THANKS ARMANDO!
First post successfully launched just before midnight 00:00 PDT.
Got to run … politics can’t wait much longer.
Kind regards,
Adrian
aka new creve coeur @dKos
The Hague Thursday May 18, 2005 09:00 AM Local Time
I have been in private email correspondence with Plutonium Page. She is a member here, which I didn’t realize. I have reset her password, because she forgot it. I have invited her to respond here. But I will convey her response here:
“I didn’t recommend his banning. At. All. Not. Once….He was banned because he had two usernames. End of story. AND I DID
NOT recommend his banning.”
I accept her word. Whether this diary should continue to exist in its present form depends on whether Oui accepts her word. If you believe her, you might consider whether this diary is fair to her.
[Sun. May 15th 00:30 AM PDT]
Have made proposal to DailyKos.
Will keep you informed.
Ban was possible within one hour!
After an exchange of emails with proposal to reinstate sig name creve coeur, and a long wait … more waiting, I once again placed a request tonight after two full days.
Conclusion: a longer wait and no decision. No other option than to register under another sig name — new creve coeur at dKos. Lose all mojo and build up of reputation. Recent diaries cannot be edited or updated, and search tool will not list all comments, etc., etc.
I had hoped for a humane blog solution, that was not possible due to lack of cooperation.
Start of diary …
A Ratzinger Inside dKOS ¶ My Dear KOS Community …
Slowly migrating from my membership at dKos – user ID 32011 since Nov. 3, 2004 – to Booman Tribune. I was a full fledged NewBie early October 2004, got first internet connection when starting to blog on the Kerry Campaign website. As JFK website closed down immediately after the election results, I felt lucky to find my new home at dKos.
The excellent diaries and comments were matched by an harmonious spirit and consolation of sorrow, but soon changed to a fighting spirit. First the activities started to check the irregularities across America in counting the ballots.
Late January inspired by SusanG, NYBri, Silence et al, I participated intensely in the PropaGannon investigation. Spend many, many hours and met new blog friends. Those weeks were amazing and again inspiring what power lies in a close knit community. As soon as JG was uncovered as JG and from mid February, I discovered that the dKos outer community had changed. Many factions had been formed and the inflammatory remarks had increased. Due to closeness to PropaGannon, I signed up at their new site under a new sig name: Oui. The intention was to regain some anonymity on the forum. A small group of close friends were aware of my ID, others observing the unchanged style of my writing could have guessed.
Some incidents occurred on dKos, that bothered me a lot. First there was a blog death threat.
It’s time to unfold …
blog death threat
You suck (1.50 / 14)
You posted a picture that had nothing to do with the subject at hand.
You are always inarticulate; you never make sense.
You are nasty; and for me to notice it, it must be bad.
Whenever I find out a comment is yours, I trash it in my mind.
You are representative of the hard-of-thinking riff-raff that showed up on dKos after the election.
Die, motherfucker!
We’re trying to deal with real, solvable problems!
.
by hamletta on Thu Mar 17th, 2005 at 03:47:05 EST
A single comment could happen to anyone. The surprise and disgust lies in the number of dKos members who support such a remark by adding 4‘s. I got plenty of conciliatory heads up, but yet something changed inside. It is a remark that is scary. I couldn’t grasp that this villain remark was addressed at me.
Community Guidelines PastorDan
by pastordan Mon Oct 4th, 2004
It’s considered rude to insult or swear at a conversation partner on the board, and it is never acceptable to threaten physical violence. (Kos if you’re reading this, making threats should probably be ground for automatic expulsion.)
In the following weeks, I started to notice the overall degeneration of comments, superficial remarks, not reading the substance of diaries nor commenting in line with diary content or author’s intent. I kept my focus on doing investigative research PropaG GOPWEB in line with the broader issues of the Bush | Cheney regime and GOP propaganda.
There were kossacks who were tired of PropaGannon, and became annoyed. One person in particular, PP thought it important to place nasty remarks on my diaries and to start derating legitimate comments which were not to her liking. What her motivation was, I wouldn’t know, she got her Frank from the Netherlands and his vision on what happens in the country differs from my observations. I tried to avoid PP whenever possible, as I consider it childish behaviour.
PP childish behaviour [PP judges and rates 4x a 2 Ouch!]
by SusanHu Fri Mar 18th, 2005
Frank, for chrissakes (none / 1)
Don’t you see?
THE EVIL DUTCH GOVERNMENT TOLD THE GUY TO GIVE SADDAM THE CHEMICALS!
Geez, Frank, get a fucking clue 😉
<sarcasm>
Which they didn’t. Which is the point.
Rumsfeld, however, did.
The US actively armed Iraq.
Not the Dutch.
[pic Rumsfeld – Saddam}
by Plutonium Page on Fri Mar 18th, 2005 at 17:02:07 EST
SEE OTHER NASTY ACTIONS BY PP IN MARCH »» APPENDIX BELOW
By chance I found Booman Tribune, through GrannyHelen, a remark she made after a troll rating she received at dKos. The rage of troll ratings at dKos was a ridiculous happening, someone again should negate a topic or comment and move on. I decided to use my sig name Oui at BT and fell in love with the people and a friendly website.
The PropaGannon diaries I kept at dKos for a while under my old sig name with TU status. I trust my mojo rating must be high and the average above 3.9, because although the mojo rating changed recently at dKos, I have retained my TU status to date.
Since early April it became clear I spend most of my time at BT and enjoyed it. I found a new home once again, with a much slower pace where diaries just won’t go away, instead of being lost at a rate of 25 per hour at dKos.
As BooMan has written, the community needs to grow to 3,000 users to gain a financial sound base. I try to be exclusive with first publication at BooTrib, and dependent on nature and topic of diary, would decide whether it fits to cross-post at dKos.
Till yesterday [Tues March 10], my last comment I wrote at dKos. I made a long comment on Open Thread, to provide content for the dKos reader and get others interested to follow up and read my diaries at BT. Not really to my surprise when I think back a bit, but I was lucky to be honoured with a comment from PP, I understand she is now a badged blog police with frontpage status.
Hey creve coeur (none / 1)
I feel sorry for the people on dial-up today.
Your comment will make this thread load even slower than usual.
Oh, and if you’re gonna have multiple user names, at least be subtle about it.
Not just another blog: The Next Hurrah
by Plutonium Page on Tue May 10th, 2005 at 05:20:37 EST
#
EDITED Sat May 14th, 2005 at 02:00 AM PDT
I understand you’ve had him banned. (none / 1)
Equally smart, more cosmopolitan, less crowded: join Booman Tribune!
by Sirocco on Fri May 13th, 2005 at 09:40:12 EST
I want to underline the issue at hand: it’s about blog procedure and grounds for banning. It’s nothing personal about myself or PP. I like PP, her skills and excellent contribution at dKos.
A magnificent site like dKos should not allow a single person, beyond kos himself, to be able to ban someone.
END
#
Punishment by Ex-Communication
As I was adding another comment to the new Open Thread, the comment feature was lost, I lost the comment I was editing, and when I checked my home user page, I noticed I could no longer place comments, enter a new diary or make recommendations in other diaries. Flabbergasted, upset, I tried to understand and realize what was happening. A bit later the same happened to my original sig name of creve coeur at dKos.
Apparently, someone at the moderator level of dKos, used his/her power to JUST PULL THE PLUG and SEVERE ALL MY TIES I HAVE WITH MY KOS COMMUNITY. No warning of any wrong doing, no explanation of any sanction or punishment to be levied, just cut through my communication line with the community. I cannot ask for an explanation, because I cannot make another comment at dKos.
I have gone over and over, to imagine what major rule or regulation I could have broken. I had checked the dKos FAQ’s content and PastorDan’s Community Guide, but I found no paragraph on maintaining one’s anonymity by a second sig name, coming over from another blog to write a comment or diary in an open source internet blog community.
I am really, really upset and angry, walking about during the night, adding some comments to spiderleaf’s excellent diary, and after two hours tried to get some sleep again. Can someone at BooTrib enlighten me, as I consider myself still a NewBie with just 6 months internet experience in a monogamous relation with a small community. Please advise, for I need HELP on how to break out of this predicament.
My hope is that someone from dKos puts up a comment here at BT: “Sorry Oui, our mistake – you are still welcome”.
PS — EX-COMMUNICATED! How can someone in his/her right mind just cut my ties I have with a great community I correspond with? This is the worst kind of Ratzinger courts, at least Ratzinger communicated the sentence in a lengthy dogma. What are the rules? Why not communicate on a blog as a liberal would expect!
DELETED per Sun. May 15th, 00:30 AM PST
Has been sufficiently noted and read, became superfluous in time.
MY NEW HOME …
Fri Mar 25th, 2005 at 09:36:41 PM PDT
An easy header … (4.00 / 3)
So I figured to put 1 and 1 together in a single diary.
Not for enjoyment, just sadness.
PS GREAT JOB Booman & congratulations
by Oui on Fri Mar 25th, 2005 at 09:49:33 PM PDT
Wow – precious You gave me ID #452 (4.00 / 2)
Now I get to teach the young whippersnappers a lesson from, ID # 20,000 on!
I was led here of course through dKos – but what are your preferences on topics for diaries.
I already see here my favorite writers – and diaries staying up longer than 15 min.! I’m falling in love all over again.
by Oui on Sat Mar 26th, 2005 at 01:00:09 AM PDT
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
.
Is what makes America a Great Nation.
It would be nice when an open source advocated blog community like dKOS would honour the same.
A favorite statement I borrow from my son: “I rest my case”.
PS There is no other choice than more members at dKos also take on membership at BooMan Tribune asap, to be able to read my diary contributions and add comments. Thanks.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
Keep on truckin’… 😉
.
I promise my contribution at BooTrib won’t suffer.
But, I’ll probably need to engrave BooTrib on my PC!
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
I am glad you are here. I had mistakenly thought the Kos community liberal and/or progressive but it looks like it really isn’t if they have to purge people because they don’t agree with them.
