In Col. Patrick Lang’s frontpaged diary of Dec. 1st ( The Propaganda of the Word), he leveled charges against unspecified members of the government and armed forces regarding their interest and participation in some very interesting activities.
I quote:
Telepathy, telekinesis, firewalking, spoonbending, distant viewing, political warfare and propaganda against both hostile and friendly targets were all studied and experimented in by men who under normal circumstances were more stable and certainly less imaginative. … continued below …
(See the interesting work, “The Men Who Stare at Goats”)
In the end the Army rejected all this and returned to its usual preoccupation, but the tendency survived in the persons of several officers who have risen to high rank. Some have been high officials in the counter-terrorism and homeland defense fields. Some are now major media figures and others officials of the Department of Defense, but outside the “mainstream” of the Army. None are in the intelligence business.
I then wrote a diary (Misinformation? Disinformation? A coven of REAL spooks in the White House? Let’s have some names.) asking for more specific information. I got none. Only a severe reprimand from Susanhu for…for what? I never DID figure that one out.
There is a wonderful blog called Rigorous Intuition…subtitled “What you don’t know can’t hurt them”…that deals with this kind of subject regularly and in great depth.
Read on for more.
In the 12/9/05 edition of this blog, its owner Jeff Reynolds posted a story called I wish that hadn’t happened regarding some of the people who are and were involved in that movement.
An excerpt:
Houck dates his interest in the paranormal to the mid-70s, when he learned of Stanford Research Institute’s remote viewing program, and was encouraged by SRI’s Harold Puthoff and Russell Targ to conduct his own experiments. The results persuaded Houck of the reality of remote viewing and the significance of psi research, and ever since he has been instructing thousands around the world, many in defense industries, “how to use the power of your mind” to perform PK feats such as metal bending. Including, yes, spoons.
—snip—
Retired Major General Albert Stubblebine, then commanding officer of the US Army Intelligence and Security Command (INSCOM), was an attendee of Houck’s parties, and was so impressed he added it to the itinerary of a retreat for senior INSCOM staff officers at a conference facility near Leesburg, Virginia. Jim Schnabel tells the story in his book Remote Viewers:
Someone handed out spoons and forks, and Stubblebine gave a short talk on how it was done, and then 25 to 30 colonels and generals stood around holding these eating utensils and staring at them, waiting for something to happen.
At one point, a somewhat skeptical colonel turned his head to say something to a colleague, and as he did, his fork suddenly drooped into a ninety-degree angle. Everyone looked at him and his fork, at which point the fork bent back up, then down again, and finally settled into an angle of about forty-five degrees. The colonel whose fork it was put the thing down, shaking his head, evidently unsettled. He was a Christian, and later would denounce the entire thing as the trickery of the devil.
“I wish that hadn’t happened,” said the colonel.
I don’t think there can be true comprehension of how America got here from there, without assuming that sentiment has been often thought and voiced in the halls of the cryptocracy.
And
So since I had NOT gotten any answers from Col. Lang, I went on a little search for Maj. General Stubblebine’s references.
And here is some of what I found.
There is SO much information on this that I will only provide links and a few salient snippets of interesting information. Just Google “Albert Stubblebine” for all the news that is fit to hide on this particular little cog in the Occultocracy that quite possibly rules this country at present. (It would explain a lot, wouldn’t it? The consistent…and there is no other word for it…the consistent evil that oozes out of this administration? Dig it.)
“It (TRV) is a very systematic, very controlled method of accessing information that is not normally available by any other source… It is independent of time.. I can go present, I can go future. It is independent of location, so I can go anywhere on this earth, I can go into any closet, I can go into any mind..It is independent of space, therefore, I can access that information any place on the planet or off of it if I choose.”
– Major General Albert Stubblebine,
former PSI TECH Chairman Of The Board and commanding officer of the U.S. Army Intelligence and Security Command (INSCOM)
Recently Declassified Project
Remote Viewing – U.S. Military – C.I.A.
Espionage and Parapsychology
—snip—
Major Ed Dames, Remote-Viewing Unit, US Army, 1984-1989…was trained by Ingo Swann in Remote Viewing, and began to train others. He claims to be Swann’s protégé and caretaker of the technology, and provided advanced training for many top level people from many different agencies.
Some psychics specialized in things like, Nuclear Weapons, Soviet Tanks Location, Chemical and Biological Weapons Location, (all located by remote viewers), as well as the location of Mohmar Khadaffi, in Lybia. They used the predictions of the psychics to locate Khadaffi and drop bombs on him in the 80’s.
The Pentagon claims that only on occasion were the results of remote viewing and other similar projects used in decision making at the top level. The projects received the highest level of support and they claim some remarkable psychic achievements in locating Soviet Submarines, Nuclear Research installations and even locating Hostages in the Middle East. There was never a shortage of volunteers for this paranormal duty.
Major Ed Dames says that he trained people from different agencies and apparently they were satisfied because they kept coming back! Agencies like CIA, FBI, Defense Intelligence Agency, Navy, Air Force and the Drug Enforcement Agency. Dames claims they are happy customers of the psychic training, and would not keep coming back if they did not receive something useful.
The program developed to the point where the coordinates were not even given to the psychics, and it did not matter, they still got it right. The coordinates were more a formality which was done away with, because the psychics “knew” what the targets were with out any clues. The nature of the project began to expand beyond remote viewing to include other psychic abilities.
Major Ed Thompson US Army left the project in 1981, but the main supporter was:
Major General Albert Stubblebine.
Major General Stubblebine was enthusiastic about the project and its expansion. Head of Armies Intelligence and Securities. He did experiments with his senior officers to attempt to bend spoons with psychic power. He received the nickname of “Spoonbender” as a result.
Colonel John Alexander was a staff officer close to Major General Stubblebine during this time.
Colonel John Alexander – US Army Intelligence and Security Command, 1982-1984… tells of a meeting with Major General Stubblebine and about 30 Generals and high ranking men, in which all were attempting to bend cutlery (Psychokinesis). Alexander has 2 forks that were identical, until an interesting event occurred. One of the untrained individuals in the meeting held up a fork and in the plain view of everyone, one fork simply bent to a 90 degree angle, then it returned to an upright position, then bent again to a position of about 45 degrees and it remained there! He held up the actual fork for the TV camera and showed it bent.
This occurred in the presence of Top Level Military men, and witnessed by many qualified observers. It occurred in plain view of all. This is a fact and Colonel John Alexander appeared on TV with this story and with the forks, one of which was bent and showed to the TV camera.
When Colonel John Alexander was asked the question, “What are you going to do, try to bend tank barrels?” he said, “No, that’s ridiculous, but we do think we can impact electronics, and things of that nature.” He goes on to say that instead of trying to move large mass of matter, we are just dealing with electrons.
Major General Stubblebine felt that confronting his officers to the paranormal would keep them intellectually on their toes, and shake up their world views. But it was having a deep impact on everyone exposed to the reality of the paranormal. Suddenly the mundane things of life seemed so unimportant when the foundations of reality (or what was perceived as reality) are shaken.
The reality of the psychic phenomena in “Remote Viewing” and now in “Spoon Bending” was enough to cause great interest from the CIA & DIA in particular. The project became known as Star Gate. From this point on the facts become unclear because of so much denial by CIA and DIA of their involvement.
