2016 Democratic candidates can gain small campaign advantages.
Here is a different take on things:
http://twitter.com/ckilpatrick/status/713408704473772032
And it’s a refutation of Booman’s point.
That’s not a refutation of my point, especially about why the superdelegates are not bolting for Sanders.
“Why does the Right get so strong under Clinton and Obama?”
I did a spit take. Yes, the Right is never stronger than when it is denied the tremendous powers of the Executive.
I mean, I can’t even…
Yes, practically the last stand of the Democrats is the executive. We are losing state and statehouses, one-by-one. That’s your definition of a successful party? The presidency and isolated municipalities?
It appears to me that the Democrats are about to win the Senate back; we have held the majority more often than not over the last decade. That is not the record of a Party which is an utter failure. Nor are the records of Democratic Governors and Legislatures. The Republicans have had their wave elections at the State level; we’re looking at a resetting of the landscape in coming years, particularly as some States get to experience the longer-term effects of nihilistic, woman- and minority-hating policies.
The GOP’s extreme gerrymands in many States are deriving them short-term power which the voters did not intend to hand to them. Look at the 2012 election, where more Americans voted for House candidates from the Democratic party but these gerrymands gave the Republicans a 33-seat majority.
I will continue to call these gerrymands a poisoned chalice. They have allowed Republicans to dominate in many State Legislatures and the House of Representatives, despite the fact that their maximalist agendas are not supported by the people of their States. The lack of accountability brought on by these District lines have encouraged radical behavior and actions from Republicans across the board. Executing this toxic strategy to hold power is having a poor effect on Republican Party elected officials and their voters. This is being richly displayed in their POTUS primary battle, as well as the Paul Ryan budget “plan” which was a big loser in 2012 and will be again in 2016.
We are becoming a bi-coastal fringe party with urban islands. Incidentally, where our national wealth is most concentrated…
Kansas re-elected all those people giving them Republicanism good and hard. By pretty good margins.
And I explained that Republicans have gained power illegitimately in most of those States by gerrymanding Congressional and Legislative Districts.
There are reasons, plenty of them, to criticize the Democratic Party and its leaders. I join BooMan in being a reluctant defender of a more balanced view. I’m made to do it here, though, because many commenters have these absolutist views which are unresponsive to debate.
If I can’t affect the opinions of those who believe Democratic Party incompetence will bring us President Trump, at least I can lend a voice that may influence others here.
Feel free to look at these polling results,
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/22/us/politics/republican-democratic-voters-poll.html?_r=1
…and almost all others, and explain to me how they support the claim that Trump would defeat Hillary in a general election matchup, or even come close. It’s too far out from being a done deal, but if Hillary wins the nomination Sanders will campaign for her, as Hillary did for President Obama in 2008. That will affect Sanders voters’ behavior, I expect.
Absolutely. That is the non-economic part of neoliberalism–Social Darwinism. They will champion innate differences, like race, orientation, physical disability, etc. But not performance. They are indifferent to punitive. The Calvinist mind set?
No, an attack is saying the stuff that cannot get through the current congress, and generating the enthusiasm and coordination to change the makeup of that congress.
This requires first building the enthusiasm and then building ON that enthusiasm.
It’s about sustaining.
Whether or not we can sustain is the biggest question of all.
given the current crisis (which I consider existential — and the only such that we face [terrorism? pffft!]), if it doesn’t happen now, it will be too late to save us from ourselves.
This.
Thank you, Martin.
I think this is largely true (as is the other ‘side’ of the argument), but what I don’t understand, as someone said in another thread, is which of Clinton’s policy stances her supporters prefer to Sanders’s.
There’s more to life than policy stances, and there’s a great deal to be said about the first female president, and the fact that Clinton survived tremendous about of mudslinging. But it feels to me like the great unspoken truth of this primary is that many many Democrats prefer a more hawkish foreign policy and a more status quo-oriented domestic policy. Which is perfectly fine; we can’t all agree. Still I’m not sure I’ve ever seen anyone (other than Clinton herself) simply admit it.