I always thought it civil to agree to disagree and work with what you have in common.
I meant – I am glad that you (Oui) are here (not Daily Kos).
Agreed, I thought the proper thing to do (if you don’t agree with a posting) is to post your own well-crafted comment or diary. Apparently censure is available as an unfortunate alternative. I came to dkos in the deluge after the election but now come here daily. I look forward to more of your diaries.
I’ve been involved in on-line communities for close to 30 years — starting with BBS’s. Eventually, every one of them turns to shit. The people who moderate forums either start out as assholes or rise to that standard as their self-appreciation expands beyond the bounds of their significance. dKos has not been exempted from this process despite its egalitarian structure. It takes a certain kind of aggressive personality to rise thru the ranks there and achieve front-page status. Once that level is attained, these ego-driven types begin to impose their opinions on the content of the forum.
In recent years, I have belonged to a number of political forums and abandoned them when their moderators turned into content police. I’ve stayed with dKos longer than any other mainly because the sheer volume of participation hides this inherent flaw. Even PP and Armando together can’t police ALL that content — there just aren’t enough hours in the day to do that. LOL!
I’m sorry that you are upset about this turn of events and I want you to understand that you shouldn’t take it so personally. I suppose you should feel special — out of teeming herds of commentors, PP focused on you to exert her new position of power. It was bad-mouthing the Dutch what done you in… 😉
.
is what is left when your opponent has the power to switch off the lights and secretly leaves the ring.
I agree and appreciate your analysis and wisdom, and thanks for sharing. The disappointment lies in not being able to depart and say good-bye to a group of readers at dKos, where you have shared joy and tears. Hours, days and weeks spend together in daily communication, with some excellent diaries, projects and comments. TU status is of no importance, as it’s a responsibility and not a privilege.
I’ll never adapt my writing to please some individual, as you so splendidly illustrated by flaws in human nature.
I have emailed this diary to kos, but from his user page, he himself states due to the mass of emails, no guarantee it will be read. So, forward with a new challenge … BT!
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
Dear Oui,
I had no idea you were Creve Cour, though as you say the writing style should have clued me in…
I am sorry about your experiences at dKos. I do remember 0’ing the hateful drivel by Hamletta, who generally (and when I use such words, things are serious) behave like a rude and mean-minded bitch. The remark above is just an especially foul expression of her normal MO.
PP is different – I personally like her a lot both as a writer and an individual, although her zeal as Diary Police can be a tad over the top at times [triple alliteration! ;-)] In your case I suspect she has been standing up for her new country of residence without realizing that you yourself is Dutch and thus are an excellent position to criticize that country. Do you suppose that could be, or have you told her that you are Dutch? (I remember wondering about Creve Coeur’s nationality myself, since he didn’t seem to be a native anglophone.) It is hard to imagine that PP would begrudge people the right to be critical of their own countries, since that is about 95% of what goes on at dKos in any case, her own activities included.
Clearly though, she has used her Moderator privileges to recommend that Kos ban you from the site, and he has done so. The legal pretext is almost certainly the use of dual handles (‘Oui’ and ‘Creve Coeur’ in this case).
A rule making this grounds for banning does indeed exist, or did until recently. However, a cursory inspection of the FAQ and community guidelines failed to turn it up. I also know for a fact – since she’s admitted this – that PP herself has a second user name on dKos, though it may now be inactive. So it is a little hypocritical for her to councel banning for that transgression. I’m disappointed.
If you want to post on dKos, I don’t think there is any problem signing up again under a different user name. Then anonymity is preserved again (unless, of course, syntax gives the game away! ;-)) And if they’ve banned your IP – which I doubt – it’s an easy to piece to get a new one.
Anyhow, a toast to BT, where this sort of small-mindedness has yet to take hold!
that you yourself is Dutch
Yikes! I bow my head in shame…
Why? Is you Dutch too?
No, I is Norwegian, but I is always too lazy to proof-read.
and kant spel or pruff wurth shite.
is from Missouri but living in the Hague. Not that it makes any difference to your point.
.
and PP knew me well enough, she was aware of these facts.
I’ve always admired PP for her skills and excellent diaries I enjoyed reading. A single flaw/weakness is easily forgiven, perhaps a bit too possessive: do not touch my frank. If you look at exchange in diary on Dutch Justice, I was answering a question put forward by frank. Frank showed appreciation I answered with diary, although disagreeing with my viewpoint.
It was PP who became annoyed, IMHO I had a bit more factual knowledge than she could muster. We all have our peculiarities and special interests, I tried to keep away from her, the community is large enough to write in my small niche of readers. Sad it ended this way.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
Personally, Oui’s contributions here and at Kos override any mistake, especially since it was not meant to take advantage. Seems like an over-reaction at Kos to me.
BTW, thanks again for this great blog!
nope. She’s still posting… saw one of her posts couple of days ago in fact.
.
See comment by Sirocco
Speaking of Hamletta, by the way and his link!
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
Yeah, that was another example of her over-the-top and insulting comments… unfortunately I think it takes like 80 “0” ratings to actually get banned vs. just losing your TU status… she’ll be around for quite a while yet me thinks.
.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
yup. and I just clicked on the “Growing up Red” link and saw someone actually defending her comments because “she can be a bit grumpy”. Screw that. You don’t say someone sucks, is a tool, is paranoid, isn’t a “real” author and desperately wants to be famous but isn’t willing to put in the work and get a “2” rating for it because someone has seen her around.
I am fighting mad about this bullshit right now and I’m jumping into the fray.
Off I go…
.
was she still hanging around, or did she slump at the end of the bar?
Thanks!
There can be friendly drinking, don’t need drunk as excuse when you are a jerk.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
.
Don’t agree with your statement going after!
PP has to be shown the consequences by cutting someone off the community blog, my group of readers I build a relationship with.
No strategy in mind, except no hard confrontation with PP, as it’s more a matter of policy and how the rules are applied with no favors to anyone. Only fact against my case is my user ID 32011, way up and too high, just an apprentice with no rights?
I tried to stay factual, as I needed an explanation myself, so I clearly had all encounters in memory. As has been noted by a number of Tribers, no mal intent. Necessity to migrate away from dKos anyway, however I clearly prefer my own timing. If anyone would have stated in a FAQ this would be a no-no, or given a liberal warning, there would have been no problem at all.
It’s an offence that could not be proved anyway, by IP address alone. Often you hope that more members in a single family, blog as individuals. There must also be twins out there that blog?
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
I understand your point. But look at the title of this diary. Calling her ‘Ratzinger’ is what I meant by ‘going after’.
And you have every right to defend yourself any way you see fit. I only mean to point out that the title is probably not going to encourage clemency.
It’s a neutral observation.
Supremacy of Rome and successor of Peter.
I do not know if PP pulled the switch, only she exposed herself as nemesis, and was the person to answer my last comment. Within the hour I was cut off.
Read my last paragraph … his/her right mind. So I made no accusation PP is the Ratzinger, just to be clear.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
where’s the context? why did you not include most of the comments to which these people were responding to?
The diary really isn’t about BooTrib; it’s you basically telling everyone that you got crapped on at dKos, and here are some comments you found offensive. (With BooTrib thrown in as the obligatory happy ending.)
oui, I never even remotely had a problem with you at dKos, and am quite surprised to find out you were involved in such an online brouhaha. But if you’re trying to explain your side, it looks less than forthcoming to only post people’s responses to you. What did you say to set them off? Did these people post less bostile comments at first, then get progressively more hostile as the argument progressed?
It’s not really fair to only post your side and expect us to believe it 100%. I certainly feel for you if you got railroaded out of dKos. But at least be confident enough in the wrongfulness of their behavior to include more of the history, context, and other comments–yours and theirs–if you expect us to take your side.
Anyway, I’m glad you’re happy here…it’s a great place to hang out, like the cool jazz club across the street from the TGI Friday’s that is dKos.
.
Check any or all out, there is nothing hidden, nor any previous harassment. Read how the other diary readers react to her comments. Like I stated, I liked PP for her skills and writing. I have done my best to just avoid her, she began to stalk and show up just to annoy.
See comment ratings PP childish behaviour, in diary by SusanHu about Dutch businessman selling chemicals to Saddam. To meet frank’s challenge I wrote diary on Dutch Justice, where frank accepted my response, but PP goes over the top. You explain it to me.
I seek no revenge, am just astonished and saddened by the affair. Still not clear of any written rules I violated to get banned.
In all my diaries I publish, the readers get all leeway in response, that’s is the responsibility of author. I always try to get persons together where possible, see diary on chess player Bobby Fisher and comment by vcmvo2. I hold no grudge, a waste of energy.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
I went back and actually read through every link you posted And I think this diary is simply not very productive–rather, it’s little more than a personal vendetta against Page, and I don’t think it deserves nearly as many 4s as it’s received.
Let me try to touch on some of these comments you’ve posted. Eugene’s “this diary is stupid” post has a rating of 1.66; Tbob gave it a 0. Page gave it a 4. So it’s not like anyone other than Page was cheering Eugene on. And that eric guy’s troll-rating was also an isolated incident.
So is dKos somehow against you because one or two people gave bad ratings or made a nasty comment? Why do you COMPLETELY ignore all the positive things people wrote about your diaries and comments? Or the productive discussions you had with people on those subjects? Or the times when they stuck up for you?
And are you d52boy? One of your links is to d52boy’s diary…if you are d52boy, why didn’t you disclose this? Wouldn’t that be THREE aliases on dKos? (Maybe I’m just misunderstanding.)
As for the comment Page made about you posting an extremely long comment in the open thread, she was right. You posted an ENORMOUS diary, with something like 10 pictures and graphics in it. It’s okay to post a link to your diary in an open thread, but to post the whole thing?? But again, people stuck up for you after Page made her comment.
I could go on and on with this. The point is, you’ve taken some isolated comments–mostly from just one person–and made it the focus of a diary. Diaries aren’t for airing your personal grievances with other members. I sympathize if you really were banned, or if Page had it out for you. (Of course, I’m sure she would have a very different take on this whole situation.)