There was a shake up in the hierarchy and the psychics did not like the changes the programs were going through. There were some who left the military and began researching on their own.
Major General Stubblebine resigned in 1984, in part because of pressure that he had gone too far in this psychic research. The project was taken over totally by the Defense Intelligence Agency and out of the Army (who had overseen the project since 1972.
The DIA explored all forms of psychic abilities, with a less structured approach. The Navy began its independent psychic research, as well as the Army, CIA, DEA, FBI and others. Various code names from the different groups were GRILL FRAME, CENTER LANE, and STARGATE. The CIA had a research project code named SCANTE.
Major Ed Dames used remote viewing to attempt to locate the Ark of the Covenant, Noah’s Ark and UFO’s. He said that he could not give the information to his superiors because of reprisals for searching for such non authorized things. He did not say where they were but implied they knew.
In the 1980’s the Pentagon began to scrutinize various groups like the remote viewers. The Secretary of Defense Carlucci sent an inspector general team to examine the remote viewing project operations. They burned and shredded all the documents of the years of study. Major Ed Dames says they literally burned up 2 paper shredders destroying the remote viewing project data. Why would the Pentagon and the Secretary of Defense do that?
With support from congress the Remote Viewing Project survived and it was used in locating SCUD missiles in the Gulf War, as well as other intelligence targets.
The DIA claimed that it no longer wanted the project. In 1995 the congress transferred the project to the CIA. The official stand is that the CIA did not want the remote viewing project. The CIA claimed to have shut the project down. What a laugh.
Note well the DIA (Defense Intelligence Agency )involvement.
From Col. Lang’s bio:
“…served as “Defense Intelligence Officer for the Middle East, South Asia and Terrorism” for the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) and was later the first Director of the Defense Humint Service.”
I think he knows whereof he speaks on these matters.
Further, if you want a good scare, go here…to this page at Mind Control Forums. it is a veritable rogues gallery of these people, complete with pictures.
And finally…
From someone who was sort of a remote viewer for the age during his early career. Someone who when asked if he could sit down and write this sort of stuff now looks and the interviewer] sadly shakes his head and says something like “No. I can’t. You don’t understand. I wasn’t writing it. It was just coming through me.”
You walk into the room
With your pencil in your hand
You see somebody naked
And you say, “Who is that man?”
You try so hard
But you don’t understand
Just what you’ll say
When you get home
Because something is happening here
But you don’t know what it is
Do you, Mister Jones?
You raise up your head
And you ask, “Is this where it is?”
And somebody points to you and says
“It’s his”
And you say, “What’s mine?”
And somebody else says, “Where what is?”
And you say, “Oh my God
Am I here all alone?”
Because something is happening here
But you don’t know what it is
Do you, Mister Jones?
You hand in your ticket
And you go watch the geek
Who immediately walks up to you
When he hears you speak
And says, “How does it feel
To be such a freak?”
And you say, “Impossible”
As he hands you a bone
Because something is happening here
But you don’t know what it is
Do you, Mister Jones?
You have many contacts
Among the lumberjacks
To get you facts
When someone attacks your imagination
But nobody has any respect
Anyway they already expect you
To just give a check
To tax-deductible charity organizations
You’ve been with the professors
And they’ve all liked your looks
With great lawyers you have
Discussed lepers and crooks
You’ve been through all of
F. Scott Fitzgerald’s books
You’re very well read
It’s well known
Because something is happening here
But you don’t know what it is
Do you, Mister Jones?
Well, the sword swallower, he comes up to you
And then he kneels
He crosses himself
And then he clicks his high heels
And without further notice
He asks you how it feels
And he says, “Here is your throat back
Thanks for the loan”
Because something is happening here
But you don’t know what it is
Do you, Mister Jones?
Now you see this one-eyed midget
Shouting the word “NOW”
And you say, “For what reason?”
And he says, “How?”
And you say, “What does this mean?”
And he screams back, “You’re a cow
Give me some milk
Or else go home”
Because something is happening here
But you don’t know what it is
Do you, Mister Jones?
Well, you walk into the room
Like a camel and then you frown
You put your eyes in your pocket
And your nose on the ground
There ought to be a law
Against you comin’ around
You should be made
To wear earphones
Because something is happening here
But you don’t know what it is
Do you, Mister Jones?
Something IS happening here.
But you don’t know what it is.
Do you, Mister Jones?
You don’t even know WHERE it is.
I’ll give you a hint.
It’s in the DC area.
BET on it.
AG
They call it mojo, this tips/recs thing.
mojo
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural mojoes or mojos
Etymology: probably of African origin; akin to Fulani moco’o medicine man
: a magic spell, hex, or charm; broadly : magical power
Hmmm…
AG
When reduced to the manipulation of electrons, anything is possible, even internet communication.
Imagine what they could be creating in Iraq if the connection is true between torture and releasing the mind from the body’s pain. The deliberate splitting of the two as a means of controlling a mind’s power.
From my new age catalog “Sounds True” (www.soundstrue.com) you can order a Remote Viewing Training Course for $249.00.
I’m tempted between “I can see from here it looks like a good course” or “there’s a misprint on page 42” or “I’ll take one, just leave it on the counter, by the coffemaker.”
😉
Seriously, I believe those skills are possible and able to be developed but they aren’t available to everyone. Any good reviews on the course?
BTW, my voting doesn’t seem to work. I give a 4 to all comments I reply to.
Only on my threads.
Bwwwwaaaaaa AH HA ha ha ha!!!
The remote Shadow Strikes Again!!!
AG
Patents for remote technology are going to make Tim Spicer rich besides just owning all of us.
how do frantic parents filter out a child who can remote view?????
That’s a darn good question. I don’t think it would be developed into a usable skill at a very young age without the parent’s knowledge or cooperation. I don’t think kids are good candidates for that field.
Wouldn’t do to send them to their room, would it?
How do frantic parents filter out a child who can remote view?????
Ritalin.
AG
This is turning into an interesting discussion, and I would hate to see it slip off into oblivion. It’s on the recommended list now….let’s see if we can keep it up until every weekend warrior who is out holiday shopping or just living some sort of normal life gets a chance to think about it.
Through the weekend, maybe.
Thanks…
AG
my kids want are and where the best price is….that alone is almost worth the 249.00. Can you get a crash course or does that cost more?
Hey, AG…
Just because there are government reports claiming spoons were bent doesn’t mean we’re seeing mind over matter. It’s possible that in order to impress the larger group some insiders had some of the cutlery made of a metal like Wood’s metal, an alloy that literally “melts in your hand.” This kind of thing has been known to magicians for over 100 years, and I’m sure the CIA types could have this done if they wanted to. I’d need to see videotape of someone bend a spoon under controlled laboratory conditions, and then see a metallurgical analysis of the spoon, too. And even then I’d be wracking my brain to find a natural explanation before I resorted to a supernatural one.
Same kind of thing with the remote viewing – is the situation really controlled? I’d need to know that the experimenter couldn’t see the cards either, otherwise someone who is very sensitive to body language or pheromones or whatever could pick up subtle physical clues – maybe even subconsciously – to give them “the feeling” of what the right answer is. Ideally, the experiment should be run by some kind of computer-controlled robotics.
