[From the diaries by susanhu.] The UK Sunday Times reports that the Bush administration actually does negotiate with terrorists. According to the article, “senior military and intelligence officers, a civilian staffer from Congress and a representative of the US embassy in Baghdad” have met twice with representatives of insurgent groups in Iraq.
How many Bushco lies is that now? I’ve lost count.
The talks on June 3 were followed by a second encounter 10 days later, according to an Iraqi who said that he had attended both meetings. Details provided to The Sunday Times by two Iraqi sources whose groups were involved indicate that further talks are planned in the hope of negotiating an eventual breakthrough that might reduce the violence in Iraq.
That’s right. The coalition of the willing is losing the war and now they’re meeting with insurgents to hear their demands. (More below)
Flashback to what Karl Rove said this past week:
And now, let’s look at what Bushco has been doing, according to the Times article:
“It was a boring line of questioning that indicated an attempt to discover more about their enemy than about finding solutions,” one of the sources added. “We told the translator to inform them that if they persisted with this line we would all walk out of the meeting.”
Is it just me or does that look like an attempt to understand the terrorists?
Hypocrites.
But, you say, not all insurgents are terrorists. They just want their country back. Whatever you may feel about the opposition in Iraq, here’s who Bushco is really meeting with:
If that’s not a slap in the face to American troops, I don’t know what is. Not only are they negotiating with terrorists, they’re negotiating with those who committed one of the worst attacks on the US military in the history of the war.
Incredible.
And, what do these terrorists want? Well, what’s the one thing that Bushco representatives have said repeatedly lately they would not provide? A timetable for withdrawal. Is this why the public has been inundated with these refusals to set a timetable? Not for those in the US who are calling for one – but to get that message across to those insurgents? Make you wonder. Apparently, they also called for “US compensation for the damage caused by the American military occupation”. That sounds fair to me – since it’s what the US promised in the first place.
And, what was offered in return?
The Iraqi side immediately reverted to its demand for a timetable and the only agreement of the afternoon was to meet again.
Think about that for a minute. They offered to release prisoners. An offer that would definitely include freedom for even more terrorists. Just how wise is that?
The second meeting did not go quite as well with the Iraqis complaining that the US officials were “talking with a tone of more superiority, arrogance and provocation”. Right. That’s exactly how you negotiate with people who would blow your heads off: by being obstinate and belligerent.
“Our response was that we will never abandon any Muslim who has come to our country to help us defend it,” the commander said.
I guess they figured since they haven’t been doing much of anything to catch Osama bin Laden – even though Porter Goss says he knows where OBL is – they’d at least try to score a few points with the American public by going after his supporters in Iraq.
Strike two.
“They initially thought they could win it through military operations and now they have come to realise that the military option will not provide them with the solution, so they are going for the political option as well.”
Oh. So now they figure diplomacy might work? After how many thousands of people have been killed and wounded? Some of us thought diplomacy might work in the first place if Bushco had allowed the UN process to work and we were vilified. At least we are not responsible for the nightmare that has become the war on Iraq. You are, Bush. How does that feel?
Does Bushco suddenly believe in appeasement? Well, consider the little covered news last week that the administration has promised 50,000 tons of food aid to North Korea even though there is absolutely no assurance that the food will actually end up being delivered to the starving North Korean people. It is just as likely to go towards feeding government officials, supporters and the huge army. The news agencies were too busy covering one missing white woman in Aruba while the administration was busily selling out America’s integrity around the world.
Just what else is going on that we don’t know about?
Hypocrites. Every last one of them.
In memory of those 22 people killed by terrorists and the thousands of others who have been wounded, killed and have had their lives so unspeakably disrupted.
Bush’s poll numbers are in the toilet, Independent voters are jumping ship, the DSM is gaining traction, and the Iraq war is becoming more unpopular by the minute. Rove’s comments were a shrill attempt to change the subject and rally what base they have left. Problem is that he’s pissed off every Liberal or Democrat serving in the military and they are getting vocal. Please see Susan’s front page article as well as well as this military blog full of invective against Rove and Bush.
Instead of changing the subject, Iraq and patriotism is front and center… political genious? Nah… sociopathic, overconfident and still an ugly little fat man. Now we discover that they are negotiating with the insurgents. The curtain is being pulled away slowly but surely… once average America starts seeing through the lies they are easier to spot. This administration wouldn’t know the ‘right’ thing to do if it jumped up and bit Karl Rove’s big plump ass.
That military blog is a must read.
Hello, Angry Arab disagrees. I was by his site and he considers the talk of “negotiations” to be propaganda for domestic consumption in the US.
I find it odd though that out of the blue, following the disturbing news that Bush support among independents has fallen to incredible lows, this story pops up.
If I can find further comment from say, abu Aardvark, or Asia Times Online, I will post it here.
Ooops, Nag said all of this, and quite well too.
Still, it will be interesting to follow the foreign media, and Arab bloggers on this issue.