But I do NOT think you should be showered with 4’s for posting a diary that borders on the self-indulgent and exists mostly to complain about Page.
.
Thanks for having a closer look.
I operate within the large dKos community of 65,000 registered members, in a tiny group of readers and favorite topics. Since the end of Januari nearly full time at dKos on the investigative issue related with JG|JG, PropaGannon and the PropaG GOPWEB version I continued as creve coeur. I also operated within a group that exchanged emails on the leads doing this research.
I had a pleasant group within dKos I communicated with daily. This came to an abrupt end, for a reason not communicated to me, nor where I was given the opportunity to explain or give my arguments in response.
On May 10th, I was banned within the hour after PP made her reply.
In this diary I explained how a second user sig name Oui came about at the new PropaGannon site. I have tried to illustrate how any jerk can and have frustrated the start of a diary where they do not contribute to the subject at hand.
No, I am not d52boy. The link is to his comment at the start of my diary on Dutch Justice, which I wrote after frank posed the challenge a day or two earlier. It is PP who pounced on d52boy and caught him totally off guard, see his reply.
It’s no crusade against PP, nor a personal vendetta, as many readers here at BooTrib illustrate, they have similar experiences in the general sense at dKos and other blogs. PP happens to be a lone person at dKos who stalked me, derated readers of my diaries and apparently initiated a process to have me banned on May 10th. No hard feelings toward PP, she is a skillful contributor with diaries at dKos. A site like dKos should not allow a single person, beyond kos himself, to be able to ban someone.
In one of my comments on this thread, I try to focus on topic, as it’s about rules of engagement on the blog and how and when does someone get banned. BooMan added a great contribution, by summing up his points the way he looks at the ban procedure. I also mentioned, there are more substantial issues at hand with a link to ghostdancers way.
An outstanding comment was made today by sjct , which really sums it up for me. Beyond that, it’s no small feat to be banned from a group of blog friends, you communicate with on a daily basis for so long.
Pax.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
Depite months of discussion about ratings and community standards, little has been done at dKos to actually clarify the community standards and to upgrade them beyond a diary pastordan once wrote, or to prominently display them or to enforce them with an even hand. There is no orientation for newbies, and so much more. Changing the number system for ratings is a technical fix that does not solve the social problems.
I agree – PP – great diarist, lousy thought policeperson. I really struggle to understand why people there think the diaries need to be policed so much. If you don’t like it, move on. It’s like not feeding the trolls, but in this case the diary police become the trolls.
I rest my case…
.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
.
Thanks and I love your sig line Sirocco!
Disappointing.
Equally smart, more cosmopolitan, less crowded: join Booman Tribune!
by Sirocco on Fri May 13th, 2005 at 09:40:12 EST
I added your dKos comment to diary content – appreciated!
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
and I was shocked to see that PP comment after your
careful and well-constructed comment about the Bush
visit to the Netherlands. I rated your comment excellent.
There’s nastiness everywhere.
I wonder sometimes whether some people are more interested
in their writing status than the subject they write about.
You always show a passionate interest in your content.
Keep on keeping on.
I’m really sorry that you were subjected to that. And I’m really happy to see your work here!
I’ve noticed that just about any online forum can become toxic, although I have great hope for this one. And I’m not talking about only high debate political forums, I’ve seen mad flame wars,shunning and splits occur over music, over anime and so on! Maybe it’s a power thing, I’m not really sure but it doesn’t seem to be catching on here!
I would like to post a comment asking why you were
banned.
Would that be okay with you, Oui?
.
and thought about many options, but decided to publish diary here at BooTrib, my new home. Many readers and writers at BooTrib are also joined by dKos, but it should not become a personal affair. Asking questions about the rules and regulations would be welcome, as some are more equal than others. [Animal Farm]
I just posted a comment upthread to sjct, where I mentioned that I personally send the full content of diary to kos. It may be a suggestion, but I shall add an Email to Armando as well. Anyone so inclined to follow?
Thank you all for your thoughts and support, nothing more I could ask for.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
Now what about the Dutch contribution of patriot missiles to Iraq. Do you want to debate that?
just kidding!
It’s a rehearsal for a diary on DKos. 😉
asking him to review this diary. Ex-Communication seems like an extreme response to me … using a sledgehammer to swat a gnat (not that you’re comparable to a gnat!).
Hope you have a beautiful day in The Hague!
Sorry for your troubles Oui. I don’t know enough about PP to comment, but I remember Hamletta’s comments.
I enjoyed your writing as Creve Coeur, and can never read enough about Guckert, and the RW noise machine.
There was a bit of nastiness on a diary that blogged the Bolton hearings yesterday.
Seems that there is a “diary police” eager to hand out troll ratings for infractions of unwritten rules.
Geesh! A diary of venting, rants, and snark and someone has the nerve to say that a comment wasn’t pushing the diary forward. Real sin – someone posted a comment common to Atrios’ crew.
I’d just like to make a comment that is not specific to this diary.
Daily Kos was my main online home and introduction to blogging, and the inspiration for this site.
I never was a Deaniac, and I never agreed with the majority of Kossacks during the primaries. But I felt welcome there.
There are some faults with the site, and it is undergoing some growing pains, and that is why a lot of people have moved over here. And everyone should feel totally free to discuss this.
But I am reluctant to criticize the site myself. It doesn’t mean I don’t have my own opinions about the site, some of the front-pagers, or the new addition of 10,000 seeming 18 year-olds. I do.
I welcome other people’s critiques of dKos because it is instructive to me in learning how to make this a better site. And my failure to engage in these conversations is really only an indication of my respect for Markos.
Also, I consider Armando a kind of online pal. I understand his style is not for everyone. But I like him. I like to bug him in the wee hours when everyone else has gone to sleep.
In any case, feel free to say whatever you want. I’ll read as much as I can.
new addition of 10,000 seeming 18 year-olds
Mmmm. I see that I’m not the only one who has had that thought.
Maybe it has something to do with the Princeton demonstration. I’m trying to take it as an opportunity to learn something about how they’re thinking. At that age, I was an activist, and I wouldn’t have missed it for anything. I’m sure I was also a flip little know-it-all to some, too!
This can be a good thing for progressives, I think, if we can cross the generational lines in supportive ways. There seems to be a lot of that going on, too.
</rose-colored lenses>
You wouldn’t happen to have a problem with those of us who are 18, now would you? 🙂
of course not. Just remember, when you are a senior you get to make snide remarks about the freshmen. But we all get to be seniors one day. Hopefully.
Ugh. High school memories coming back. Freshman year < good.
But you’re right. When this site gets 6,000 members, I can command respect by flashing my UID. But for now, I am relegated to relative n00bie status.
I know you were mostly joking, but the UID thing has driven me nuts over at Kos for a while. I hate the notion that people might just take a quick look at the number affiliated with a comment before they decide whether to troll it or just disagree with it in a funcational way. Additionally, it seems like a low UID is an open invitation for, um, ball-washing of the longer tenured members of the community. Certain folks could post a picture of their fecal matter and grab 30 4’s from teh peanut gallery. I would hate to think that would happen here…
Would it really be so bad if the UID’s were hidden? Personally, I think it might make everyone think a bit harder about posts based on merit rather than the account it came from. It’s pretty easy to tell who has been around and who is an active, quality poster without it…
Of course, if I am ever going to be the resident smartass over here, well, this plan is going to blow up right in may face… doh.
The UID thing is ridiculous to me. I’m UID 37235 at DKos, which means my posts are given less respect than the 37,234 people before me. When a long standing user posts something that would have sent me to the Hidden Comments section, people give them fours because they are “not a troll”.
For example, I’m not sure if you were on DKos this morning, but there was a huge fight about a diary Welshman posted. Stirling Newberry was handing out zeros to all of Welshman’s posts, simply because SN strongly disagreed with Welshman’s main point, and began to take all disagreements with him personally. If I had been handing out zeros like that, I would have been banned in mere minutes.
It really is ridiculous.
As UID 37180, I can hardly take this post seriously. Come back when you’ve been here a while sonny.
Yur meen. I’m telling my mommy that you won’t let me play with the big kids.
Hmmph. [stomps away with arms folded]
I am a moderator at New European Times, which is the site run by Welshman. So I may have displayed some sort of bias in the post right above. So let me choose a better example.
Ah. Jiacinto. UID 7829. A good number of his posts involve bashing liberals for something like “destroying the Democratic Party”. Every Chuck Pennacchio thread that shows up, he is there to call Pennacchio a virtual loser in the Pennsylvania Senate race. And he doesn’t do so in a respectful way; he ridicules those who disagree with him. But whenever someone gives him a troll rating, someone else gives a four to prevent the comment from being hidden, just so “others can hear his views”.
Again, if someone like me had decided to post Republican talking points, I would have been banned faster than a greased sled can slide down an icy hill.
somehow. IIRC he had them from the outset. I learned early on he’s not someone you want to cross. There were always cohorts waiting to punish anyone who objected to him.
I don’t think I’ve ever agreed with anything he’s posted, but I will say this: he has on occasion kept the Kool-Aid from getting coagulatingly sweet.
True, he has made friends. I won’t deny that. And his more conservative views have kept us grounded in reality. But it’s not the fact that I disagree with his posts, it’s that fact that when he posts them, he insults anyone who disagrees with him.
I believe DavidNYC warned him to lay off the rudeness, otherwise he could be banned.
You wouldn’t happen to have a problem with those of us who are 18, now would you?
For me, it’s probably a creeping, but steady case of incipient geezer-itis.
God knows, I was self-righteous and obnoxious when I was 18, and for a good while longer. OK, decades longer. But now only on Fridays and Saturdays!
LOL. So this would be one of your obnoxious days?
.
It’s your position to learn from errors made and we appreciate you for the full 100%. It’s not an easy task for Markos, yourself and your closest partners, you are the rock this site was build on.