Having said that, however, I think there is still a lot of use for this kind of thing as a political tool. If we can demonstrate that this kind of thing is still going on, we can use it to totally discredit the administration with the fundamentalists, who will – as you noted – absolutely see this as the hand of Satan at work.
At this point I’m not above playing on the superstitions of part of the Republican party to drive additional wedges and cause their downfall that much faster.
I saw Frank Gaffney in an interview yesterday warning about the dangers of EMP (electromagnetic pulse) attack.
Would that be classified as supernatural technology or based in physics?
That’s conventional physics.
Note; even though Gaffney might be referencing a rational, real world phenomenon in this particular case, he is a completely crazy individual and I’d be willing to bet that in whatever context he brought this subject up, his position on it was rooted in some form of connitive insanity.
I’ll bet you meant to type “cognitive insanity”. Right?
But I like yours better.
“Connitive insanity.”
The con game of the insane.
D’ya think God made you type that?
They say God resides in the details.
Miles Davis and many others taught us that he resides in the “mistakes” too.
“If you’re not making mistakes, you’re not trying hard enough.”
Said to me by a great musician one day long ago and far away.
Yup.
AG
The idea of a “divine typo” is intriguing. Imagine what the evangelical fascists could do with this if they applied the concept when transcribing the bible for their followers.
(Their interpretive duplicity is already bad enough; imagine the horrors they’d wreak upon the earth if they employed the “divine typo” meme as a deliberate tactic.)
“divine typos” – I think those are called mutations, LOL.
Oh yeah – God don’t make mistakes.
Then GWB is one hell of a practical joke.
You’ve made your point, Big Guy.
You can stop tickling us now.
Right. I agree with both in that EMP is based in laws of physics and Gaffney is a crazed individual.
I’m trying to relate these complicated principles to my simple everyman range of reasoning.
In it’s simple form, the manipulation of electrons produces the ability to alter matter. Heat is one energy used to achieve that. I believe the human mind is a basic system of electrical energy that is incorporated into a ‘soul’ that can survive with or without a physical body.
The electrical energy or impulses generated by the brain/mind is capable of manipulating electrons or influencing matter apart from it’s location.
If electrical energy can be transmitted through the air wirelessly and manipulate electrons in remote matter, why would the human mind/brain not be capable of doing the same thing, based in physics?
The EMP is not a great example but I used it for the comparison of electrical energy influence based in physical principles.
I think it’s the “magnetic field” part of the thing that makes it a bit more involved than manipulating matter through electrical power. Even Nikola Tesla, the true founder of the modern electrical world, hadn’t perfected his methods of transmittiming meaningful amounts of electricity from one place to another without wires. He was working on it, and had theories which might have evolved had he lived longer, but it just didn’t happen back then.
As of right now, “mind over matter” work seems to be organized around generating a (Frequency?/signal?) of some sort that will resonate with and alter an exisiting electromagnetic field equilibrium in a remote object, which manipulation would cause that object’s “matter” to reorient itself.
Movement in this field also occurs as more understanding is achieved in the realm of conventional and quantum physics with respect to the transmutation of elements from one form to another. What was once understood and practised as alchemy is beginning to have an empirical life within an observable scientific arena.
I won’t be saving up all my lead in the hopes I’ll be able to turn it all into gold one day soon before I ie, but I firmly believe that such a thing, along with many other seemingly fantastic mystical posibilities will one day be realized.
Many of the basic tenets of what we laughingly call “physics” today were considered supernatural as little as…oh. two or three days ago if you go the the right neighborhoods in many red states.
Hell, man…there is a very strong minority trying to ban the teaching of evolution in public schools of America that probably holds as much as a third of the elected officials in Washington under its electoral thumb.
We are simultaneously living in WAY different time zones here on this good green earth. There are ritual murderers in power in some tribal societies while simultaneously other parts of OTHER societies are reading Noam Chomsky and electing truly good-hearted men like Jimmy Carter (however briefly) to positions of real power.
The Lord works in strange and wonderful ways even if he DOESN’T exist.
Dig it.
AG
When you say “…ritual murderers in power in some tribal societies…” are you referring to Cheney, Perle, Wolfowitz, et.al. and the “cult of the Neocons”?
be done with an ordinary spoon by distressing the metal first. This has been demonstrated by James Randi and other debunkers of “psychic powers”. It’s interesting that even when shown a demonstration of the way spoon-bending is actually done, the true believers continue to believe and they reject what their eyes have seen.
Yeah…
Well…
My broader point here is not whether this stuff is “real”, total fakery, or some REALLY scary place in between. (Like the people who are into it only THINK that they are faking.)
Bottom line…it’s being done.
Col. Lang is not the only one saying this.
And MANY people smell a whiff of real decay coming out of it.,
Spend some time at Rigorous Intuition some time. Browse the archives. There are serious people saying serious things about the nexus of what is popularly called Satanism, the occult in general, pedophilia, sexual magic (sexual misconduct, at best), ritual murder, and the pursuit of power in the United States and Europe.
As far as the “reality” of these thing is concerned…
There used to be a saying…originally a song sung by Sophie Tucker with the Ted Lewis Band in the late ’20s, I believe, although the original saying might predate the song (Which is a pean to freedom of lifestyle, by the way)…in the United States about how “50 million Frenchmen can’t be wrong.”
Well, how many human beings have lived on the earth since the beginning of recorded history? Since the first evidence of some sort of intelligence from our most remote (as far as we know, anyway) ancestors?
Trillions, no doubt. I mean…we have six billion now, and although we have been multiplying at a much faster rate over the past 100 years or so, we have been here for millions of years. Say trillions, just for the sake of argument. (Anyone with access to figures that they think are correct on this point, feel free to lay them on me. I can’t find the info on google because I can’t seem to come up with the right search parameters.)
And during all of that time…how many societies were NOT based on some sort of God consciousness?
What? Maybe 3? All within the last 100 years or so?
So…maybe trillions of human beings can’t be wrong, either.
As Shakespeare so eloquently pinned it:
HORATIO: O day and night, but this is wondrous strange!
HAMLET: And therefore as a stranger give it welcome.
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
Shakespeare-Hamlet, Act I, scene V
Yup.
Check it out.
If there IS in fact a “greater good”, than that fact presupposes the existence of a greater evil.
And there we go, roiling off into the future riding the karmic pinwheel known as good and evil for all it’s worth.
AND…it is worth EVERYTHING.
Just as it always was.
Bet on it.
AG
P.S. From the song “Fifty Million Frenchmen Can’t Be Wrong.””.
And if they come above the knee
Fifty million Frenchmen can’t be wrong.
And if they give the world a new design
To prove a lady has a spine
Fifty million Frenchmen can’t be wrong.
They shorten them here,
They shorten them there,
And if her name is Teddy, they make Teddy bare.
If they prefer to see their women dressed
With more or less of less and less,
Fifty million Frenchmen can’t be wrong.
When they put on a show, and it’s a hit
No one tries to censor it
Fifty million Frenchmen can’t be wrong.
And when a book is selling at it’s best
It isn’t stopped; it’s not suppressed.