I think her college affordability plan is better because it doesn’t require the states to kick in a third of the funds. I don’t even know how Senator Sanders can, in good faith, propose a plan that includes a provision like that after the Supreme Court ruling on expanding Medicaid. If it is unconstitutional, to this court, to require states to kick in 10% of the funds for expanding healthcare coverage for some of our poorest then requiring them to kick in 30% of college costs would be too.
I think her Wall Street regulation plan is better because it shadow banking/the derivatives market which was the biggest cause of the financial meltdown.
The fact that she called to fund Alzheimer’s research to the levels needed is a big deal to me. Having personally lost a grandparent to that disease and having done research on the costs of Alzheimer’s to our society I see it as the biggest healthcare crisis we have – a crisis that disproportionately affects women because caregiving often falls to them.
Obviously, everything changed after the 1994 midterms…
Dare we ask why those midterms were such a disaster for Democrats? Couldn’t be b/c WJC screwed up in his first two years? Nah, the Clintons are never responsible for electoral losses by DEMs not named Clinton.
Democrats I knew in 1992 voted for WJC for many reasons, not among those reasons were Hillary heading up health care reform, DADT (WJC’s policy; so don’t know why you’re citing “ending DADT”), most of that 60% of voters that rejected GHWB because they didn’t want NAFTA (or his capital gains tax reduction or his stupid flag burning amendment. A plurality, if not a majority, approved the tax increase, but we didn’t expect that the wealthy would get all that back and more a few years later with the capital gains tax reduction. Many expected that a peace dividend would be realized and we could get back to investing in all the infrastructure projects that had been deferred under Reagan/Bush for their stupid MIC purchases and wars.
WJC was feckless, lost Congress, and turned into GHWB. Might as well have kept the original and maybe have held onto Congress and waited for a real Democrat to figure out how to run and win the office of the Presidency.
I think dem congress plus elder bush is more liberal than gingrich congress plus the clenis.
Dem congress never would have passed NAFTA under Bush. Would China have gotten most favored nation, which did even more damage? Clinton has that on his plate, too. Both were reversals of campaign promises, btw.
He was an unknown quantity when elected in the three way. Folks had buyers remorse?
Clinton said he would support NAFTA with some changes which he mostly got. MFN was a reversal.
So you’re claiming “WJC screwed up in his first two years”? Those were by far the most liberal two years of policy pursuits of his Administration, and the electorate repudiated him and his Congressional Caucuses at their first opportunity.
Honestly, it might be worthwhile to have you actually engage BooMan’s post here instead of plowing forward unresponsively.
A pretty solid post. My only point would be that HRC has gone for essentially false attacks when she feels threatened by both Obama and Sanders. So in that context I think shes more evil. But even there she does appear to have a line (clintonista advisers dont) and maybe you thinks the times require a little lying. Its a legitimate position.
I’m in the older set and not besieged. But I don’t see this election as “holding the line.” I see it as a continuation of progressive movement forward. It’s a rather conservative-liberal position. Conservative in the sense of maintaining what’s good and moving towards correcting the flaws. It’s not radical, not revolutionary. I did that in my 20’s during the VietNam War and the civil rights movement. For me, this is the flaw of the Sanders position and I’ve said it here before. Obama built an amazing coalition. He said repeatedly: You want change? Make me do it? He went so far as to try to harness the energy of an election to create an organization to try to channel voters to make the changes. But that fizzled. Kids killed in an elementary school? Huge margins in favor of gun control. Sign those petitions. But NOTHING. Health care? Well, let’s go to court. Again and again and still. Death panels won out over single payer. And on and on.
I believe, because I’ve seen it (I guess), that people overestimate how involved they will remain in the political sphere once an election is over. They get juiced up by the rhetoric and then once election day passes, they go back to their normal lives: school, raising families, paying for that nice new car, maybe keeping their heads financially above water, or watching the elite eight. But there just doesn’t seem to be the time, energy, knowledge, or passion to do the work required to convince legislators to pass laws. Most all of us leave that work to others.