When we meet face to face, enjoying a beer, you can ease and converse in words that should never be in writing. I therefore appreciate your specific comment made upthread. You cannot always join in the diary talk.
I do hope this matter can be resolved with kos, I will certainly plead for a full unrecommend of diary as soon as that passes! The appreciation has already been shown in comments and mojos. As a community we face issues of greater importance, see diary by ghostdancers way.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
18-year-olds …
is that where all those diaries yesterday demanding the head of Voinovich have come from? I was, like, stunned.
(P.S. Aside: There’s nothing we could do to V. that the GOP hasn’t already done to him. ‘sides, he gave a truly great speech flawed only by a rotten punch line. But, if he’d said otherwise, he would have had to be suicidal, given the climate in the GOP these days.)
I like Armando too. I miss his old signature — I’m thinkin’, I’m thinkin’
I can’t tell you why but it always made me giggle.
Would probably not hurt at all, I usually find that the greatest damage to “progressive” causes comes from idiots of every age and description.
I devote an inordinate amount of (free) time to community and activist groups and find that wherever I go I find members of the idiot left hijacking and destroying otherwise worthwhile endeavors.
For example, a criminal justice reform group that I was heavily involved in via mucho fund raising and all of the paperwork had just a few of these types (subspecies Mumidiot Trotskyensis) who kept insisting on devoting organizational resources and time to support hard left causes that had nothing to do with the organization’s mission.
When I resisted this, I became the subject of mucho hate. That I could deal with, but what eventually drove me out was the inability of the rest of the folks in the organization to do anything other than affect a studied neutrality towards my dispute with our resident wingnuts.
Eventually, when one of the wingnuts kept screaming point of order (BTW he was way out of order) to prevent me from presenting an austerity budget (caused by a loss of funding resulting from the inability of our wingnuts to be civil to guests) at a board meeting, I basically put my foot down and said the group could choose between me and the nutjob.
The response was typical wishy washy feel good left- as I had forced the crisis, I was the one who had to go. Not two months later the organization was defunct, which was a damn shame because it had been doing a lot of good.
Was my nemesis an 18 year old? Nope, in fact all the 18 year olds that I worked with were open minded and able to play well with others. The self righteous idiot who purified the organization out of existance was a 50 something university professor.
Epilogue: About three months after my resignation was accepted, several of the group’s funders made inquiries as to why the group had fallen apart. When told that it was because they had accepted my resignation rather than shut up an idiot who contributed nothing to the group, the funders jaws hit the floor and told the remaining folks that if they could get me back there would be some money available to restart program services.
I was invited back on the condition that I make nice and apologize to my good friend the 50 something professor. It really did break my heart to say no, but I’d learned for myself what the Democratic party and much of the progressive community needs to learn- idealogues are dangerous and should not be tolerated.
</rant>
I guess I needed to vent about that one.
what you have described is played out repeatedly in political and community groups across the world. Some people get on and do creative, useful stuff, some people only ever criticise and tear things down (Trots), and the majority are passengers on the great busride of life…
but not when it is misdirected, like hitting on Oui.
BooMan, do you have hidden comments and trusted user status like dkos has? I quickly searched the faq and didn’t find anything.
If so, would you consider to make hidden comments viewable to all? While I understand the need for hidding comments, I also feel strongly that they should be viewable by everyone, regardless of trusted user status.
I can elaborate on that point if you’d like but I’m just to tired right now. It’ll have to wait till tomorrow.
.
So they do exist here, but only one other hidden comment at present I could offer. Works on same principle as by dKos.
I’m serious, you’ll be the first to do it if you can. I might even put it in the FAQ.
by BooMan on Tue Mar 22nd, 2005 at 09:02:19 PM PDT
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
Mega Troll rate someone on the Booman Tribune. Yes..That was Me…Chamonix1…Can you believe Booman was begging me to troll rate him into the dark world…I was the first to speak up, I had trusted status, the stars lined up and I agreed to do it and I blasted his ass. It was quite liberating. So I guess I am part of history here. Although I am still waiting to make it to the FAQ. Although Boo did say might. Looking back on it makes me smile…he wasn’t even sure if it would work….it did. It is cool to be the first…not Frist..but first.
.
Should be part of integration into the BooTrib community, as soon as TU status is gained.
Bet you when BooMan has been trolled #866 times, he’ll change the invitation!
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
It still works, I just troll rated BooMan – I’m #19.
You’re right, it does feel good.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
I was linked over to this diary through a comment by Oui, and felt compelled to give you some props. Likelihood of you seeing the props – probably next to nil – but when I feel compelled to share my comments, there’s no stopping me. Kinda like Paul Wellstone, standing alone, speaking on the Senate floor. (Well, at least the part about being alone) Having said that. . .
One of the very cool things about this site is that you – the frenetically busy site proprietor – participate in the diaries and you don’t limit yourself to a throne on the front page, as many other hosts do. That alone adds so much to the feeling of community. (You’re more of an approachable, respected mayor – rather than king.) Your hands-on participation projects the feeling that you genuinely respect the members, and that you don’t view us merely as numbers in your efforts to reach advertising profit margins.
If you’ve made it this far – thanks again for creating this site. Where is our surprise?
You know, Anomalus.
I think I just figured it out.
If I’m right – hints can be drawn from the sitemeter – at least, some times.
I’m sorry ask, but I have to expose my ignorance (which definitely isn’t a first, nor will it be the last) I really don’t know what you’re referring to. Really. Hints of what? I’m an unknown entity in the blog world, being attracted to this community because of the warmth and intelligent discourse. I’m also technologically challenged, so when you refer to the “site meter”, I can only assume that you chose to track something about my activity for a reason unknown to me.
If it’s of any help in your quest for knowledge – whatever that quest may be – I frequently slip over to this site during a break in my work day – and many times have to bolt from my computer for hours on end to take client calls and resolve business issues at hand – leaving myself wherever I had last been on BT -and sometimes not even realizing I was at a specific location on the site for those hours on end until I sign off to go to bed or revisit the site to continue reading/commenting.
Please offer me the courtesy of explaining your comment in a less than cryptic way. (While this may seem like some type of funny, minor issue to you, I’ve been the victim of stalking, more than once, and comments such as yours really put me on edge. Considering my complete lack of understanding from which you speak – I have to admit that your remark – no matter how innocuous – is upsetting to me at the moment) Particularly since you chose to “out” something about me which I truly don’t understand.
Anomalus,
I am truly sorry if I have upset you. I’m not sure what it was in my remark that you found objectionable – though I realize that it may have been cryptic.
My comment was in response to your question about the surprise. I’ve been wondering myself.
At the sitemeter (bottom of the page), I had noticed a page-URL that was ‘unusual’. I clicked on it, but was denied access. However, a site name came up – and therein lies Booman’s surprise – I believe.
Oh my – that was certainly a gross misunderstanding on my part to the most innocuous comments on your part. I didn’t understand the point of reference in your comment, and I regret that. I completely misconstrued your commentary (just in case you hadn’t picked up on that 🙂 My reaction may have been enhanced by another poster who recently called me out by saying he realised who I was based on comments I had made.
Obviously I continue to be on edge, still suffering from PTSD after certain life experiences, and I regret the complete overreaction on my part. And my oh my – what an overreaction it was. (sheepishly tip toes away for a time out)
Peace
No worry.
Feeling stalked must be extremely uncomfortable.
I hope Booman’s surprise is still reasonably intact (the page is not there at the moment) – I think we’re all looking forward to an announcement very soon!
Be well.
Well. . .you probably blew the cover off the surprise, and Martin’s going to punish us all for your investigative curiosity.
Good night (and again – mea culpa)
And again, on my part, all I can think is “Good Lord”. (And my initial reaction to you occurred after reading your comment no less than three times)
Back to my time out. A very long one is in order, I do believe.
I have yet to write a diary at either place. I too found dkos just before elections, etc. My first week I was troll rated because I called a TU of some prominence an asshole. I got the picture right away. So I curbed my critic of people and kept to diary subject. Since I have been a trusted user and I believe somewaht respected(ratings wise)for my comments.
I have found that there is a whole new breed over there and that I particularly am put off by the self appointed diary/spelling/grammer police. One in particular of late(not PP)has policed almost every diary they comment on. Another user commented on this and my comment was Yeah and its always the same user. For that, the diary policeperson troll rated me. Then after I made a later comment in the thread on subject of diary, same dp commented”I already said that upthread, why didn’t you comment on that part of the thread”. jeez. I spend most of my blog time here now. It is just way too crowded at dkos anymore and man the vibe is pretty hostile alot of the time now.
Oui I love your writing and walways look for your diaries. Just on plugging kiddo. I think you have found your new home here. Sorry that happened to you. My personal take is ONLY Kos should be able to ban anyone and should at least warn before doing so. Something to keep in mind when you have 40,000 Booman!!lol
Just to put Oui’s banning in perspective, I’ll share a secret about myself: I’m an avid freeper. Currently I’ve posted 333 comments on Freak Republic. And despite having often been called rude and accused of trolling, I have yet to be booted off.
– was just banned for daring to speak the truth about that sorry site… 😉
Well crap! Now I have to go and douse myself with bleach and stand in the shower for an hour. That was just not right! It was far right. First time over there…euuuuwwwwww!
.
You amaze me for the remarks and humor. I have to take a break, to stop shaking from laughs.
Greatly appreciated – a lot of warmth in the community.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
My pleasure babe. I highly recommend a good dose of humour when stressed out. takes the edge of for a sec anyway. have a great weekend.
Nice work!
I think that is great that you do that Sirocco. I would do the same but my stomach cannot take it. I have some relatives that are way out there on the far right and it just brings back bad memories. I do take a peep once in a while when I do Propagannon research but I have never posted a comment.