Fifty million Frenchmen can’t be wrong.
Whenever they’re dry
For brandy or rye,
To get it, they don’t gave to give up their right eye.
And when we brag about our liberty
And they laugh at you and you and you and me
Fifty million Frenchmen can’t be wrong.
Hmmm…sound familiar?
No WONDER BushCo hates France so.
I would like to do a little spoon bending session with! What an opportunity to fuck up the fuck ups!
remote viewing. I have walked on fire. What the hell you guys, someone said that it could be done and you know I’m gonna sign up for it just to see if it is so. It uses the same body energy that karate does and they showed me how to do it and I did it and it ain’t no big deal. Any adult can do it if properly prepared to get into that karate frame of mind, but they did say that children usually can’t so don’t even think it would be fun to try with them. People did drive by and scream Satan worshippers at us and I did start laughing. I don’t know Arthur if freaky creeps are over taking us and playing with our minds. If you get bored though firewalking can be invigorating!
with the condition of the coals than the condition of one’s mind.
Well sonofa, it was still fun damnit! And it still riled up the locals who still screamed Satan worshipper at me! Hell, I’d do again just for that alone!
I’ll bet that was a fun experience. Maybe the doubters are saying the power of the mind is insufficient to overcome matter. You can’t do that with socks on, can you?
You may be throwing the baby out with the bathwater there, Ed J.
Let’s say we all go to a fire walking ceremony in which there are two presentations. In one, a speaker says whatever it was that Tracy heard when she went, possibly mind-over-matter exhortations. Then a panel of scientists gets up and gives a power point presentation that conclusively demonstrates that a person is extremely unlikely to get burned by the coals, due to such things as fire temperature, coal placement, amount of time the average foot rests on a coal, etc. After that presentation, nearly everybody in the audience is convinced they cannot be harmed by walking across the coals.
But now we each still have to face the bed of coals. And no matter what the panel of scientists has just told us, our eyes look at those coals and our minds scream: HOTBURNHOTBURNHOTBURN!!! We still have to overcome the fear in our minds in order to walk over the matter.
Seems like no small achievement to me, and a worthwhile one, at that, regardless of the science. IMO, the whole point of such exercises is the overcoming of fears that exist only in our minds, and the result of such exercises is real.
I have a very good friend who was involved with this stuff back at the beginning when it was still known under the name Scanate.
He insists that despite claims these programs were brought to an end in the mid ’90s that in fact they just moved them to a deeper level within the “black budget” and reconstituted their efforts in different facilities. He says the programs are ongoing even now.
Oh, I am sure that this is true.
They don’t call ’em “spooks” for NUTHIN’…
The REAL question is…are they just residing somewhere out on the edge, or are they accruing real power?
With a subquestion.
Out on the edge or right in the middle of things…have some or all of them, as is commonly expressed in popular culture these days, “gone over to the dark side?”
The dark side DOES exist, y’know. Witness the experiences of any group of working class urban people, some of whom become cops and others of whom become criminals.
Same mechanism at work.
As above, so below.
AG
If they have gone over to the dark side, there are bound to be fundamentalists among them who would stop at nothing, and excuse everything, in name of their dark gods, and a god doesn’t have to actually exist in order to cause trouble.
The thing that always gets me all along the scale is that it’s all, essentially, about the manipulation of matter. Matter–temporal, decaying, dying, illusionary, matter. Big whoop. Ultimately, what a waste of “time.”
There are those…and on my darkest days, I find myself considering this idea quite seriously…who say that we have been literally invaded by forces about which we know next to nothing; that they have taken over the government of the most powerful nation in the world and are in the process of either totally subjugating humanity or simply getting rid of us in a manner that will leave the other natural resources of the planet in some sort or working order.
I know…it’s a cheap science fiction theme.
It couldn’t POSSIBLY be true.
Why…that’s RIDICULOUS!!!
And much of what I contain within me says the same thing.
But…what or who programmed what I reflexively think?
And another, quite rational part of me answers “If it quacks like a duck…it IS a duck.”
Is there ANY other, better explanation for the ongoing actions of the people who supported and then offed Nixon, those who surrounded and propped up the figurehead Reagan and remain in power to this day?
LOOK AT THE CAREERS OF CHENEY AND RUMSFELD!!!
Just LOOK.
They have never taken a step in their lives (in or out of official power) that did not have seriously negative consequences for the vast majority of the human population of the earth.
NEVER.
Can that kind of record possibly be a MISTAKE!!!???
I think not.
SHHHH…!!!
Listen carefully.
Can’t you hear the ducks a’quackin’?
I can, when it’s REAL quiet inside of my head.
I can…
But…”Naaaaahhhh…that’s IMPOSSIBLE.”
And there we are, right back to our regularly scheduled program.
(And I DO mean “program”. Or is it “pogrom”? “Oh well…what’s on tonight, Mabel? The news? Oh, GOOD!!!”)
Station WTFU once again signing off.
Gotta go to work.
Wake the fuck up.
NEWSTRIKE!!!
AG
I read RI, too. 🙂
The thing is, what thing could take us over that could possibly be more awful than our own egos? I admit that my way of looking at the world. . .or worlds. . .is that the only force that “matters,” ultimately, is the one within. That’s the one that can either take me through human dictatorship to flood to famine to satanism to extraterres. insect invasions with peace of mind, or not. I do a great job sometimes of creating my own hell on earth without any outside help.
And no, I don’t see why your darkest dreams can’t also be true.
The thing is, what thing could take us over that could possibly be more awful than our own egos?
The sum of the collective worst traits in regard to disrespect to life other than one’s own.
One theory holds that a collection of families have concentrated their power through the years and this select purity of bloodline is far superior to the rest of us commoners. Part of that holds the principle that higher planes of enlightenment are achievable with an ultimate goal of unison with the universe and relative immortality.
I’d get bored if I were immortal, I just know I would.
Not if you had other rumi’s for company. 🙂
They do seem to find each other in one realm or another. Another one of those inexplicable magnetic forces.
😉
That occult stuff is too much machine for me but I’m fascinated with how it might work.
Perhaps you remember the sci-fi film “Forbidden Planet”. The planet’s core was a huge machine that amongst other things, helped magnify and make manifest creatures representing the impulses of the id, (the unconscience).
Primordial energies I suspect are even more unnerving that those of the ego.
I think we had a convergence of powers that each were pursuing different goals. If the dark side got them, it was for various reasons and purposes. Fundamentalists who betrayed their faith to achieve their determined materialistic goals might still be unaware of their betrayals.
The ones who are committed to the dark side have been there all along. Are you familiar with Anton Lavay?(sp)
Those forces are all based on energy and power. Their existence is to seek power through learning how to acquire more power to grow stronger. From what I’ve read those that continued oursuing it were not doing so for the greater good.
If the classic good v evil struggle is everpresent, a close look at the past 5 years, at least, would be interesting. Look at each major failure in policy decision as a crossroad chosen individuals had been somehow guided to. Look at it as a flowchart of what-ifs where lives are in the balance.