I’m hopeful that young people who are Bernie supporters can look at a bigger picture than has been presented here in the comments section. I hope they press for continued financial reforms, for continued action to forestall a climate catastrophe, for measured military involvement in the world, for continued non-proliferation of nuclear weapons, for moderately liberal Supreme Court justices, for access to health care for all, for better administration of the VA, for campaign finance reform, and more. All of these are already ongoing. This is a liberal reformist agenda, not a revolution. And I hope it’s an agenda that’s easy for Sanders supporters to support, regardless of the Democratic candidate, because these are the goals of our party.
Curious if you think another Wall Street bailout would be enacted under Clinton, vs taking advantage of Dodd-Frank? Would you expect her economic advisers to support that route?
If you’re asking that of me, I say “Who can know?” My sense is that the public has no appetite for a Wall Street bailout of the kind done before. But if there seemed to be a crisis like 2007, I think it’s likely that something would be done in a different form — as it probably should be. We did bail out auto companies (not just once, but twice) and that worked out OK. Good for workers, yes? We did bail out Mexico once. We are about to help Puerto Rico in some way. I agree that the formulation of the bailout was ill-devised in that it didn’t require most of that money to go to Main Street, as it should have. Mortgages should have been reduced, for instance. It was too quickly passed with, as folks say, “unforeseen consequences.” The institutions were unkind and selfish. The emergency overwhelmed the Congress. It’s akin, in my opinion, to the Patriot Act, similarly passed when passions were high with lots of unintended consequences. Good intentions, some reasonable results, and some errors. It’s what people do when afraid.
Excellent post, Booman. Though I sympathize with Bernie, I really feel that his biggest fault–and really, some of his supporters–is totally missing what was going on during the 90s when Clinton did some of the stuff he did. Republicans felt Bill Clinton was an illegitimate President and treated him like one. After 94, they along with the (new) media–how did Chris Matthews, FOX News, many of the right wing pundits we take for granted make their names?–peddled outright slander and played up every conspiracy. Worse, he was subject to unprecedented and frivolous legal attacks by right wing billionaires. This was all new then, something nobody had seen or faced on that level. We are somewhat more sophisticated now, but to ignore what was happening and to make Clinton the author of all that’s wrong in the world is stupid.
Wasn’t Clinton responsible for the media consolidation that plagues us to this day? Hoist on his own petard?
No. That was the Regan Administration that issued the ‘Appearance of Non-Monopoly is Good Enough Even if There Actually is a Monopoly’ DoJ Opinion Letter concerning future enforcement of the Sherman Anti-Trust Act and it’s revisions.
By the time Clinton came to office, the Supreme Court had already made it all but impossible (if not impossible) to reverse by executive action.
Whoa. I see what you mean. Good grief. The Reagan Assault on Antitrust was the dam that broke the middle class. Read these two in sequence and it becomes ironically clear.
..http://www.multinationalmonitor.org/hyper/issues/1986/0215/correia.html
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/12/how-wall-street-hollowed-out-industrial-america?page=2
She’s a plodder. It’s a choice between the past and the future. The only serious harm in choosing the past over the future is lost opportunity; the choice will be presented again until the future is chosen.
To add, Clinton left office a very popular president, with approval ratings equal to or better than St. Ronnie. His legacy and technocratic abilities to “make government work” played a large role in the 2000 election. George W. had to track to the right-center–compassionate conservatism anyone?–largely as a result of the Clinton. Sure, Clinton did not do everything right, but in a lot of ways, he made the Democratic Party “safe” to vote for again for a lot of people.
I think he got the benefit of the “fairness” issue in his numbers.
I think that Democrats who have been around a while are crouched in a defensive posture not just about policy but about the Clintons themselves. Democrats no longer distinguish valid character concerns from Vince Foster allegations, and they readily dismiss financial entanglements from the Clintons that would disqualify other candidates.