I admit it does gross me out now and then, and I have to take a break. The athmosphere is extremely irrational and bigoted; Democrats are commonly referred to as ‘rats’ or dehumanized in other ways. Racism abounds and there is widespread paranoia about the supposed Islamic World Conspiracy to which ‘Euro-peons’ have long since yielded. Of course, there is wanton disregard for facts. One recent thread had as a lead article an AP story about the Iraqi oil smuggling that started five years before the OFF programme, was tolerated by the US and Britain, and had nothing whatsoever to do with the UN; the freepers made hundreds of comments disparaging the ‘corrupt UN’ for this, virtually parading past the realities and flipping them the finger. Calls for, say, nuclear genocide against the Palestinians, or phantasies about the murder of elected US officials, are generally condoned and often cheered.
And these are their good points.
There’s a new police force after people who correct
their own spelling mistakes with another post.
I must be on their black list.
Well I am a newcomer to blogging, as BoomanTribune is my first home in the community. I like the writers and diarist. They provide meaningful information and thought provoking analysis to issues that for the most part, have importance to me. I am sorry that oui was excommunicated from dKos, I still read there and had at one time thought of joining, but I think I have reconsidered that option. I will continue to enjoy the respect and evenhandedness that I see and experience here at Booman. I live in Kansas, and work in Topeka, I have to experience something almost everyday when I come to work, it is that hatemonger Fred Phelps. If you don’t know Fred, you can learn so much more about him by Googling his name. I refuse to link his hate filled websites. Anyway, my point is that I despise the message that dear old Fred espouses, yet would defend to the death his right to espouse it, so I too can espouse my beliefs. I will fight with every breath I have to defeat that type of hatemongering, but will never ever support that his right to free speech shall ever be taken from him. My country is under attack from religious zealots, corporate media that are hacks to the current administration and apathy from 40+% of the voting population that deemed it unnecessary to participate in our republican form of government. Our democratic republic will not survive this onslaught of zealous denunciation of our courts, the overtaking of our legislatures and the wholesale sacking of our federal employees, for administration lackey’s. Oui, keep right on being outraged, keep pinning the tail on the donkey no matter how many times you miss. Without people who will voice their concerns, no matter what the consequences, freedom will fail and our voices will be silenced forever. I hope and pray that this community and I hear Booman that he is watching and learning from other sites, will be a shining star of reasonable and cognitive discussion on topics that affect all of us living on this planet. Thank you all for allowing me to be a part of your lives today.
progressive liberals?
I think, without knowing all the facts, but having had good experiences myself with creve coeur, that may there is plenty of fault to go around.
One thing though, multiple IDs is a bannable offense and it has been stated as such many times.
My own feeling is this – oui (?) should reregister under a different name, but feel free to say who they are. State clearly that this will be there ONE and only identity at dailykos. I assure you no one will be kicked out if that happens.
The more difficult route would be going through a petition through markos.
As you know, I am a very difficult person so it ill behooves me to criticize folks for being difficult. That goes for creve coeur and PP.
Feel free to post this if you like.
Armando
P.S. I understand the lash out at dailykos given the experience, but I would hope if oui comes back, they can put that aside.
I accidentally stripped away the paragraphing. That’s not Armando’s!
Some readers may not know the full reference.
“There’s a little bit of good in the worst of us
and a little bit of bad in the best of us,
So it ill behooves any of us to
to find fault with the rest of us.”
That quote goes back many generations in my family.
Thank you Armando! As always a class act, er, asshole.
😉
They might ban the ISP ID number.
Unfortunately I see a lot of people on the left feel their opinions are absolute, especially in the PC crowd. I try to be sensitive to others, but I still try to get my point across – and if you give me a good argument then I might learn something. Then you get people who feel the only direction for the left to go lies in their opinions – they do not want discussion – they want to turn as many people to their line of thinking (this works by cutting others out of a discussion – maybe like in your case). This is unfortunate, because once your opinions become absolute, you are closing yourself off to the experience of learning and growing – you stagnate, and you can prevent others from getting another point of view. I would say that is abuse of power – it’s unfortunate that over at KOS they feel they have so much of it that they can cut people off. Of course I’m going by your side of the story, but from what I know of you you are not one to be rude.
like
torture is never acceptable.
If you take torture for instance, that can have many different meanings to different people. There was this picture yesterday posted by Newsie – I think, that showed ducks lined up hanging by their feet being processed on along a conveyor belt. They were alive and the ones on the ground were just standing around ready to be hung up beside the others. This photo made me sick – I wonder what the ducks must have been feeling. This to me is also torture – however I realize most people don’t feel that way.
As for torture in the human realm, there are laws that should supposedly protect people from that. Clearly they don’t work to well. However I know plenty of people that wouldn’t consider playing loud music all day and all night torture. I do. The Clinton administration didn’t. Capital punishment is torture – to me. There are enough on the left that don’t feel that way.
There are varying degrees of torture – what is torture? Something defined differently by different people, which need to be discussed.
I was horrified too, Hanni. The way animals are treated in China is unbelievable … dogs and cats skinned alive. I’ll stop there.
China is unbelievable, but I just can’t shake those ducks – can’t they put them to sleep first, or something?
Which definition do you want? Alberto Gonzales has worked
on a few definitions like causing damage to vital organs,
bringing a person near death etc. You don’t want to go there.
I once wrote to an editor of a major newspaper because
there was photo of dozens of ducks hanging upside down
from a bicycle on the way to market with a joking capiton underneath. He wrote back an apology.
I’m not really arguing with you. To me not killing civilians is an absolute too, but not in a discussion – I’ll leave that to the law, which in theory is absolute.
You will never win an argument if you don’t engage in discussion – with whomever. You can’t cut people off especially if they are leaning towards your side.
I thought I was having a conversation not an arguement.
touché
… but we could get into the fine lines between conversation, discussion and argument…
I remember being sickened at dKos when Abu Ghraib emerged and one front-page diarist actually defended torture. Torture is such a hot button for me that I would probably have zero’ed the comment if it had been in a regular thread, but I ended up being glad that I couldn’t. That’s because there were dozens of penetrating comments in response to this diary that ended up deepening my understanding of the issue — not to mention leaving me with a lot of terrific arguments for the next time someone tried to excuse torture!
So I’m agreeing with you — there are some absolutes — but that doesn’t excuse automatic censorship.
You are right. I wouldn’t use it to excuse censorship.
My son has a non-confrontational technique where he
befriends the opposition in order ‘to psych them out.’
He wants to find out how their minds are working on the
issue and how they arrive at their conclusions.
I want someone like Dersowich to explain his ‘torture
warrant’ it just gives the opposition more ammunition
against him.
I agree, and this has been my experience at dkos lately — everyone jumps on a claim and runs with it without even reading the text. A couple of times I have suggested that the article or whatever does not necessarily suggest without a doubt that something is true. I have gotten slammed, accused of being a troll, etc., even though I’ve tried to talk it through reasonably. I’m not saying I was definitely right, just that more evidence was needed to form such a certain opinion.
I suppose my UID prevented me from being totally trashed though, as I think it’s pretty low.
That’s really the only point I was trying to make. We are left here leaning anyway – which basically excludes right wing non-thought anyway. There are some on the left who think torture or the killing of civilians is necessary, for all I know you might be one, and I would like an opportunity to prove them otherwise, rather than see them cut and run to the other side. As a matter of fact there was one such conversation going on here, which prompted me to move over here in the first place, as I found the debate rather engaging. Generally people, who will advocate such things, at least on the left, do so because they are truly scared and motivated by fear rather than yahoos with a frat boy mentality who got their jollies torturing cats in their childhood. We need all the votes we can get in the next election; we can’t afford to marginalize people.
I didn’t see anyone point out that there has been some technical glitches on dKos recently. Were you truly banned? Did you get any feedback?
I am sorry you had a bad experience – that is reason enough to be frustrated, but did you check to see if your account was still active? I have heard of others experiencing the same trouble as you describe and I know they are posting again.
Sorry for the hit and run comment. I have to go to a recital and won’t get back until later.
an error.
Glitch hit both sig names at about the same time.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
First off, thanks so much for the reference to my diary (blushing)… I too joined dkos on Nov. 3rd (me thinks that’s when I signed up). I have seen the site shift and sway, have been called a troll recently and had new posters question whether I was truly a liberal or not and so on. I just keep fighting back with logic and my usual dose of snark… not sure why that works for me, but it does/ has.
I have my issues with PP that I have called her on — I won’t post the link but I mentioned in one of my snarky diaries that she didn’t quite get that I was aware of her MO as of late. I don’t know why I wasn’t troll rated and why she still gives me 4’s from time to time.
I’ve had my battles with Armando & DemFromCT and came out feeling great about the exchanges and consider them both friends.
I don’t spend as much time on the site as I used to, I am working full time again for one thing, but the troll rating attacks I’ve seen others get does turn me off. I am extremely grateful for the venue that is BT and am glad I have been welcomed here.
I too played a role in Propagannon (to toot my own horn, my Plame summary was frontpaged in the heyday..) and I am still working on the project after much time off due to personal reasons. The project has expanded and will continue to deliver great stories and research that you won’t find in the MSM.
My point? I have no clue, but I feel your pain and I am really glad Armando responded the way he did. I suggest taking his advice and doing what you feel is right.
End of the day… it’s just a blog and there are others out there where people welcome you with open arms… like this one 😉
I like your work alot and am glad you will keep up the good fight.
Ya know what really pisses me off about this whole thing… that they didn’t have the decency to allow you to post your own GBCW diary!
For shame… that’s just a friggin’ tradition!
😉
(love ya Oui, sorry, I had to!)
Knowing Oui, it would have been a masterpiece,
with images and poetry.
Seriously, they could have emailed him a warning.
They lost a good contributor.
It’s fun to find out who’s who in Kosworld & BooWorld. If it makes you feel any better, I think just about everyone goes through it. This Hamletta Asshole you write of was one of the first people at DK to get into my face and I had done nothing wrong. Didn’t like newbies (I’m 32 thousand and something over there) and Hamletta wore it’s low user id number like a badge of honor, not to even be spoken to by a lowlife new Kossack liberal/progressive who signed up around election day, who btw/ spent a year working for Kerry. As for a couple of the others…jealousy, insecurity & passive/aggressive behavior are things that come to mind. Power is a scary thing. Glad you’re enjoying yourself at the new, improved smaller pond. I also like Armando a lot. I hope he gets to the bottom of this.