For instance, say GWB and the Fundies are right in that GWB was divinely chosen to be president in 2000. He had chances to deter the 9/11 tragedy but failed to act. Each individual along the way in the system could have altered history by changing their actions. In other words, more people had to do wrong than right for 9/11 to occur and most involved were likely faced with definitive conflicts of conscience that were individual crossroads.
Take it after 9/11. The world was behind us. It was an historical opportunity to unite the world and the tragedy would have been a tremendous change in history, but for the good. Bush took the wrong road. Jay Garner…..Iraq is manageable and then change to Bremer and chaos begins in the sequence of obvious wrong decisions. Who was the main influence behind all of this…not GWB…Cheney has been the other voice.
Each tragedy has been manmade by poor choices but each one landed folks at another crossroad that provided a measure of atonement or redemption. Sadly, it’s been all wrong turns.
The dynamics of these disciplines are organized around the ancient laws of “cause and effect” , not “good and evil”.
“Good and evil” represents a scale with which results are seen and measured based on how the talents were used, and whether the outcome was the desired one.
Yet just as it’s usually destructive to, say, try to kill flies on the window with a sledghammer, so too many of these techniques only bring diaster when used in an inappropriate fashion or when used to bring about a result other than the one for which they are specifically designed. This is the nature of dark force.
That was my understanding also but I tried to use the good v evil examples as a possibility.I believe it might have been mentioned first by the diarist. Actually, the g v e was my natural thought to explain things until enough reading presented other principles more compelling.
Would these be the same that might be involved in suicide pacts that are results of doctrine?
Also, I think these folks strongly believe that what they’re doing is right- that the loss of innocent life is insignificant because it’s inferior/commoon
From early eugenics to current dna altering genetic therapy…but now they also own the patents for this.
I think the name Carlucci and his participation says a lot. I think Carlyle already owns us and the future.
The concepts of innocence or guilt never even enter in to the calculations of the people who are weaponizing these techniques for use against obstacles in their path.
All of their actions are self-legitimizing in their minds. In other words, whatever they might decide to do is automatically justified simply because it’s them doing it. Regard for anyone or anything else plays no roll whatsoever.
This is also the guiding rubric of the Bush regime; their delusion of infallibility overrules any propensity they might develop for considerning whether what they may be doing is either right or smart. They have long ago lost the capacity to care about such things.
That’s what I’ve seen in the apparent arrogance in dismissing any questioning of their actions.
Do you think that there is an overlap of influence and goals at work? The ones you spoke of last would be the strongest, most powerful and oldest group. They’ve moved seamlessly from govt to private industry and back, coming too from many different countries. This cabal is global in origin and interests.
The overlaps would come from the circles of Christian Fundamentalism, powers of Zionism, political ideologues and then ad hoc groups of business/political interests.
The CF group is pushing to fullfill Biblical prophecy which coincides with Zionist goals to some extent. Ashcroft was strong in this regard and abused his position as AG to force businesses to split or consolidate to take advantage of technology patents for his group’s future advancement. This also helped the pro-Israel forces in many ways. The overlap and benefit was extended to private equity groups like the Carlyle Group who own most of the current profitmakers but more importantly the future rights to development.
One of their next goals is controlling space as it was written in the PNAC…..crazyfcknnuts, isn’t it?
To the extent that one might describe the “group” actively engaged in using these esorteric techniques as tools or weapons with which to advance an agenda of their own, their organizing philosophy, such as it is, makes use of various religions and their extreme manifestations, as well as utilizing the greed and ambition of major players on the political and business stage, as pawns, as vehicles through which to advance their own agenda, an agenda which basically has to do with reordering the world and maintaining control of it once so re-ordered.
Even PNAC and the whole “cult of the Neocons” is really only one more tool, one more carrier through which they pursue their objectives.
It’s important to say that the objectives of these people are not always so completely rooted in the “dark side”, so to speak. In certain ways some of their motivations can be seen as good and some of their goals as lofty. The problem is that, as with all all-encompassing designs for domination and control, it’s inevitable that regardless of the original intentions, reckless and irresponsible abuses of power will slowly but surely grow to dominate the implementation of such overarching and ambitious plans. Or, in short, the more they seek to dominate and control, the less care will be taken to use the powers they wield wisely and the more devastation they will wreak. (Hence the old adage, “Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely”.) It’s the ambition that tricks them into believing themselves to be entitled and deserving of the power they seek, and once they start to believe this, the corruption is established, and whatever chances they might have once had to do good turn to shit.
Whether it’s the religious nts, the corporate looters, the neocon empire enthusiasts or the everyday dictatorial sadists serving as heads of state in various places around the world, all these people and groups carry the seeds of their own demise withing their crackpot yet vicious doctrines. Yet there are always others ready and willing to encourage these crazies and capitalize on the damage they do to advance their own ends. This is the arena in which these people, this other “group”, operates.
I may not have explained them as well but those are the same conclusions I reached. I’m still relatively new to all of this. I didn’t pay much attention until the runup to the Iraq war and my amateur research into the subjects kept bring up the same connections.
The ‘group’ as I refer to it is a collection of people scattered throughout influential positions and not concentrated together in one specific area. The ability to exploit others is crucial to their success. I understand and agree with what you said about that. On the matter of the ‘dark side’ and the perception of it, I would consider it that because the goals and methods are counterintuitive to benefitting humanity.
As you’ve said, even goals that begin as admirable lose that virtue when the ones in power take it upon themselves to make the decision of what is best for everyone.
I think my understanding of all this may be subtly different than yours, and I’ve been searching for a way to explain what I believe are important elements of all this that we may see differently. (It’s amazing sometimes how difficult it can be to translate one’s own perspectives into words.)
I want to make what I believe is an important distinction between this “group” that we are so obliquely referring to and to all those other groups, (PNAC and the lesser Neocons, the evangelical fascists and the jihadis, the nationalized and corporate asset strippers and looters, and the ruthless political class that always puts their own ambition before the best interests of the people they purport to serve.
These lesser groups are generally headed by criminal sociopaths and their only ambition, their only goal, is always to acquire power over others. there’s never anything noble about these people, never a spiritual bone in their bodies, never a hint of genuine human compassion or true respect for their fellow man. Dobson or bin Laden, Cheney or Reagan, Wolfowitz or Pol Pot, Grover Norquist or Pinochet; these are all inhabitants of and operatives from the “dark side” we talk about. There’s really no ambiguity about this in my mind either with respect to their motives, their tactics, or the destination they are seeking. They are inimical to the basic essence of life.
The other “group”, the mysterious “group”, on the other hand, is in itself quite different. While I can’t speak authoritatively as to this groups specific objectives, I firmly believe that their motivation is firmly rooted in working for the best interests of mankind and that whatever shape their grand goals may take, that those goals involve the evolution of man towards enlightenment.
I also believe that the people in this “group” have considerable knowledge and awareness that allows them to perceive perhaps more clearly and precisely some of the inevitable realities we’ll be facing as a result of our civilizations following the courses they’re on now; things like global warming, the depletion of fossil fuels, the lagging alternative energy development, the rise of endemic poverty, the increasing violence that always accompanies societies engulfed in fear, etc. And, correctly or not, I believe these people operate with the sense that a general collapse of civilization as we know it is not that far off, and that the best that can be done is to plan for the rebuildng of the next civilization to follow. (Mind you I don’t necessarily subscribe to this notion myself, though I don’t rule it out).