I also think that Democrats do not distinguish between an unnecessarily defensive posture on policy and Obama’s strategy of negotiating for what he can get. Part of reality is achieving what you can under the power structure that obtains now. Where does unnecessary defensiveness end and productive strategy begin? People who insist on wanting it all turn victories into defeats and isolate themselves from anyone actually fighting the good fight.
I would be curious to know the demographic destiny of Dem politics at the presidential level if millennials basically gave up on electoral politics altogether? Stayed as persuadable indies, or dropped off.
Depends on what you mean by giving up and over what timeframe. If next election Millenial turnout dropped by 5% evenly across all races and raw vote-% dropped by an additional 5-7% with white Millenials and 4-6% with black Millenials while changing no other demographic from 2012, 2016 will look like a cross between 2000 and 2012 assuming that Clinton does no worse (doubtful) or better than Obama and Trump does no worse (very doubtful, fortunate for HRC) or better than Romney. That’s enough to let Clinton comfortably slip into the White House with about a 3-4% popular vote margin — but it eliminates any chance of winning the Senate.
Past that, if things stabilize at that level then the Democratic Party will eventually float up to prominence. But if the Millenial vote tanks a similar way in both 2016 and 2020 that it did in 2012 then 2024 will look a lot like 2000.
The exclusive obsession with millenial turnout and voter preference is odd, particularly since we are winning younger voters in recent elections and will continue to do so in 2016. They’re becoming a consistent part of our coalition. I agree that we want to keep their turnout as high as possible, but that’s true of the other demographics in our coalition as well.
This part is where I fall away particularly strongly from supporting these analyses: “…while changing no other demographic from 2012…”. If anything is guaranteed in 2016, it is that no demographic will be unchanged from 2012. The electorate is changing.
I fail to see evidence supporting the claim that a Sanders general election candidacy would give the Democrats a better chance of winning back Congressional control than a Clinton candidacy. If Sanders can’t win the nomination, this argument is repudiated. Bernie was correct in stating that his campaign would need to generate huge voter turnouts to win the primary. The better the turnout in November, the better our odds of retaking Congress. If Bernie’s campaign remains unsuccessful in consistently manifesting outsized turnouts in the primaries, it’s hard to make the case that it would in November.
There’s many reasons why I’m voting for Sanders, but expecting him to improve our chance of winning back Congress relative to Clinton is not one of them.
When talking about the current electoral map, who gives a shit about whether Clinton’s administration was a slow-rolling sellout or a heroic vanguard against a right-wing revanche? What we know right now, under current demographics and political history, is that Clintonism is a millstone. Its near-best case scenario for the next eight years is that nothing really gets worse.
That’s downright intolerable considering A.) The GOP is only one black swan, scandal, or fuck-up away from a clean-sweep of federal government and have already pretty much overtaken state government B.) that the forces of Traditional America Fascism are organizing and will certainly run someone more competent than Trump next go round and C.) that the Democratic Party seems poised to lose its advantage with Millenial whites and POC. You know, the demographic that was supposed to passively carry the party to victory. Not just with turnout, but raw voting-%. 2012 Obama lost 11% of white Millenials and 14% of black male Millenials to fucking Mitt Romney. Don’t kid yourself into thinking that the GOP is going to be so odious that the Millenials who do manage to show up to the poll are still going to side with the Democrats.
Social liberalism + economic centrism ain’t cutting the mustard. It’s a very risky strategy and 2008 Obama and 2016 Sanders has shown us a more reliable way forward.
What centrist platform? Hillary is running on a huge increase in minimum wage, increased labor organization, no more unfair trade deals, and a big increase in taxes on unearned income. That’s a strong liberal agenda, and if implemented it’ll substantially improve life for those struggling millennials.
And she and the rest of the wing of the party is not credible on those. She’s especially not credible on the middle two issues (lol NAFTA and TPP) but even on the issue where she has a positive track record (minimum wage) she’s still not credible. After all, her agenda is even more unrealistic than Bernie’s because she doesn’t show any potential of winning the House under her own power. There’s no ‘how do we convince the Dem majority to stick out their neck for even quarter-loaf economic leftism’ step because she won’t have a Dem majority.
