Here’s something about me:
I don’t care very much about what you believe in, particularly: God, Jesus, and/or Allah; Elvis is alive; Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone; the moon is made of green cheese; all of the above or none. It’s not my place to care and frankly, I have more important things to worry about.
I respect the beliefs of others, and I expect and demand the same respect. Just because I don’t believe as you do doesn’t mean I deserve to have your beliefs shoved down my throat. And the stuffing of certain extremist-religious right beliefs down the national throat is rampant these days: the current most-obvious example is the Washington Post story about pharmacists being allowed to NOT prescribe birth control AND to refuse to forward the prescription.
Many of us are justifiably enraged about the infringement of our rights this represents. What’s been troubling me, though, is I can’t figure out WHY these objectionist people would go into pharmacy at all.
Prescribing birth control pills will be a regular and frequent task in a pharmacy. You don’t sign up to be an accountant if your religious beliefs forbid handling money. You don’t enlist in the military if you can’t for any reason countenance the idea of killing.
I strongly oppose discrimination on religious grounds, but if your religious beliefs make you unqualified to perform the requirements of the job, you shouldn’t get the job. Period. This isn’t a minor adjustment, like coming in on off-days to make up religious time off, this is a major requirement DEFINING the job of a pharmacist.
If you don’t like pharmaceutical birth control, that’s your personal choice. You can write letters to your representative, protest (and watch me protest for birth control right across the street from you), but while these pharmaceuticals are LEGAL, it is a pharmacist’s JOB to fill a prescription.
It’s as simple as that, and I truly cannot believe we as a country are entertaining LEGISLATION to cater to these dogma freaks.
Could you please post a link.
I tried. Booman’s tags are different than Kos’ and I’m not so HTML literate. Does this work:
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=1802&e=2&u=/washpost/20050328/ts_washpos
t/a5490_2005mar27
Same tags. E-mail me if you need any help. Anytime.
I did have a problem…I tried to use the tags for a link and, no matter what I did, it would tell me that “This section is not valid” or something similar.
I thought I was using the tags wrong and I tried several different variations, bu no luck. It would let me preview but not post. Once I took the link out, there was no problem (I’m usually conscientious about posting links with my stories).
but, in practice, it wasn’t working out.
So, for this site, the link goes in the first set of brackets, and the displayed text goes in the second? That’s what I tried, but no luck.
Thanks, and I’ll email you if my next diary gives me the same problem 🙂
Well, I’m not surprised. Things that I think should be beyond the realm of possibility seem to be happening right and left these days.
I read that story also and had emailed it to myself for future reference. This is happening all over the country with several states passing laws saying you can deny prescriptions based on religious or your own personal moral values. Now there is I believe a bill in Minnesota? that will allow health care workers/doctors to refuse to treat anyone who is homosexual. What’s next? Refusing on your political beliefs, skin color once again?
Like you, I’m wondering also why people go into this profession when they know they are going to refuse certain prescriptions based on their personal beliefs. Can they start denying say someone who is gay medicines that person is taking for aids for example ..I mean this list can just get longer and longer if you start putting personal moral(not that I consider that moral at all) values into play.
This is getting way, way out of hand in this country…and anyone who doesn’t think we’re sliding into a christian fundamentalist theocracy is really not paying attention.
if someone who is refused a prescription for birth control could sue based on religious discrimination?
Refusing birth control is a position taken only by certain sects within Christianity (my knowledge of other religions doesn’t extend to their positions on contraception).
So, if you are denied birth control because your religious beliefs don’t agree with your pharmacists, do you have a case?
It’s kind of tortured reasoning, but I would so like to see this pursued.
Along with the one raised in the diary – why, if your religious beliefs keep you from being able to perform a particular job, would you take it?! And, looking at this from a religious standpoint – don’t these people think that God would prefer a woman protect herself against having children she does not want to begin with rather than have an unwanted pregnancy and perhaps persue an abortion? To me, this is common sense. <sigh>
for you:
Let’s say a religious extremist cop is called out on a domestic abuse call.
Let’s say he refuses to arrest a man who has just beaten and raped his wife, because his religion tells him that a woman is her husband’s property and thus she cannot bring assault and rape charges against him.
Should we now make laws protecting the rights of police to not arrest abusive men (and women, I guess) if their religion dictates otherwise?
And that’s where the distortion comes in.
The God that I know wants everyone to be happy and fulfilled. He wants everyone to be safe and secure. I think society gets itself and God confused, and makes up its own spiritual laws based on its own interpretation of things.
Our hypothetical police officer would probably go into rigor fits if he was told that what he did was a crime against God and ‘religion’.