Anyway, as to motivation, I believe this “group” that I’m referring to has the best intentions, has as it’s primary goal helping to guide a reconstitution of human society along different lines from what we have now, and is basically using whatever forces are at work right now to chart a path towards minimizing the overall destructiveness that will mark the transition, that wil mark the end of the old and the start of the new, so to speak.
But, and it’s a big but, here’s the rub. However well intentioned, however noble of spirit, however ancient and effective the knowledge might be that guides such people, the power is so great and the quest so huge that it’s inevitable that once worthy participants will fall prey to being led astray by their own internal desires, and this is where the “dark side” derives it’s power. It’s not the goals that lose their virtue, nor the methods that become corrupted; it’s that many people who start out pursuing those goals and using those methods that become corrupted by their own desire and ambition. They descend to the level of creatures like the neocons or the rabid evangelical hate mongers, believing themselves to be the embodiment of the power they wield and entitled to it, and this is when they go over to the dark side.
I had a very good teacher many many years ago who once explained to me that the job of a (spiritual) teacher was, once he imparted the knowledge and helped set the student’s feet upon the path, to then try to persuade that student to stray off the path, and in doing so strengthen that student’s awareness of the path and provide a valuable look at how easily it is to be led astray. In relation to this stuff here, Cheney, et.al. were never on such a path and so are not affected by these sorts of things. They remain firmly as minions of the “dark side” so to speak, and prominent minions at that, but still only minions.
The “group” we refer to; while it’s not clear yet, might be experiencing some trouble with some participants moving toward being vulnerable to “dark side” influence. If we begin to see evidence of any of these so-called “psychic” talents referred to in the diary being used as unprovoked acts of aggression then we’ll know there’s really big trouble at that level too.
We may each be talking about a different “group” in all this. I’m sure the neocons, for instance, have found common cause with other gangs of like minded sociopaths in other countries, and that there is an association of sorts that might be seens as a parent group of which the neocns are but one of several members. Similarly, the Carlyle Group gang, (no friend of the neocons, but no more wholesome than the neocons either), likewise is almost certainly allied with other like minded cabals of greedy creatures which couild also be seen in toto as a group, but the group I’m referring to is at another almost invisible level above these gangs of conscienceless sociopaths.
I’m amazed I wrote all this and I hope it make some sense. I rarely indulge in much metaphysically-oriented talk, but we’re at a critical time these days, and possibly more of this kind of thinking might become relevant. I’m hopeful you won’t write this off as tinfoil hat stuff.
It is very rare that anyone takes any actions that they do not believe are “good”.
Correct.
Reasonable.
Justifiable for the betterment of some segment of humanity, even if that segment is only what they consider to be their immediate circle of allies. Who are their allies because they are somehow “right” in their estimation. Better than all the others.
PNAC, neo-cons, street level gangsters, the general run of occultists, (be they Roman Catholic, Wiccan, Branch Davidian or any other sect, large or small), patriots, racists, culturalists, the Hatfields and the McCoys…the list is endless and eternal.
REAL evil? That’s when someone steps away from the entire system and ceases to try to justify his actions in any way except as methods to be used toward the pursuit of dominance.
And I am here to tell you…that move produces great power. Great freedom. That person can act with no censorship whatsoever. Kill, lie, steal? Sure. Why not. “Nothing is true; everything is permitted.” (Attributed by William Burroughs to Hassan I Sabbah, The Old Man of the Mountain, founder of the sect sometimes known as the Assassins. Maybe a fiction of Mr. Burroughs’ creation, maybe not. No less true either way.)
There are those who believe that at its root Adolf Hitler’s entire career was based on this kind of principle. Anton LeVay, Aleister Crowley, the group of people who were involved in something called the Babalon Working (Including L. Ron Hubbard, the founder of Scientology. Google this term for more than you want to know about the interfaces between occultism and the power structure.), Charles Manson, and others large and small right on back into the mists of prehistory. Always secretive, always hunted and persecuted by the majority. Witches and satanists and pagans and unbelievers of all stripes. (And what is it in which they “do not believe” again? The commonly accepted truth. “Nothing is true; everything is permitted.” Powerful.) The list of names that has been attached to these efforts is endless.
But here is the interesting part.
One way or another ALL of these people end up “losing”. Crispy critters on the floor of some bunker, eye rolling crazy in a cell somewhere with a swastika carved on their forehead, broke and sick in a fifth floor walkup apartment, dangling from the end of a rope…as much power as this move creates, there seems to be something else that is just a little bit stronger.
And here we have a précis of the entire history of the evolution of mankind. Those who correctly perceive that the greater good always prevails in the end (“The meek shall inherit the earth.” “Do unto others as you would have done unto yourself.”) versus those who do not.
Interesting.
Morality as a survival principle.
Nothing more, nothing less.
Are there forces greater than us?
Just look at the sky to know the truth of THAT statement. One random good sized asteroid and we are history. One Katrina level storm in the wrong place at the wrong time, one shift of the earth’s crust, and millions die.
Are they “conscious”, these forces?
I don’t know. It depends upon your definition of the word.
Is Pamela Anderson conscious?
George W. Bush?
Is a tree?
A planet?
A sun?
Can they be summoned in some way?
No?
What are all those churches and mosques and temples about, then?
If you can summon a cute little rabbit or a useful working dog, then why can you not summon a poisonous snake or a disease bearing insect?
As above, so below.
If you can somehow summon or appeal to a greater God and His saints and angels, why not a Satan and his vengeful spirits?
And so it goes.
On and on and on and on and on…
The wheel of karma.
Stay tuned.
It’s going to get even MORE interesting this time around.
Bet on it.
(It ALWAYS gets interesting when it is your ass on the line. And with the spread of WMDs…all of our asses are on the line now.)
Have fun…
AG
The very DEFINITION of evil.
AG
My understanding is that people involved with these programs are deployed and that they have specific agenda.
This is turning into an interesting discussion, and I would hate to see it slip off into oblivion. It’s on the recommended list now….let’s see if we can keep it up until every weekend warrior who is out holiday shopping or just living some sort of normal life gets a chance to think about it.
Through the weekend, maybe.
Thanks…
AG
P.S. Posted above, too. Just in case some of us are scrolling down past what we have already read.
I think these bozos are like children sticking metal forks into electrical outlets. Someone needs to take the forks away, slap their hands, and say “NO!” in a firm voice.
Hard to do when they are surrounded by 1000 layers of REALLY bad weapons.
AG
weapon in an electrical outlet. That’s what my kids would have done if I couldn’t get to them to take it away…and they would be laughing in my face the whole time they did it too. It sounds exactly like W too now that I think about it.
People who might stick some weapon in an electrical outlet might think like this guy:
Preemptive war against evil
27ap05, Fred Hutchison
… which is the writer ranting against people questioning if it was right to go to war in Iraq. From the writer’s PoV, Saddam was a “cosmic evil” and it’s the anti-war people who are being naieve.
I reads as if the author is writing from the middle of a horror movie, trying to convince his sister that vampires really exist and Aunt May has been Turned, and sister cluelessly laughs (sound cue: ominous music) and says “stop being silly”.