From the White House:
Iraqi Resistance Report for events of Saturday, 25 June 2005
http://www.uruknet.info/?p=m13050
Negotiate with these guys?
Four Marines have been kidnapped during house to house raids. Checkpoints have been hit with mortar fire and grenades. It’s carnage.
What more can one say?
Dear god.
any more word on the marines?
(I see two more died from that bombing the other day — brings that total to 8 dead.)
From the Salt Lake Tribune:
The article above that quote is an incredibly sad expose of what’s happening on the streets of Iraq.
The alternative is more dead and maimed Marines. And Guardsmen. And doctors. And Iraqis of all stripes.
Take your pick. Hostilities always end with the two sides coming to an agreement of one sort or another.
I believe that they did a bit of negotiating before we even went into Iraq with a terrorist group known as Dawa that tried to be a thorn in Saddam’s side and deployed suicide bombers in Bahgdad. Oh Yeah, and Ibrahim al-Jaafari was one of them! But they were blowing up innocents in an attempt to piss off a dictator so I suppose that they “aren’t” technically terrorists then, I don’t know, I’m confused…..I need to ask Ole Alberto to explain that to me. I just gave myself a headache trying to figure out what these fuckers mean when they say stuff.
The enemy of my enemy is my friend until they turn into my enemy and, somehow, it seems they always turn into my enemy – regardless.
Arond and around it goes…
OR AGAINST US-WE WILL NOT NOGOTIATE WITH TERORISTS” G.W. “FLIPFLOP” CHIMPBUSH “Do as i do, not as I say”
From Bloomberg News:
…
The talks, aimed at negotiating a breakthrough that may lead to a reduction in violence in Iraq, were held on June 3 and June 13, and more meetings are planned, the London-based newspaper said. Time magazine reported in February that U.S. diplomats and intelligence officials have held direct, secret talks with insurgent groups.
[On Meet The Press] Rumsfeld refused to comment directly on the newspaper’s report.
“The Iraqis have a sovereign government,” he said. “They will decide what their relationships with various elements of insurgents will be. We facilitate those from time to time.”
So there you go. Rumsfeld admits that Bushco neogotiates with terrorists – trying to make it sound like it’s all on the Iraqi government but the Sunday Times article makes it clear that anything agreed upon through those negotiations must be cleared by Washington. That’s Washington, not Baghdad, Rumsfeld. Does anyone out there actually believe that anything happens in Iraq without US approval?
Lies, lies, lies…
I have found nothing to confirm this, even at al Jazeera.
See my post to Susan above with the link to the Salt Lake Tribune that confirms this story.
from Global Security, dated June 24.
“duty status whereabouts unknown” is that military speak for “kidnapped?”
But why is this not on CNN? you know, Cable NEWS Network.
But why is this not on CNN? you know, Cable NEWS Network.
Oh c’mon now. It’s not like they’re missing white girls.
(and yes, I am white)
out of respect, errr, I mean ridicule, I must listen.
Looks like he recovered from his recent heart attack.
(see Huffington’s blog) He checked in under a false
name to an ortho clinic but then sneaked into a
cardio clinic.
Funny Wolfie is not asking him about that?
Chances are that sailor is from a carrier out in the gulf, there to call in airstrikes.
US forces used loudspeakers throughout al-Fallujah, starting at dawn Saturday and continuing into the morning, to broadcast threats against the people of the city that they would receive “unprecedented punishments” if they did not hand over the four Marines.
I feel for these guys – they must be plenty worried for them. But i really feel also for the residents. I’m sure there are some among them who really believe they might be rounded up and shot. That sort of thing does happen, after all. I’m not at all sugesting the Marines would do that, just that the people of al-Fallujah must be plenty worried as well.
I think this is a good thing. There doesn’t seem much on the horizon except more bad. Deep bad. If they can negotiate their way out then all the better. Iraq is rapidly approaching a tipping point, and the results would not be good for Iraq. Nor us.
I wouldn’t expect them to enter the tent on bended knee. Not at this stage, anyway. They’re actively fighting each other, and this isn’t the USS Missouri in Tokyo Bay.
They’re hypocrites, all right (though they proved that a very long time ago). But we should at least be happy that the US is actually talking to the insurgents. It says this took place June 3. I actually hope this news coming out doesn’t affect the negotiations negatively. discussion == fewer dead and maimed people.
Once they (the admin) have begun a withdrawal, then we turn the knife. This is more evidence of their incompetence (if not out-right crimes) and we should use this judiciously.
All that macho “we dont negotiate with terrorists” bullshit they were espousing for years seems to have been forgotten.
But
This is actually the most sensible thing they have done. Guerilla wars are almost unwinnable militarily and only by negotiating a political settlement with those with the guns do they usually get settled. The funny thing is that the repubs will probably face the most criticism from their own usual supporters. Time for Rummy et al to squirm.