It’s lost in the mists of the missing dKos archives, but Hamletta was the very first person to respond to what may have been my very first post, lamenting certain parts of parliamentary democracies that are missing in our unique system. Her response?
“Yeah, and if my Uncle had tits, he’d be my Aunt.”
My dKos UID is <2K, and I was lurking before scoop, so this must have been years ago. S/he’s been around for a long time.
Oui / Creve Coeur: À mon avis, c’est un cas où, sans aucun doute, le châtiment ne convene pas au crime.
“Broken Heart” seems so much more appropriate a handle, given the circumstances…
It was indeed my first comment on the new Scoop dKos, and Hamletta’s reply seems really tame, and also on point, in retrospect (although I disagree).
I remember this comment really stinging at the time… Not sure why, except the cocksureness that the Demcratic Party would somehow win in ’04 without reform or reflection. In light of all that’s happened since (NO ONE on dKos in ’03 dared to say the Republican Party had a “facsist wing”!… now no one would deny it!), I feel a kind of pity.
.
Keep it on the wall in my small office space for a daily chuckle.
Exciting and lovely comments!
Thank you so much, it makes me feel better and recovers the necessity to set vision beyond the horizon. Not to be guarded by nasty remarks, or worse, censored on the blog.
Pax.
new creve coeur
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
This is the best satire I’ve read in a very long time. I laughed so hard the first time I read this. I read again, and laughed even harder.
The comments are funny as well.
You should do stand-up 🙂
This has to be the pettiest thing I have ever seen.
Sure, everyone has their moments where they feel slighted online, their egos bruised or whatnot. But posting an entire rant which is not just a sad “help, help, I’m being oppressed” piece (“excommunicated”? please!), it’s also a ridiculous personal attack.
Shape up, get a life, and stop taking yourself so damn seriously.
Additionally, I’m not sure what’s worse: the fact that you posted this, or that this piece of self-important whining crap is the top recommended diary. Nice.
Why bother with your empty attack?
I think it would be customary courtesy to explain the banning. Apparently, neither a warning nor an explanation was provided. That is pretty strange and suggests to many of us that some animals are more equal than others.
Like many others, I appreciate – and at times – admire PP’s abilities as a writer. Which makes it even more surprising and disappointing to see such apparent petty behavior.
But let’s hear your side of the story now, we’re all pretty open-minded over here.
.
we deal with people, real persons we get to know and appreciate. Spend some time with now and then, criticize, debate with, but also give a pat on the back when needed.
Contrary to folks who’s concern lies more in stature gained, kicking downward, and have false claims on low #UID. Take stealth decisions and actions.
PS If it’s so petty — undo ban, it’s easy and no apology needed. No one needs to notice. Like I’ve mentioned upthread, I’ll be the first to request for diary to be unrecommended. That’s the warmth in and advantage of a small community.
Ciao
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
I think this diary is highly recommended because it has offered a thread of commentary on the unfairness that so often happens in on-line communities. Especially in a community like dKos, we all want to believe that our liberal/progressive ideals of open-minded discussion are being realized. In reality, some are more equal than others. Oui’s story suggests that PP engaged in an abuse of power; that she banned a poster simply because she did not like his opinions.
Now, I am not glossing over the fact that Oui had multiple ID’s. I believe he did so innocently and without realizing his violation. I think a bit of friendly discussion with him would have corrected this problem. Ejecting someone from an on-line community shouldn’t pass without notice. People shouldn’t be casually stripped of membership over a difference of opinion. That’s the way this situation appears to me.
Now, perhaps, you can provide evidence that Oui was secretly abusive to PP — an IM log or email where he tells her to “eat shit and die!” or some other provocation that warrented his dismissal from dKos. Otherwise, I don’t see why his membership was yanked out from under him in the middle of relatively civil disagreement.
Because this thread reads more as a wake than anything else. The position in the recommended list is simply indicative of the number of mourners.
I’m not a veteran Kossack, but I feel for those who invested a lot of sweat equity and talent in DailyKos (thereby helping to make it special), and who now see it becoming something less personal and rewarding (weak adjectives, I know. Sorry.)
All of you just assume that Plutonium Page “banned” someone. Which isn’t even true. I don’t know how many people can ban users on dKos (or how it even works), but she can’t.
Someone reasonable would have taken this up in private email with perhaps Markos himself to figure out what was going on. But noo.. whiny diaries and public attacks are much more fun!
But, I’m happy for you all that this is a place where people “appreciate eachother” so much that they don’t bother even considering the obvious or questioning the poster.
Not true. I for one wrote in my first comment:
If Oui has indeed been banned, which is overwhelmingly likely, it is obviously Kos who has done the banning. But given the timing involved, it is also highly probable that PP recommended doing so.
She didn’t even recommend it. I’m sorry to have to disturb your convenient picture of “good” and “evil”.
This whole stupid diary shouldn’t even exist, it’s a disgrace to this site.
Noone here has talked about ‘good’ and ‘evil,’ which would indeed be ridiculous in this context. Personally I’ve merely said that (i) PP probably recommended banning Oui based upon his dual ID; (ii) if so, that was a bit hypocritical and thus disappointing, since she herself has admitted to having two IDs.
I stand by (ii), but if you can assure us that your wife hasn’t prompted banning, the discussion is of course moot as far as PP is concerned and it’s regrettable that she was dragged into this. You must admit, though, that with Oui barred from posting within an hour after PP called him out on the open thread for having dual ID, it was quite natural to infer that she might be behind it.
Can you just clear up what happened so this topic can be put to bed and we can all move on?
I have no interest in an intramural spat between sites, but I also have no intestest in censoring open discussion.
Oui asserts that he lost his posting privileges moments after Page’s response.
You are asserting that Page had nothing to do with this.
Do you have any insight into why Oui was banned?
Not to kiss ass here, but you gotta love a board where the host uses words like ‘intramural’…
When I published diary yesterday, I sent the content of diary to Kos.
Early this morning I repeated an Email with update and a serie of comments added.
As Kos indicates in his user profile, he cannot guarantee any or all emails will be read or answered.
I believe yesterday, cotterperson had Email contact with Armando.
PS A computer glitch would be a satisfactory answer also.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
This is sad, sorry arrogance.
Drive-by posting of general insults:
Then being deliberately obtuse – only to vanish when you are respectfully requested to clarify.
.
Partner didn’t return into ring after recess of 7 hrs, a period where at dKos some 160 diaries could have passed.
If anyone has any knowledge of Email addresses in dKos leadership, this would be appreciated. I have send 3 emails to kos, will repeat tomorrow and copy Armando. Should this be sufficient?
Real political work awaits and some outstanding diaries have been published. Thanks to you all.
Have a pleasant and joyful weekend.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
No more emails, never more than 3.
I’m sure Armando has said something
about this to management. Let it go.
Have fun.
This whole stupid diary shouldn’t even exist, it’s a disgrace to this site.
You think it should be banned, then?
Dense? Why don’t you let PP come to her own defense. The two of you seem to feel both here and at Kos that it is your place to defend each other. Give me a break!
talk about a comment that only attacks. There was no warning, emails or any indication why Oui was banned over there. Funny how dkos regulars didn’t bother to come to Booman Trib until the day dkos went down and THEN they decide to come here.
Quite Frankly, who the hell cares what UID number is. Does being 1888 make one more intelligent than say 29567? Does being #1259 make one more worthy or better educated or funnier than say 32480? What I have been seeing alot of over at dkos is pure and simple high schoolie clique crap and it makes it difficult to even read through comments on some days. It happened alot during the voter fraud spell and the Gannon.guckert inquiries. Shit, if you don’t like a topic or a certain diarist’s style DON’T READ IT, MOVE ON! Sorry, this has me stirred up. Oui I love your diaries…have you heard back from anyone yet?
One more thing and then I will shut up. Their loss our gain for sure!
Thanks.
You got me laughing and crying at the same time.
I’m just as happy when my comment is read by 1 rather than a 1000 who do not communicate.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
Right on Oui! Something I HAVE to remind myself of very often is this:How Important is it really? Sure it hurts when we are shunned, especially for no apparent reason other than spite. When one door closes another door opens my friend. Maybe we just needed your perspective here more than they did/do over there. It’s a great big beautiful world and we have more important battles to fight than the petty crap over ratings etc. Hope you can move on from here forward. Have a good day!
How long has this site been up and look at one troll rated poster. Alot more civility and respect for one anothers opinions I would say. 0/1/2 ratings should be held for totally disruptive posters not because you disagree with diarist/commentor or that you are defending a “loved” one.
.
I’ve experienced the amazement over a period of some weeks. I just get the chuckles again as I relive those moments in March. I tried to hold up a mirror, but that just increased the ‘2‘s.
But Alohaleezy you promised, have a relaxed and easy weekend with your loved ones. Must not consider this blog as a job, unless for direct political activities of course.
Aloha and lots of Flower Leis.
Giving a “Flower Lei” as a gift also expresses the same meanings as the word “Aloha”. Traditionally, the gesture of giving a “Lei” is accompanied by a kiss on the cheek to show it is presented with feelings, emotions, and sincerity.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
Oui you are absolutely right and it is a gorgeous day here in SoCal. I must let it go now.
There is so much to tell one about Hawaii, the land of aloha and enchantment. Kauai was about as close as one can hope to get to Paradise. Will tell tales at a later date. Now, off to the beach and relaxing….Aloha!!!!
My older brother fell in love with a girl named …
Leilani, she lived in St. Louis though, too bad.
He also loved the Pacific and So California, did some gold digging in the Mojave desert to strike it rich. [chuckle]
He never did find sufficient gold … and lost Leilani to competition, more important he has a lovely family now.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
Any organization which summarily bans someone, without any warning whatsoever, is taking itself far too seriously, and if Oui’s version of the story is indeed true, then I, too, have to wonder about what’s going on over at Kos.