Does anyone on this list have OBEs?
I haven’t, myself but others here may have. Feel free to add any experience if you like.
I recommended this diary earlier tonight, and it immediately got to the Recommended list! I always like to think that I have extra, secret mojo when it comes to that!
I’ve been hoping to get an opportunity to post my side of this. This comment is perfect.
One of the reasons that I’m quite religious (Catholic), in addition to being a hardboiled advocate of science and strong evidence (amateur scientist, lawyer) is that I’ve had many personal experiences that are identical to reports of some of the most far-out mystics and psychics.
With regard to OBEs (out of body experiences), everybody should read some of the books of Robert Monroe, of Richmond, Virginia, who is the best authority in this area. There is a Monroe Institute in the Shenandoah Valley that continues to do really remarkable work.
I had one clear OBE, at about age 17. I was sleeping and needed to get up to go to the bathroom. I got up out of the bed, walked a few feet to the door, and reached down to turn the door knob. I couldn’t seem to feel it after a strangely long pause, and I looked down–AND MY ARM WAS REACHING THROUGH THE DOOR, half on one side, half on the other. In sudden terror, I turned to the left–AND COULD SEE MYSELF LYING IN THE BED SLEEPING. I panicked and immediately found myself trapped in my body, unable to move and short of breath, a classic “sleep paralysis” episode (which is thought to explain most of the so-called alien abduction reports). When you’re paralyzed and short of breath and terrified, every second is very long. But I would guess it was 30 seconds before I could move.
Yeah, I know, how can I prove it wasn’t just a dream? My answer is decades of observing dreams, and knowing that this one was totally different. At the Monroe Institute in Virginia, they can train people to reproduce experiences like that. I’ve often pondered that, but to tell the truth, I’m too afraid to push it. At my current age and health, I’m really afraid that moving the soul out away from the body like that might be permanent.
What is the story of the person who posted this comment?
As for remote viewing, I’ve also experienced that. It really works. The world is a complex hologram in multiple dimensions, not at all like the Newtonian space/time we’re taught in school. But, alas, it works in fragmentary ways that are easy to joke about, because the human brain isn’t really wired for this (and arguably because the spiritual powers aren’t happy about humans doing this). If you yahoo “remote viewing,” there are some interesting testimonies available; but I doubt this will ever be a dominant method for real-world applications of power and influence.
Well, I hope posts like this don’t totally destroy my credibility. I must say, however, that I’m always amazed at how quick people who’ve never experienced this kind of stuff are to call the others liars or fools.
This should not destroy your credibility.
Anyone who has ever had a connection with someone else that resulted in the phone ringing just as you think of them or certain “coincidences” of that sort happening over and over again should know the truth of the matter.
Once again…William Shakespeare. (Who is believed in some circles to have been in contact with Middle Eastern schools of thought sometimes referred to as “Sufism”.)
HORATIO: O day and night, but this is wondrous strange!
HAMLET: And therefore as a stranger give it welcome.
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
Hamlet, Act I, scene V
Later…
AG
I’ve was once a complete cynic about all of this. Now I have to chuckle at the belief I once held that what can be seen, measured,and “proven” (in this physical dimension) is all there is. Human intuition is just one more human potential that can be highly developed with time and practice, and like any other human skill, it be can be badly misused.
The whole paranormal area is a magnet for wierdos and fakes and they are everywhere. I’ve made it part of my business for the past 20 years to learn what I can from first hand hobnobbing with many who claim abilities like the above. As far as bending forks go, I became a believer when I was allowed to provide the heavy stainless steel fork from my own kitchen that I couldn’t bend even with tools.
In terms of things like channeling or what some call ‘inspired writing”, or OBE’s, or medatative trances, or the ability to communicate with the dead, again, as a cynical psychiatric RN, I once viewed all these things as psychiatric symptoms and as proof of delusional thinking, which it certainly is some cases.
But once I became willing to slowly “suspend my disbelief” enough to really research this, and expose myself to ethical people who have legitimately developed thier abilities in these areas, as well as learning how to develope my own intuitive abilities, I no longer doubt whether these things are indeed possible.
This is one big mother of a Universe, and who can even prove it’s the only one? Really, when you think about it, for us to think we are the only entities with consciouseness and intelligence,and that what we know is all there is to know… is so far beyond ignorant arrogance that it boggles this tiny little mind of mine.
First hand experience is the best. Have you read carlos casteneda?
I’m too afraid to push it. At my current age and health, I’m really afraid that moving the soul out away from the body like that might be permanent.
It sounds funny but I know the feeling about taking that risk or would know if I could know.
Anyway, was your experience with RV conducted under a specific process with plans or were they more like wanderings that occurred spontaneously? Did you have an awareness of exactly where you were or was it a vague feeling of location with precise awareness of details?
My experiences started like this….why don’t you start a diary? I’ll post some experiences.
Good idea. I’ll do that a little later on today.
Thanks.
and government contracts for this research: absolutely true. I worked at SRI in the late 70s, where studies were done. You can x-check with articles in the (I’m not kiddin’!) Nt’l Inquirer, which would send reporters to SRI to interview Targ et al. The gov’t is always ready to fund anything that will give it a competitive military edge — whether that means teaching dolphins to plant mines, or paying guys who can bend flatware with their mental powers. My question: what if the terrorists living in caves don’t use forks?
I moved your comment back out to the left for a reply. I kept the entirety for context. I appreciate all that you shared here. My goal is to bring this discussion to others so that they might discard their tinfoil. I found my understanding of it by having the chance to read similar online discussions in addition to my own research and experiences.
I think you’ve taken the discussion to a higher level. I’m still forming my opinions at that point and actually they constantly evolve with each new discovery.
I think there is both a ‘parent group’ or unrecognized universal family that these other groups fall into. If we consider this awareness as a gift of enlightenment that is sought or discovered and utilized, then the goals might be judged by intent. To me, that judgement would be by the difference of benefit to self or benefit to others. If many innocent people are allowed to suffer acts of inhumanity to benefit a few in the short term or long term, then that inaction is not justifiable.
Let me try this analogy. I don’t blanketly condemn all intelligence agencies because of the actions of a few or the actions as a whole. I don’t think any goals achieved based at least in part by deception are going to be completely honorable. I’ve seen the rationalization of ‘long term success’ or ‘temporary need’ to support the wrong people and causes but I don’t believe it’s right. Members of this ‘group’ are interspersed in this field, as well as many other occupations, but I feel they don’t all share the same use of their enlightenment. A smaller subgroup has worked together for decades and also by previous generations in tight circles of friends and families. It may be that some of them had honorable intentions but a lack of vision allowed them to lose sight of that path. That path can be regained at any time by changing direction and it could be the case more than once. Some though, seem to have attempted to forge a new path in using this enlightenment that benefits only their own small group.
What does this mean to average people like me? Those of us who have experiences of one kind or another that opens a door of understanding that this enlightenment is actually universal. It would be a tremendous threat to those who view that ‘gift of enlightenment’ as a capitalistic commodity that only has value when possessd by few. Their best pre-emptive attack is to dismiss claims of knowledge or existence…conspiracy…tinfoil..insanity…control by religion…
I have made the exact statement several times in looking at the sky. How can one see the sky and by that one vision not believe or consider a Supreme Being or creator(s? From there though, the divergence is also infinite.