But regardless of which ideological wing would be more credible in passing any agenda at all: do you honestly believe that Clinton will spend what little political capital she’ll have going into 2017 on, in the words of her supporters, unicorns and ponies issues? The people who brand themselves as being mature and pragmatic and willing to look reality in the eye, hence the repeated calls to gear up for 4-8 years of toil and disillusionment? Cut me a break.
Despite your repeated calls for a smoking gun (because the circumstantial evidence for the Democratic Party preparing to run more neoliberalism is overwhelming), HRC and her wing’s supposed agitation for more economic leftism is just plain not credible. Clinton has a huge untrustworthiness rating for a reason.
What makes this even worse is that the re-proletarianization of the middle and working class, regardless if HRC wins the Presidency and somehow wins the House, is going to continue in much the same manner and pace it did over the past 35+ years.
Enjoy the spectacle of longstanding leftist icons such as Krugman and Stewart and Chait being increasingly slandered as useless bourgeois grifters suckling on the sweet milk from the barns of the Democratic plantation. It’ll be pretty fucking funny.
Wrong position. Ugh.
I have to admire this rhetorical stance: whatever your preferred candidate states is unquestionably what he truly believes, but whatever the candidate you don’t like states is automatically “not credible”. You used that phrase four times, along with “untrustworthiness” and “unrealistic”, in the course of a pretty brief commentary.
I see the Matt Taibbi’s article as a moment of clarity, truth to power. As I have said before, the real problem began with Bill Clinton’s embrace of Al From and the DLC. The most important question for us involves an honest examination of how has that worked out so far. The heart of this problem was injecting neo-liberalism into the Democratic Party. This was the seed for the destruction of the Democratic Party because we were no longer the party of the people, just pretending to be.
When Bill and Co-President Hillary started to take Republican issues as their own my first reaction was that it was just too clever for words. It took me until well after the Clinton Presidency ended for me to begin to understand the full impact of just how destructive those actions actually were. The really jarring realization of the seriousness of this was learning how Bill Clinton with his economic team had sown the seeds of the 2008 economic meltdown with their eagerness to turn the hounds loose with deregulation. Another too clever for words scheme was taking the mantle of being the party of Big Money away from the Republicans giving it to themselves. This was the bitter end of the Democratic New Deal coalition.
This DLC embrace along with Bill Clinton’s lack of control to curb his adolescent carnal urges had weakened the Democratic Party to the point where a truly idiot Republican could get close enough to steal the next election. So far, it’s not working out very well.
What was still hidden from view was the extent the DLC had not closed up shop but instead moved inside the machinery of the Democratic Party. I missed that at first although it should have been perfectly clear looking at Obama’s pick for his first administration. Then we started to notice that progressive candidates were being shut out by the Democratic Establishment. Same as throwing a bucket of cold water on his base, Obama started with his Grand Bargain nonsense. He was attempting to pull the same DLC stunt as Bill Clinton but it didn’t work because of his race. We had dodged a bullet to witness the destruction or weakening of our best New Deal accomplishments by no less than a sitting Democratic President but there was still a heavy price to pay. This DLC inspired Democratic machinery had managed to put the Democratic base to sleep enough to lose both houses of Congress again plus a significant portion of State Houses. We are on a steady glide path to defeat but we still don’t get it. Behind the scenes the DLC element was getting stronger and stronger setting up the coronation of their next leader, Hillary Clinton. Taking no chances, they rigged the nomination, very pragmatic of them.
What you’re seeing today is not so much a rejection of Hillary Clinton but what the Democratic Party has become since their embrace of the DLC and neo-liberalism. Bernie keeps telling us is that this is not so much about electing Bernie Sanders as it is about a political revolution to bring large numbers of people back into our democratic process. What that really means is breaking that toxic hold the DLC continues to have on the Democratic Party.