Oui, why don’t you write a thoughtful email to the folks at Kos and see what kind of response you get? This whole thing could be just a big misunderstanding.
Post the reply, Oui. We’ll then be able to judge for ourselves, having heard both sides of the story.
Good luck.
.
With priority flag this time, cross my fingers and hope for a reply —
Please note, I get hundreds of emails every day, and while I try to read everything I receive, there’s no way I can respond to more than a fraction of my email.
Markos Moulitsas Zúniga
I’ll accept a computer glitch, whatever.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
Give it a few days. Sorting through tons of unsolicited email can take quite a bit of time.
What did you think about Armando’s response? (Or maybe I shouldn’t ask?)
This seems so wrong to me, I’d really like to see it cleared up somehow.
.
“Let’s not look back to the decision to go to war, we must look forward now.”
I’ll drop kos an email line daily, statistically within a week, an email should arrive at his desk.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
“Blair campaign statement”
Well put!
Oui, I have been reading this thread ever since I came on site, and though I can’t understand how or why this happened to you, I feel bad that it did. If it was a matter of the two names, why didn’t that guy from Georgetown U. who had three or four names get banned? He was obnoxious, and took pleasure pushing all the buttons he could. I would have th ought he’d be trolled into ashes, but I expect we’ll see him back any time.
Yesterday I lost my TU status. Am not sure why. Though few of my last 60 comments were foured, I’ve never been trolled. I should have been clued when I went in yesterday and gave the old TU salute. People just looked at me blankly. Guess this means I’ll have to turn in my keys, special T-shirt, and red pencil. No one’s said a word to me about this. Someone even answered a comment or two of mine, so I guess some can still see me, though having lost my status, I’m supposed to be invisible, right? Any ideas for me?
I think you’ll soon hear from Kos, and am counting on your being readmitted to the inner sanctum there. If that’s what you want. Don’t stop writing, though. I emjoy reading you. And from the looks of it, you’ve gathered quite a number of fond friends here.
.
It’s amazing and heartwarming to find the personal attention still at BooTrib. Some of the original comment entries have also been very helpful. This sort of accidents do happen on the blog sites, never stand still by the fact this could happen to yourself.
Your TU status!
No difference in all dKos features for you today.
Only absent are the trolled comments, listed under Hidden comments on right side:
On the threads, any and all trolled or hidden comments, can only be seen by readers with TU status. Also by rating, the choice for 0 Super Troll has gone. When making a new comment today, dependent on circumstance and content of diary, make other kossacks aware you just lost TU status, so they will honor you with some mojo.
My hands are tied behind my back, I still have TU status but I can only read! Sorry I can’t rate either.
PS Just added a bit of new info to diary. Enjoy this lovely weekend.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
for replying. I appreciate it a lot. It was kind of you to address my pathetic little TU status loss when you are facing banishment and lockout, for an apparently unjust reason. I shouldn’t even have mentioned it. It might even be restful not to read those nasty hidden comments anymore.
When you have any news about your situation, I hope you’ll let us know.
Take care. Try not to worry. And thank you.
I will say one last thing on this matter and then I move on.
Someone upthread mentioned PP herself has 2 usernames. Does she/ doesn’t she? I have no clue, but I find it odd that after she posted her comment about Oui being Creve he/she was banned. If she didn’t recommend the banning then Kos handled this very poorly. No notice, no warning, nothing.
Is two user names at dkos a bannable offense when it is not posted clearly anywhere that it should be (i.e. FAQ, user page, etc) that it is? If it is posted when you first sign up, I had forgotten as it was months ago (and no, I don’t have two usernames… I like causing shit under my own handle just fine).
If the banning was based on the same IP address, does that mean that my husband cannot sign up at dkos and post because someone might think we are the same person and we could both get banned because of it? Are PP & Frank the same person as they clearly post from the same IP address in the NL (I know they are not, I’m just making a point). What about when Frank recommends one of PP’s diaries yet does not post a comment — how do we know that it isn’t PP signing in under Frank’s username (my hubby could sign in under mine as it is automatic on my PC and I would have no idea unless he posted comments). I am positive that this does not happen, I am just making a point.
Creve/ Oui did not confirm for Page/ Kos they were the same person in that diary so the assumption that they were and were not brothers/ sisters/ cousins with a similar style seems quite undemocratic and should concern Page as a part of management of the site. Perhaps Creve just did want to let the past go and become anonymous again… as long as the other UID is inactive why is that an issue? Why not have just sent a warning to Oui/ Creve telling him/ her that the newest account would be deleted as they are breaking the rules?
IMHO I think this has gone on long enough and PP should recommend to Kos that Creve be re-instated and should that happen, Oui should delete this diary and move on… no hard feelings. I also think the multiple UID issue should be clearly stated in the FAQ and a warning should be given before a banning due to the possibilites outlined above.
But then again, I’m Canadian and I like to find diplomatic solutions. 😉
I was in doubt whether to post again on this topic. Thanks for summing it up so well. I have had very similar thoughts since reading the update.
Clumsily handled, no one has suggested that Oui/CC was gaming the system – a warning and cancellation of the newer account would seem more appropriate.
Let’s encourage transparency.
.
It’s not clear at all which procedure was followed in banning process, nor any link to rule for ban. Why no warning was given or friendly correspondence with a Trusted User who never abused another kossack. Why not a simple comment added: “We have a problem, please contact Armando by email.”
I am not in the mood for any BS from Frank, PP or Armando, and want a clear statement on timeline, rules and decision.
I don’t need more statements of what PP did not do. Nothing has changed until PP or Armando provides clarity.
I have heard no complaints about my behavior on the blog at dKos, so it seems fair to illustrate the harassment PP engaged in for weeks. Someone at dKos has behaved as a Ratzinger, I’m afraid we’ll never find out who or why. Not the openness one expects from a liberal blog community.
As I stated earlier on thread, case is closed on diary as it stands. I prefer to keep diary frozen, until PP or Armando provides information.
Can I please have my diary title back – thank you.
PS Technology prevents same IP to rate a comment more than once, or make a double recommendation. I wouldn’t be surprised if double user ID rule is outdated, due to advances in technology. As spiderleaf clearly states in detail what the possibilities are within a single family, it seems that technology takes care of any possible abuse. Double user from same IP cannot be ground for banning, only by abuse of a double identity.
Only repeating what I have urged all along – reinstate oui or creve coeur, blame it on a computer glitch and life goes on. It’s as easy as you want it to be. Some BooTribbers have followed the procedure to unrecommend diary hours ago, to give new diaries a chance to gain on recommend list. So this diary will not remain much longer on the recommend list.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
you can change your title back.
I shortened it so the auto-title feature would work with the UPDATE in it (50 character rule).
Also, Page takes particular offense to the Ratzinger comparison. So, I chose that part to clip.
Diary titles longer than 50 characters prevent the auto-title function from working in comments. Just something to think about when making a title for a diary.
I am done trying to mediate this. I’ve done what I can.
BooMan, you should not wake me at 02:00 AM local time, I can’t think nor write!
Have added a comment to diary content —
Have made proposal to DailyKos.
Will keep you informed.
Appendix with info has been noted and read during 48 hrs. period. INFO has become superfluous with time and thus deleted.
/Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
what does this mean, what does the update mean. I didn’t email you or wake you.
Became restless during sleep, so I knew I needed to check up on my diary. You had added latest UPDATE, so I did have to respond to your questions at 02:00 AM local time.
I know you are secure in these matters, I was just having a bit of fun. One needs to loosen and not become too serious on the blog.
BTW Mediation is an art with close set of rules. It’s just lately been introduced in the lawyer’s offices in the Netherlands. A close friend did go through a complete training and found it truly remarkable. It works! He keeps talking in on me, to make use of the principles.
KUDOS – for your outstanding moderation on this diary and performance in all of the BooTrib community. Deeply appreciated. I have found the contributions, analysis and exchange of previous experiences of BooTribbers very enlightening and erases any thought: why just me? It happens – human nature.
Have made proposal to DailyKos.
Will keep you informed.
Appendix with info has been noted and read during 48 hrs. period. INFO has become superfluous with time and thus deleted.
Late last night PDT made an initiative toward DailyKos, got a quick response. Hope this will be successful.
Lengthy APPENDIX has been deleted as all has been said and read. Is available for anyone who feels the need to have complete diary.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
Oui, I think this whole diary points out the need for emoticons on political sites. I confess I had difficulty understanding your previous comment about the “wake up”call. It is so hard to show intent of meaning in words.
I followed this diary and I am glad to see it resolved in this manner.
demanding that management provide us with the basic human right of emoticons.
Too long have we been forced to scrounge like dogs through festering piles of ASCII.
EMOTICONS NOW!
And longer titles.
50 Characters is not enough!
Our headlines are starving!
You have outdone yourself once again. Thanks for the Sunday morning pick me up. After your comment above, you really must go to my diary Is there hope? and comment, please. (begging emoticon here)
I’ll join your insurgency if you do, ha ha. (See! no proper emoticon! Tragic!)
my small contribution
i stole it from Newsie
How did you do that, what is the code?
Sadly I have experienced the same as Oui at New European Times.
Partly my own fault of course:
First out of the bag I criticised the amateurish NET logo, but that caused a lot of positive traffic and lots of suggestions from many people for improvements. I also posted my own.
I then posted a few non-political diaries which also generated a lot of intelligent traffic. They were provocative perhaps but from the replies, most understood what I was on about.
Then the Welshman initiated a series of reasonable private messages to me explaining his vision of the site. I replied, and accepted his request for some toning down. In the course of these private messages I explained that I worked as a consultant at an ad agency in Finland (among other things) and was doing some research on forums.
This research is non-invasive – just counting numerical activity in public forums based on broad subjects. It is a small part of a research project setting some groundwork for web-based national elections.
It was rather like counting the number of cars passing a certain point. There was no interest in content. Anyway – to our standards it was entirely innocent.
