I was bummed that I missed this on Friday. Thankfully, AmberJane recorded it, and made it available as a podcast, which can be seen here.
Since I endured Fox News, including Gibson and his blond Ken-doll hair and obnoxious stereotyping (starting off by framing Friday’s “Blue on Blue” debate as “moderate Democrat versus angry left”) long enough to transcribe it, it seems only right to crosspost this transcript. That way my own “suffering and sacrifice” can benefit the largest number of people. 😉
John “War on Christmas” Gibson: For our “Blue on Blue” debate today, moderate Democrat versus angry left–Fox’s political analyst and Democratic strategist Bob Beckel and Maryscott O’Connor, a blogger from MyLeftwing.com. So Maryscott, let me ask you first, one of the things I read from the left is that people on your side of things really don’t like Hillary Clinton, John Kerry seems to have shifted a little leftwards, and Al Gore was already there. What’s wrong with Hillary?
Maryscott O’Connor: She’s too much of a centrist.
John Gibson: Meaning what?
Maryscott O’Connor: …and she voted for the war. She’s a pro-war Democrat.
John Gibson: And she has not backed off that position?
Maryscott O’Connor: I haven’t seen her back off of it, have you?
John Gibson No, I haven’t. I take it though, that people in the blog world, and more on the left than Beckel, this is really sticking in their craw, and they’re not going to support her come presidential talk in ’08.
Maryscott O’Connor: She’s not my first, second, or third choice, let’s put it that way. (Smile)
Johh Gibson (laughing) All right, Beckel, did you think John Kerry in his latest statements has gone farther to the left than he has been, am I perceiving this correctly?
Bob Beckel Well, first of all, what you’re perceiving incorrectly is that I’m a centrist Democrat. I’ve been proud to be a liberal my entire life! I started thirty years ago as a liberal, in the civil rights movement, and so I don’t–that’s your characterization. Now maybe–
Johh Gibson –but, Beckel, one’s position on the spectrum depends on who’s to your left. I perceive, and I could be wrong, that Maryscott is quite a bit left of you as of this moment.
Bob Beckel As of this moment. And let me just say this. If there’s one authority we want to go to on Democratic liberal politics, it’s you on this, (Maryscott laughs) and I’m glad you’re asking the questions. But look, I remember back when I first started out in 1974–73–in politics. I was outraged that Democrats were not trying to impeach Richard Nixon. This was at the beginning of Watergate. It took them 18 months before they finally got him. I couldn’t understand it–it drove me crazy. Now I can understand why–
Johh Gibson (interrupting) The circle is closed.
Bob Beckel –now wait a minute–I can understand why liberal blogs, and Maryscott feels very strongly about the war–so do I. But the truth is that this is not bad. It is not a bad thing that the tension is there, and I think the tension helps move some of these people from the dead center. There’s no such thing as a moderate! What’s a moderate? A moderate’s a waste of time!
Johh Gibson All right. Maryscott, let me put it this way. If the candidates you support were to win in September, and Democrats take over the House again, would I be correct in assuming you would want them and you could expect them to either censure or impeach George Bush?
Maryscott O’Connor: I would expect both parties to impeach George W. Bush, because it’s a question of honor and principle.
Gibson interrupts, asking if she means Republicans too.
Maryscott O’Connor: Yes, absolutely! The Republicans were behind the push against Nixon. I long for the days of the Republicans in Nixon’s era.
John Gibson So, Beckel, is this a good place for the Democrats to be?
Bob Beckel Let me try to–you know, you’re trying to get a fight between a couple of liberals here, maybe one farther to the left than I am. It’s going to be harder to do, John. Let me tell you something. If I woke up tomorrow morning and George Bush was impeached and out of office, it would be the second best day since my children were born. (Crosstalk)
John Gibson But, but, you think that’s a good thing to tell the American people you want to impeach him over NSA or something?
Bob Beckel Wait a second. Here’s where Maryscott and I disagree. I think it would be almost impossible to impeach George Bush. It would get us off a lot of messages that I think can attract a lot of voters for this November. What is important, I’ve learned over 30 years is, if you don’t have a majority, you don’t get bills passed. And, at some point, your ideology can get in the way of winning–
John Gibson –all right, before we run out of time, Maryscott, does that sound like wisdom to you or not?
Maryscott O’Connor: It sounds like a strategist talking. This is about a principle. He broke the law. It shouldn’t be about whether it’s a “winning issue” or not. I think that Republicans and Democrats should be behind impeaching this man for breaking the law.
John Gibson All right, Maryscott O’Connor of MyLeftWing.com, and Bob Beckel, my MODERATE Democrat, even though he disavows it, I appreciate both of you. And, of course, the question of whether he broke the law is still a jump ball, but thanks to both of you.