Fixing this is the only way to allow the Democrats to exit this sure path to defeat. This will take no less than the Bully Pulpit to be successful. If Hillary wins, the Democratic Party loses.
Taibbi’s Truthteller bit goes off the rails sometimes. Look how Matt spends time in the piece BooMan linked raking Hillary over the coals for the passage of the crime bill while she was First Lady, invoking Michelle Alexander to stoke the coals, while conveniently avoiding that, unlike Hillary, Bernie voted “Yes” on that crime bill. Taibbi whistles nervously while we wonder what Alexander thinks of Sanders’ vote. Hell, what does Taibbi think of that vote?
I’m still going to vote for Bernie. Some of what Taibbi posits I can agree with. But there’s just too much bullshit from the Truthteller here and elsewhere.
I’ll also note that Taibbi acts as though he’s channeling the views of all younger voters supporting Sanders while quoting precisely none of them. Maybe, just maybe, those young people supporting Sanders have a more balanced view of Clinton.
A simpler way to look at it, whether you’re a younger or older Sanders supporter: if Bernie fails to win the primary, would your values be represented by failing to support Clinton in the general election against the GOP candidate who will thoroughly attack and repudiate everything Bernie stands for?
As usual, well said.
Sorry, but your post has nothing to do with what I said.
Even if we support Hillary we still lose because of what the Democratic Party has become. If we do our duty and vote for Hillary all we would have accomplished would be to kick the can down the road a bit.
All the DLC inspired Democrats really know how to do is to lose elections, not if but when.
So, for example, how does Bernie’s vote for the 1994 crime bill fit with your inferred claim that he is the only one who can restore the Democratic Party?
We’re in a deeply flawed political atmosphere that has a set of deeply flawed Presidential candidates, Bernie included. The “lesser of two evils” frame is very silly. We’re all human beings, and we’re all doing our best, Democratic Party voters included. Bernie’s worth my vote, but not my worship. He won’t save us.
Good Gawd. Bill Clinton’s dalliance with Monica Lewinsky 18 or so years ago is responsible for the possibility that “a truly idiot Republican could get close enough to steal the next election”???
The next election was the idiot George W Bush and it certainly was a big factor in both depressing Democratic voter turnout and energizing Republican turnout.
2000 election. Gore, however, was spooked by the scandal and therefore distanced himself from Clinton. That was election malpractice. Had Gore won either his home state or Clinton’s home state Florida wouldn’t have mattered. I firmly believe Clinton, given his 60%+ approval rating, could have flipped one state for him but Gore said no stay away.
I agree with everything you say here except your interpretation of Obama. Even you admit he didn’t really give anything away. It all comes down to whether he really thought they would take the bait or not. I’m pretty sure he didn’t.
But I don’t want to get off track. What you say about the Clintons and the Democratic Party is spot on.
I completely agree with this. I also didn’t fully understand it until around 2003. Then Howard Dean came along, and I did and still do regard him as the savior of Democratic values in the party.
fascist/corporatist-lite/the lesser of two evils, they just know, and correctly so imo, that HC represents the perpetuation of that. The “party that exists” IS the product of the 3rdway machinations from the leadership down to the members whose egos are deeply submerged in the Bubblicious successes of the Clinton economy that were used to bash the Bushbots with, and they’ll cling to that with the very same type and strength of tenacity with which the Pee Partiers cling to their guns and bibles.
And just because their flagship the DLC ain’t sailing anymore, hardly means that its sailors sailed off into the sunset never to be seen again.
The choice is between the 3rdway/DLC candidate in spirit and in practice, and a throwback, FDR dem determined to turn back the clock on the 3rdway infilTRATORS/usurpers.
Both of them are prepared to be pres, and that’s not the issue to struggle with, but rather who’s gonna be the kinda pres policy pursuit-wise to be preferred.
Fair enough on Clinton administration, and, just for the record I’m impressed with Obama, getting more than one would think possible domestically and great foreign policy. We wouldn’t even be looking at Sanders’ candidacy if Obama hadn’t got us started down a path or restoring and revising the New Deal and pioneering a non-hegemonic leadership role for the USA internationally.