But somehow the Welshman got the wrong end of the stick, thought I was involved in some 1984 manipulation using NET as a guineapig and then PUBLISHED my private letter at NET even though I had presumed the correspondence was private.
He also accused me of going behind everyone’s back. I tried to point out that he – as the Administrator – had initiated the private conversation.
I was then publically accused of all sorts of things by moderators – most of them based on Welshman’s interpretation. Mainly I was accused of gross self importance – and this may indeed be true 😉
I posted a long defence and then for a day people were posting in favour, against etc. The Welshman, I must state, was fair in his comments, both for and against
Then without a word I was banned as a member, and totally erased from any NET threads. Some posts by others were also erased – but this I put down to incompetence using the WowBB software.
That was back a couple of months.
I rejoined yesterday under a new nick. I was sweetness and light, and greatly enjoyed getting back into the NET themes which are close to my interests. I don’t think anyone could have the slightest objection to any of my posts.
But of course though I am mostly in Sweden, I am using a Finnish IP and there ain’t too many Finns posting at NET. So I guess it stuck out a bit.
I am suspicious that my password was examined. I deliberately used the same one as previously.
Anway, the result was another banning. No comments. no requests, no nothing – just out of the blue. And also right in the middle of a frutiful exchange with one of the moderators, who herself was shocked at the abruptness of it. (as I visited as a guest immediately to try and find out WTF was going on).
OK – it is their site (or is it?) They can make up whatever rules they want.
I don’t swear, I am not aggressive – but I may be provocative. You can check out my few diaries and posts here at Boot if you want a sample.
It leaves a bad taste. I have total sympathy for Oui.
I think you should really let go your feelings about this. Collectively we took a view that you had not been honest to other members about the reason for your presence on the site and, as a small community, it was felt sensible to ask you to leave with no hard feelings. You threatened to come back using a different ISP and I politely asked you not to.
Yesterday you came back on the site under an assumed name and. given the opportunity to explain who you were, you did not take it. This time you were banned outright and it is a pity that you put yourself in this position.
Communities need to feel confident about their members, particularly small ones. You have raised this issue on DKos and when someone referred to you as a troll I immediately said this was not so and said it was simply not the right site for you.
Richard, there are no absolutes in getting these decisions right. Administrators take the best decision that they can in the light of the circumstances. Where these are taken in a friendly way and with respect for the individual, then it is best to shake hands and agree to find other outlets for your talents.
There are two and a half million blogs on the Internet, the chemistry is bound not to work with some of these. You write well and have an interesting background. I will enjoy exchanging comments with you in the future elsewhere.
Your situation is not the same this diarist and it is wrong to try and associate your banning with his. Not least, you have had lots of opportunity to discuss this with me and I have done so in the friendliest and most helpful way that I can. Coming back on to New European Times under an assumed name is why this time there was no discussion. I ma afraid that you will find this is a universally applied rule.
Let it be – we shall have a lot of more pleasant and useful exchanges elsewhere in the future.
.
Glad the Finnish people share many talents with surrounding countries. Ties to Scandinavia have always been close, and to the rest of Europe have improved tenfold.
Scenic Finland — Toivoniemi
Sorry I can’t take sides in issue with Welshman, I hope you get along well in different surroundings, where all are equal, … I hope. Appreciate also Welshman adding his comment, will show equal appreciation.
Pax.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
Thanks Oui – and no need to take sides! The Welshie has been most courteous. But I hope you get your problem solved. Mine appears to be a lifetime’s exile.
Finland is still my favourite of all the Nordic countries, though the Baltics also are exciting economically. Jari Litmanen is now shacked up with an Estonian beauty – so he’s doing his bit for Nordic cooperation. I have done a fair amount of work with Nokia, though not much now. But in general working with hi-tech companies in communications and marketing.
We meet a lot of Dutch people here in the summer – the sailing is fantastic in the archipelago. I also travel to Holland quite a lot as I have dealings with Univ of Amsterdam. Great city!
Good to meet you, and I shall check out the humour in those diaries.
Pondering this comment here and aware of the banning at NET.
On the blogs for a while – DailyKos since last summer and a UID near 16k, I’ve added Booman and then NET. I’ve seen some tensions grow and be diffused over almost a year.
I have seen a lot of presumptions that participating on a blog is like walking into an immediately compatible group because of philosophical direction or geographics or whatever. This is in no way true. The basics may be there – but the fit may not be good. The fit for me at Atrios wasn’t good at all – so I moved on.
I too have been diary police – in Cheers & Jeers of all places on DailyKos – over multiple UIDs. I don’t write diaries there – 1 in 10 months. I comment.
If someone is in a pissy mood, why stand and fight? or worse why pick a fight? There are more diaries, more conversations, more comments….why that diary – why that time? We can’t and won’t win every argument – pick and choose good fights.
I am strangely a creature of rules – know the rules and play by the rules. As an American democrat I know that smacks me down regularly in politics. The blogs have invited me to participate, it is their space, they can ban me if they don’t like what I say or do.
I was not aware of Oui’s banning from DailyKos and was aware of Sven’s banning from NET…but some questions for everyone…
– Is Booman Tribune really the place to hash this out?
– Is Booman Tribune to become a rant / vent place for former members of DailyKos – whatever the reason they are no longer there?
– Is Booman Tribune a place for former participants of other blogs to slam their previous communities?
Blogs are like TV’s – if you don’t like what’s on change the damn channel. If you don’t like the blog find someplace more compatible but don’t ask the rest of us to participate in this slamming of others.
My answer to all 3 of my questions… NO
/end of rant
Agree!
Hopefully, this is truly the “Final” installment of this Oui, me thinks thou doth protest too much!
No offense intended but it is time to move forward, and I for one, am looking forward to it…Let it go!
… sweeping the floor. Don’t you see all the chairs are on the tables. The friendly place was shut down hours ago, everyone has moved on to places where it’s cozy and crowded. This place is empty, the players had a frank discussion and all is well. No more drinks are being served.
You don’t want to cause any disturbance now, there is no one who will answer your quarrel. Be sure next time you are up front when this place opens up, is more fun. These wisecracks offer little merit, ok it’s listed in the diary, but no one is listening.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
Sorry you don’t like late-comers to the comments
I was out of town all weekend…got back to Booman late today.
One of the nice things about Booman is that we still comment even if something is slipping off the page…diaries that hang around for a few days still get comments.
Oh well – live and learn…don’t comment late in big diaries or get snarked at…particularly if I have a different opinion from the diary.
Geez – I guess I’ll just crawl back to my life that is not devoted to blogs 24/7
.
A low blow!
It’s clear I have made a final comment and last update to diary, I have no intention to rehash the 155 comments that were already contributed. By definition, this diary served a purpose in the BooTrib community, otherwise readers would have passed on.
You come in with a lot of criticism, but all has been said. There is no problem between welshman and Sven Triloqvist, read the comments. You coudn’t have read the original diary, because the lengthy APPENDIX has been deleted after 48 hours. It formed an integral part of this diary, but served no further purpose once all facts were read by the community. I doubt whether its your intention to be informed about diary content, but you need to google first part of diary title, and you will find cached version.
Any one who comes in and puts in an effort to read diary and gets a sense of the comments made, I’ll be glad to answer to any and all contributions.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
This diary is still on the recommended list.
I read the diary and I read all the comments including those that referenced the DailyKos diary and comments. I formed my own opinion based on the diary as shown and the comments….will continue to form my own opinion.
Sorry you felt it was a low blow…
And I still stand by my questions…
Is Booman Tribune really the appropriate place for questions regarding the management policies of DailyKos and people that post there?
As to the timing of whether this diary was alive or not you posted an update to the diary almost 50 minutes after I posted my comment. Others posted a response to my comment 5-10 minutes before you updated.
Cutting off discussion because you felt the topic was concluded is not how it works in my world. Oh well…
.
[Sun. May 15th 00:30 AM PDT] Have made proposal to DailyKos.
Will keep you informed.
Ban was possible within one hour!
After an exchange of emails with proposal to reinstate sig name creve coeur, and a long wait … more waiting, I once again placed a request tonight after two full days.
Conclusion: a longer wait and no decision. No other option than to register under another sig name — new creve coeur at dKos. Lose all mojo and build up of reputation. Recent diaries cannot be edited or updated, and search tool will not list all comments, etc., etc.
I had hoped for a humane blog solution, that was not possible due to lack of cooperation.
Definitely will spend more time at BooTrib.
A Final THANK YOU – you were great, plenty of support and many useful tips.
The human lack of flexibility is cause for much pain, this was not necessary.
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
I just read your last update and am profoundly sorry for you. I am surprised and very much dismayed at this lack of response or reprieve. So much for a “liberal” blog.
I’ll just have to be patient, no other option. Just 1 hour needed to find OFF switch – perplexed.
I added a comment to your thread — LOL remember?
Re: Alohaleezy makes little joke, yes?
Pax
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
Yes I saw that and responded too. Please keep us posted via this diary until it is no longer available ok?
.
<FONT COLOR=blue> THANKS ARMANDO! </FONT>
First post successfully launched just before midnight 00:00 PDT.
Got to run … politics can’t wait much longer.
Kind regards,
Adrian
aka new creve coeur
The Hague Thursday May 18, 2005 09:00 AM Local Time
First post new creve coeur @dKos
Oui – Liberté – Egalité – Fraternité
Considering this comment to me :
That is so stupid.
If you see an analogy there, I feel sorry for you. Because you can’t possibly understand your fellow humans.
One of my favorite quotes is from Cary Grant as CK Dexter Haven when he said, “You can’t be a first-class human being until you learn to have some regard for human frailty.”
If you’re a believer or a non-believer who cannot respect the other, I don’t have time for you.
by hamletta on Sun Apr 3rd, 2005 at 02:49:08 CDT
[ Parent | Reply to This ]
She lectures me on human frailty but posts comments like the one you listed(my original comment was over the top, and I admitted as much). I’ve also seen here go off on Cold Fusion as well, I guess she lives by Do as I say, not as I do.