Am I the only average person who feels to have been called or drawn to this information that explains so many extraordinary experiences in life that are inherently understood by some undefined intuition?
Rumi asks: “Am I the only average person who feels to have been called or drawn to this information that explains so many extraordinary experiences”
Absolutely, positively not. We’re all over the place, but often a bit hesitant to speak about these things in public, given the all too commmon reaction of many people (like the one I used to be when I was running around with my “Bible” ( the DSMIV) at the ready. 🙂
Thanks for the comments above. These first person accounts are crucial to put it all in perspective.
I was wondering if your career experience raised other questions after you were more aware of other possibilities. I won’t put you on the spot for answers, but in general, did you look at symptoms such as voices, paranoia, hallucinations, reality perception or other as having a basis besides illness? Also, what’s your experience with people diagnosed with a disorder also having a more acute awareness or other advanced perception? Sort of the line between genius and insanity.
It has raised SO many questions that I know I could not, and would not, do the work I once did, as I was trained to do it. (retired now, thank goodness!) In fact, I’ve had some difficulty with what I did do, all those years, in the name of “good psychiatric nursing”. It called for me to belieive that I had right and the knoweldge to evaluate and judge other peoples sanity by mere observation of behaviors, all of which were classified as normal or abnormal by others who wrote the rules for ‘normal”.
I came to see that the DSM (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual) could be interpreted to label almost almost any human behavior pathological, if the person diagnosing chose to see it that way. I came to understand the frightening power of my own pen, as I charted my descriptions of observed behaviors, based, of course on my narrow training of what was considered normal. I wonder now, how much influence big Pharm has on the compilation of that volume.
Of course here are genuine, incapaciting mental illnesses that need treatment, but overall, I’d estimate at least 40% of the folks I’ve cared for un state hospitals and facilities housing the “chronically mentally ill,” were not genuinely mentally ill. An astounding number are elderly women, diagnosed and locked up at young ages, who have now become institutiomnalised.
From where I am now, i think most of that 40% were simply “different”. Many were highly creative, eccentric types who simply marched to a much different drummer than the rest of society. Many had been badly traumatized at young ages, but did not receive the kind of help that would have allowed them to heal.More than you want to know about are medicated right out of thier own identities, in order to modify behaviors considered “abormal” by those who claim to know what ‘normal is”.
As a writer and poet, when on a roll, I am often preoccupied amd “unavailable” to respond to others as they’d like me to. I lose many hours that way, and even miss appointments or forget to eat or do my laundry. I am easily distracted by the whirl of words rushing around in my head, and when trying to find the right phrase, I often talk out loud to myself. That could earn me several different diagnoses.
Yes, I’ve seen a very high level of sensitiivity and enhanced awareness in my work with the mentally ill. It is indeed a fine line, a very, very fine line.
Bottom line for me is that more I learn, the lesss qualified I feel to sit in judgement of anyone elses internal processes and the more I can appreciate the “differences” in people. I would intervene only in the event a person was of causing serious harm to themselves or to others. I’d probably be fired before my first day was done, if I went back to psych nursing now!
Well, now…there’s enlightenment and then there is enlightenment.
Or…sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, but other times it is neither.
There are those who claim that ALL manifestations of what we laughingly call “the occult” are just further dreams of the sleeping man. That those who experience and/or pursue them are merely dreaming a slightly different dream from the rest of us. Sleeping on the almost universal bed of Life in a slightly different position. Maybe even sleepwalking a little. That the whole game is a fantasy.
Worth considering, if you really wish to delve into these sorts of things.
A Zen saying:
During Zen, everything is confused.
After Zen, a tree is once again a tree. Only different.
Those who are involved in parapsychological power politics…bending spoons, remote viewing, summoning dybbuks and God only cares WHAT else…are still in the “During Zen” stage, even if they do not practice Zen or any other spiritual discipline.
AFTER Zen, one would only bend a spoon if it were needed to help fit yet another camel though yet another keyhole, and remotely viewing the results of another person’s dreamworld would be a waste of good practice time.
On a larger view, these people about whom we are talking are still low level minor leaguers with delusions of grandeur. Batting .280 in D Class ball when in the REAL big leagues…baseball players call it The Big Show …they do not even use a bat.
Now these fools may take us all down with them on this level…although my own belief in and observation of evolution at work on this planet suggests to me that they will not…but it matters not to the Milky Way.
And today is a good day to die.
Keep the faith.
It’s really all you’ve got.
AG
I think that someday our “science” will catch up with all of this phenomena and have an explanation for it. Of course, our science will need to evolve a lot between now and then. The little I know about quantum physics indicates that they are getting closer. A long time ago I read a book “The Dancing Wuli Masters” that indicated a convergence of quantum physics and eastern spirituality. And has anyone here seen the movie “What the Bleep Do We Know?” Its kind of a cult favorite in my circle of friends.
And finally, I’ve always said that no science that I know of has tried yet to explain a phenomenon that ALL women know to be true. That is (warning men, this might make you uncomfortabel) any women who spend a lot of time together find their menstral cycles to be in sinc with each other. Now, how does that happen!!?
Just a few of my random thoughts.
How does that happen?
Blood and Iron.
A certain kind of magnetism.
Bet on it.
AG
Actually, scientists believe this is caused by pheromones – chemicals that we emit and smell at trace levels but don’t consciously register; they work on a lower level of our brains. A great many animal species use pheromones – for instance to attract mates, mark territory, find their way upstream from the sea, etc. – so it actually would be more surprising if humans DIDN’T have some pheromones that we respond to.
The Monnell Chemical Senses Center in Philly near the U of P campus is one of the major research centers in the world for this kind of thing. If you ever have a chance to go there, you’ll know the place because there’s a sculpture of a giant nose and mouth out front at 35th and Market, called “face fragment.” (Good for tacky touristy photo opportunities)
The interesting question here is what evolutionary advantage does this serve? If all the women have their periods together, they are also fertile at roughly the same time.
Or is it some kind of accidental side effect of picking up on each other’s signals, the same way that people hearing a crowd around them clapping at random tempos will sometimes fall into synchronized clapping (this seems especially common in European audiences)?
I’ve read reports that in some old cultures, women from a village would all menstruate together (in sinc with lunar stages) and gather in one place during the duration to do so. This is the basis for the title of the book “The Red Tent.” Of course its probably mostly speculation, but there are also some who think that this would be a time for women to be most in touch with their bodies, each other and the natural world – so it was a time of great wisdom. Kinda different from all of our struggles with medicalizing menstruation and the prevalence of symptomatic reactions, ala PMS.
Thanks for this. I hadn’t heard about this research before, but have always thought that there was some communication between women’s bodies that had not, as yet, been detected by science or noticed by our senses.
Yeah but…
Who’s to say that if there were indeed Iron biochemists…the equivalent of biochemists on the molecular and atomic level of iron… they would not recognize magnetism as something akin to how pheronomes work on our level. If indeed they could even imagine such a level.
Maybe iron has something like a a “sense of smell” as well.
As above, so below…
AG