Assessing the potential Clinton admin it is wrong to omit the years 2000-2008 [when HRC was in office] and the empowerment of neocons with which HRC is aligned. This is not 1992; challenges are different. War on drugs aside, it’s what the Clintons have done 2000-2016 that makes me a Sanders supporter.
I totally agree.
By the way, that 538 article makes a composition and division fallacy error when comparing Dukakis’ vote-%s. The biggest, though certainly not only, mistakes he makes involve turnout. Black turnout increased by a massive 10% between 1988 and 2008. 18-24 turnout spiked by a comparable 8.5%.
Age is something of a fly in the ointment. Dukakis did much better with the 60+ vote than Obama, but also did much worse with the 45-60 vote (Silent Generation) than Dukakis. However, the median age in 1988 was a few years lower. My gut instinct would be to say that these factors cancel out, but I haven’t run the numbers.
Also, too, re: not looking at Bill Clinton admin as measure of what to expect: since Bill left office that he and Hillary have become playahs via the Clinton Foundation, another warning sign to me.
problems w Clinton admin: Glass Steagal, NAFTA, as mentioned above.
Where do unions fit in all this? If anyone has any insight, I’d be v. interested.
Currently? They don’t. Membership is too low these days and they’re too concentrated in the federal government to mean anything.
Maybe unionism will blossom again (especially with the re-proletarization of the American work) in the next 6-10 years, depending on the makeup of the USSC, but odds are they won’t be a force unless things go really well or really poorly.
I meant also in the Clinton years. I don’t know when the decline of union power started, or how or why.
of unions was Reagan firing air traffic controllers when they went on strike. It altered labor dynamics in the United States
It wasn’t Ronald Reagan who fired the air traffic controllers. You see, at the time he allegedly made that decision, President Reagan was already being controlled by electrodes that the Evil Bill and Hillary Clinton had implanted in his brain. The Evil Clintons were, as usual, playing the long game as they prepared to seize power.
Private sector unions began once Taft-Hartley (1948) kicked in. Large industrial unions were powerful enough by then that they could manage to hold onto a lot of the power for another 25 years, but private sector unionization slowed to a trickle. Union organizers moved into the public sector because that’s where gains could be made.
Private sector union membership declined as companies moved operations to open-shop states. Declined further when operations were moved offshore. And some members voted to decertify the union. UMW was once really strong.
Curious, Marie, did Gary Hart initiate today’s Democratic coalition during McGovern’s primary by going against Labor (who supported the war and Humphrey) and going after the socially liberal professional and small business class to add to the anti-war youth which was quite anti-labor. Although they lost badly, that core did get developed later, no?
Excellent question. Wonder if anyone has explored that in-depth and written about it. (I’m going to assume that you meant that is was the small business class that was anti-labor and not the anti-war youth that was anti-labor because it wasn’t; we/they weren’t dummies. OTOH, the small business class wasn’t much of a factor in the McGovern nomination as they tend to be Republicans.) The narrative would have to begin before 1972 for it to be accurate. Labor, at the member level, didn’t embrace the civil rights legislation. The Vietnam War created huge fissures among the non-southern DEM coalition. Would be interesting to go back and consider the position of labor wrt HHH and RFK in the Spring of ’68, both of whom strongly supported labor unions. After RFK’s death, McGovern served, very weakly, as his stand-in that year, but he too was strong on labor union matters. Quite possible that labor fell in line with HHH and thereby, deepened the fault lines.
By ’72, there probably wasn’t a way for McGovern to get the nomination without going around labor because, and I’m guessing here, they remained in HHH camp or had already bolted to Nixon. Also can’t omit the fact that the most radical union leader during that period was Walter Reuther and that he died in a plane in 1970. That left Meany as the biggest labor guy and he was way past his prime. So, he not only damaged the DEM party brand but also didn’t serve unions very well.