NARAL Pro-choice America has a petition to sign “telling our nation’s biggest pharmacies (Wal-Mart, CVS, Rite Aid, Walgreen’s, and Eckerd’s) not to stand between a woman and her physician.”
Sign here: http://prochoiceaction.org/campaign/pharmacy_petition
Beyond the question of why someone with those beliefs would go into pharmacy in the first place.
A medical doctor writes a prescription for a patient based on the patient’s medical needs, and a pharmacist decides to veto that decision? Where the hell is that coming from? There are many medical reasons for prescribing birth control pills, just as with many other medicines – how the hell is the pharmacist to know which condition is being treated?
People need to complain to medical licensing boards, and start bringing malpractice suits based on these refusals. Let’s see if they can defend their arrogant righteousness in courtrooms.
well, the powers that be have allready set in motion the wheels to stop such law suits, to protect the doctors, and the big corps.
It was repeated constantly on the radio here before the election from doctors, and medical profession that they could not continue (afford) to practice medicine because of the malpractice suits….anyone remember that one going through the legislation?
The wheels are turning, and these bastards are clearing every little pebble in the roadway to make sure their wheels, have NO bumps, let alone a SpeedBump.
It may not be part of the title on the bill, but you can bet it’s either in there, or an ammendment to place it their, when they need it.
whether someone refused a birth control prescription had grounds to sue. I was thinking on religious discrimination grounds, but I also thought it was a major long shot (IANAL). I didn’t even consider malpractice.
Then again, you’re right about malpractice legislation. I can’t believe that so many Republican supporters can complacently support the unfettered expansion of government powers. Does no one realize that these expanded powers will inevitably be used against them someday?
Wait until the housing bubble crashes, and we’ll see how many Republicans are just loving the bankruptcy bill.
all in all, and your absolutely correct, when the bubble breaks, down will come baby, bathwater and all.
Their allready getting a taste of their own medicine at the gas pumps, and it will NOT get any better. When it starts costing a 100 bucks to fill that Cadillac SUV, then it cuts into the pockets deeper, well……
The sad part is, the rest of us have that medicine taste, without the “brain dead flu” yuuuckkkkk.
Done!
Went there, did that. Thanks
when the chief justice of the court that appointed your ceremonial figurehead believes that secular government aided the rise of Hitler.
==
Scalia To Synagogue – Jews Are Safer With Christians In Charge
by Thom Hartmann
Antonin Scalia, the man most likely to be our next Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, turned history on its head recently when he attended an Orthodox synagogue in New York and claimed that the Founders intended for their Christianity to play a part in government. Scalia then went so far as to suggest that the reason Hitler was able to initiate the Holocaust was because of German separation of church and state.
The Associated Press reported on November 23, 2004, “In the synagogue that is home to America’s oldest Jewish congregation, he [Scalia] noted that in Europe, religion-neutral leaders almost never publicly use the word ‘God.'”
“Did it turn out that,” Scalia asked rhetorically, “by reason of the separation of church and state, the Jews were safer in Europe than they were in the United States of America?” He then answered himself, saying, “I don’t think so.”
link
Nothing gets me more riled up when people like Scalia rewrite history to suit their own ideology. When in fact Hitler counted on churches/religion to help him put his agenda to the people. Some of Hitlers speeches could have been said by bush for all hitler’s use of god in them..arrrrrrrrrrrrrh
sounds like Scalia’s reading of history is about as accurate as his reading of the Constitution
— Hitler actively used the Church
— the people most responsible for the development of the this nation were very clear that they WANTED separation of church and state – they were well aware of the the not so distant history of religious conflict in Europe
— while Washington might have have attended church and serve as a vestryman, he did not take communion and it is not clear that he even believed in God
— Jefferson was certainly not a conventional Christian — even as an 18th Century deist he was kind of out there. People know about his letter to Danbury Baptist, but may not be aware of how much he rejected churches because of the attacks by Federalist Clergymen on him . He was also quite blunt about some of his ideas on religion in his correspondence with others
— Madison fought tooth and nail to get Jefferson’s Virginia Statute of Religious Freedom through the legislature, being opposed by among other Patrick Henry, of whom I admit I have never been fond.
— I have a simple question for Scalia — if the Founders had so intended for Christians to be in charge, why is there no mention of God anywhere in the Constitution or Bill of Rights, and why does Article VI of the original Constitution specifically prohibit religious tests for office?
where is the AMA? Some excerpts from today’s piece:
Can the center hold?