Difficult for me to speculate on what, if anything, Hart took with him from the ’72 and how that led to his later positions. By ’84 the large industrial unions were much smaller and less powerful than they’d been in ’72. But my guess is that Hart has always at heart been a neoliberalcon.
Here’s a chart which tells a stark history:
http://i.huffpost.com/gen/955174/thumbs/o-CEPRUNIONIZATIONRATE19482012-570.jpg?6
Private sector unionization was at its highest as a percentage of the workforce in the mid-50’s. It started a long, slow slide afterwards, which accelerated during the Carter Administration and hit overdrive during the Reagan Revolution and afterwards.
The simplest way to summarize the changes is that manufacturing jobs were particularly thickly organized. When those jobs were lost, in part but far from solely due to large trade deals, the service jobs which have taken a larger role in the economy were not successfully organized, in part but not solely due to bad labor laws which allow employers to fire, suspend, abuse and harass workers who try to organize collective bargaining at their workplaces.
I’m not finding the poll online right now, but I recall around 2010 a poll was run which had over 50% of private sector workers saying they would like a union at their workplace. What, then, explains the current rate of private sector unionization below 10%? That huge gap of tens of millions of American workers is best explained by labor law and their often lax enforcements, which tip the advantage in a workplace organizing drive decidedly toward the employers.
The sharp rise in public sector unionization was created chiefly by an executive order from President Kennedy:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_10988
I hope this helps. Feel free to ask any question you may have.
Booman, I really respect the way that you manage to challenge the assumptions and prejudices of both Clinton supporters and Sanders supporters.
Bernie Sanders is smart as a whip and a class act. If he goes into the convention without a majority, I fully expect him to emulate what Hillary Clinton did in 2008, and present a motion from the floor to waive the delegate counting and simply declare the candidate with a majority as the nominee.
This post really spoke to me, even though I don’t agree with all your conclusions.
Yes, it was definitely of major importance that a Democrat held the White House at that time. But that doesn’t mean I have any affection for the Clintons.
You say, “We can debate the part NAFTA played in all this”, and then move on.
I was involved in the NAFTA fight. Like many others, I saw his support of NAFTA as a slap in the face to the very people without whom he wouldn’t have made it to the White House. Working-class Democrats. If Bill made those eight years Democratic, the voters who elected him had something more Democratic in mind.
Of course I didn’t turn around and start voting for Republicans.
And with Gingrich … Clinton was too conciliatory. It was old-line midwestern congressmen that saved Clinton’s butt there, and ours. Clinton would have given away a lot more had it not been for them.
As far as Ken Starr, etc. Remember, no matter how much they attacked Clinton, and how bad they made him look, his popularity remained very high. That’s because people sensed very clearly what a hatchet job it was — and why.
That’s why Clinton did NOT need to to get more and more conciliatory. But,as you note, he did.
I got the distinct sense (and I’ve had no reason to change this impression) that for the Clintons, it was all about the Clintons, not about the voters.
As for Hillary Clinton, I have just the opposite impression from you. She’s the same person, thinks just the same way as she did in the 90s, and (most importantly) hangs out with the same crowd of people — and God only knows why we need to go back to that again in these vastly different times.
Bill Clinton’s popularity is wearing thin. I actually liked the guy but the results of his welfare reform, crime bill and job losses on top of his personal failings are hard to take in hindsight. Yes, I said hindsight.
I like Obama too but I have reservations, which are not important here. It will take some time for me to sort them all out. For now I find a fifth term of Clinton/Obama hard to swallow. What keeps me from shutting it all down with a fuck it is the truly insane on the other side. Trump and Cruz are as close to fascist as can be. Kasich is a meh! And a corporate asshole like the others. And who can ever forget the Scotus. I do join with others in the belief Sanders will ultimately support Hillary. But, damn, I don’t like it.
I wonder if the people vetting this SCOTUS nominee checked with the gentleman on the subject of filming police on the job by the public. That would seem a dangerous issue to be brought up under this law and order justice.