As soon as something becomes optional an extremist will try to make it forbidden. Just look to Iraq to see what happens when the extremists are let out of their cages. Women are afraid to go out alone or wear even slightly revealing clothes, alcohol sellers have been murdered.
It begins slowly and insidiously and when you notice that all your freedoms are gone, it is too late.
the other day, and a Muslim woman author was on the panel, going on about how life is better in Iraq for women now that Saddam is gone.
The whole show was disappointing, but steam almost came out of my ears on that one. Earlier in the show, they were going on about how Muslim theocracies are so bad for women, especially Saudi Arabia and so on…and then they talk about how life is better in Iraq for women now that Saddam is gone.
I didn’t love Saddam or anything, but my understanding is that Iraq was a fairly secular country, with women being able to choose to not wear the veil, to go to school, to have careers, etc.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but I have read that rapes and honor killings are on the rise, women can be harassed and attacked for not wearing a veil out of doors, schooling opportunities have been dramatically reduced (well, for boys too, you can’t attend a blown-up school), but you see what I’m getting at.
And life is better. That whole panel was grasping for any silver lining they could find from this war and parading it as a moral justification.
I used to love Bill Maher, too.
… ‘Muslim’ woman author? Life is better for Iraqi women how, exactly?
A while back I did a diary at dKos on a post by Riverbend in which I quoted her:
I went on to say: Before the invasion I remember being moved by an Iraqi description of what life would be like in post-invasion Iraq. They thought that America would succeed in making Iraq into a distorted image of the US and feared that their daughters would be out selling their bodies to alcohol-crazed creeps in sleazy nightclubs. Now they fear that the future of Iraq will resemble Iran two decades ago.
Do read Riverbend. I’m off to check up on her now.
was her name.
I think I remember that diary from dKos. That and similar diaries made me so mad when Ms. Manji started talking about how much greater it was in Iraq for women now. And so many people don’t know and will just swallow BS like that.
Here’s a link to the episode guide (sorry about the length…Booman and the href tags don’t work together well for me):
http://www.hbo.com/billmaher/episode/2005_03_11_ep47.html
Here’s a quote from Ms. Manji, from the episode guide:
On Women of Iraq
“Why is it that more stories aren’t being done about how grateful we are that Saddam Hussein is out of there… And you know why they’re grateful? This is what they tell me. For no other reason than when he’s gone, it means that the Iraqi people have to confront themselves… And that is when they can begin taking responsibility for their future.” – Irshad Manji
Gross…well, she lives in Canada, so she doesn’t know much about the situation on the ground. Then, of course, she shouldn’t speak on it. I’ll try to find her contact info later (I’m at work) and email her about Riverbend. Thanks!
Riverbend is a wonderful source for information of daily life in Iraq. She also writes very eloquently and puts things in great perspective. Have been reading her for a long time now and would also recommend everyone check in on her.
Her latest post on the two year anniversary of “Shock and Awe”TM is another must read:
I almost always get a lump in my throat when reading her.
The other one who can do that is Bilmon of the Whiskey Bar who’s blogging regularly again and is in top form.
I have an email pal in Iraq and have tried to get her to post on these blogs, but she refuses so far. For many reasons.
However I was thinking of doing a diary interview of her, just have not yet asked her.
Our communication is severely strained by our time zone differences; she is sleeping when I am awake, so we can only chat during morning or her evening. Not too bad for me, but for her she rarely has electicity, 2 hours a day in broken up lumps, and a very faulty phone line among a number of issues. Of late I have only had a few words from her in the last 14 days, due to phone problems.
I called her once and the phone bill was $125.00 for 30 minutes. Tried using skype phone (computer generated phone line)and that does work and its free for international calls, computer to computer, low price for calling rates as well, but that also depends on her computer and electrity and phone lines. BTW Skype phone is excellent for computer to computer calls.
Anway I found out from her yesterday she is finally getting a visa to go to Kuwait for a visit and will computer with me from there.
If anyone has any questions for her I would be glad to include them on my list.
I have also put some info from her or about her on my blog below if you are interested, in Jan or Feb. archives.
… you should post a diary just prior to gather our questions and another one afterwards with her responses.
I have something of the same problem with the time zones (only one hour difference with Baghdad!) so I will go take a look at your blog archives tomorrow.
Thank you, Diane.
I stopped watching after that show. HBO is getting cancelled now that Carnivale is over.
Next stop: Fundies picketing outside pharmacies that do prescribe RU-486, or picketing doctors who treat gay people.
But NARAL’s right: We need to convince CVS, RiteAid, Walgreen’s et al that we won’t patronize their stores if they allow this. Once that’s done, the little pharmacies will capitulate or go out of business.