To co-incide with the Yearly Kos Convention, Byron York of National Review Online wrote an “opposition research” piece on a prominent Daily Kos writer. The writer, having been “outed”… i.e. publication of his name, location, profession, law firm, and that firm’s client list, announced his decision to quit blogging.
The right celebrated, while a significant number on the left claimed that the writer had “outed himeself” by not being more careful. Added to this the writer had a long list of enemies and fair-weather friends, as they had in the past been insulted, down-rated, or banned by him. A lawyer on the left celebrated too “He’s an asshole who deserved to get burned.” Meanwhile, back at the convention the “outed” writer was being toasted and applauded at an occasion from which he was forced to withdraw.
Now all of this is pretty ugly, but another issue raised its weary head: There Is No Right To Anonymity or Privacy if One is an Internet Blogger The general consensus is that if one blogs on the internet and achieves a significant following sooner or later you will be “outed.”
Following this line, there have been several strong statements against writing anonymously on the Net or using pseudonyms at all. This argument says that one should have the courage of one’s convictions and be brave enough to sign one’s own name to commentary just like letters to the editor, as if not to disclose one’s identity is cowardice. But a poll here says that the reason posters do not use their real name is not fear of cyber-stalking nutjobs, or right-wing freeper blogs, but that one’s weblog writings might have negative impact on their professional life.
The controversy will die down, the writer will recover. As a result of what happened the progressive blogging community will have to change: either we will sign the Online Integrity Statement, or caution posters that they blog at their own risk.
What I find most discouraging about the whole matter is this: the attitude of surrender to lawlessness and acquiescense to lack of protection for privacy and fourth amendment rights.
ACCESS DOES NOT EQUAL ENTITLEMENT
- Your doctor, lawyer, and banker do not have the right to publish information about you.
- Why is it a federal crime for anyone to steal and read my letters through the U.S. Postal service?
- It is said that if I pay $110.00 I can find all the phone calls you made from your cell. Am I entitled to publish them?
People have argued that the law is outmoded because we are dealing with a relatively new communications medium. People have argued that the Internet is a lawless zone where no one is safe from being “outed.”
People are arguing for what is essentially electronic emminent domain, except there is no suggestion that individuals be compensated for what is their identity, publicity, and intellectual property…. they are willingly giving up the laws that protect privacy and civil rights through our Fourth Amendment to be secure in their homes and their persons and their papers that originated with the Magna Carta. These laws go back to the year 1215!!
There is a great body of law that protects individuals from having their personal information used against them. For instance intellectual property laws as regards to publicity. If I take what you, blogger, have written here and post it on a site where i have advertisements that generate revenue, and as a result of what you have written here i make money off you, your writing, your story, your person….. there’s a law that prohibits my doing that….
You and only you have rights to your publicity…. that’s your name, your face, your details and your work. I cannot use your publicity for my gain.
THE CONSTITUTION, AGAIN
“the Fifth Amendment reflects the Constitution’s concern for . . . the right of each individual `to a private enclave where he may lead a private life”‘
That private enclave is here.
The rights enshrined in the U.S. Bill of Rights are considered so fundamental, nearly sacred, that they were spelled out as protections to citizens from encroachment by the federal government. State constitutions likewise protected the rights of citizens from encroachment by state government.
The rights enumerated in the U.S. Bill of Rights are connected by the thread of “natural rights” to Roman times. The concept of “natural rights” assumes that all humans are born with certain rights that cannot be transferred or taken away.
Some of these rights are specified in the Magna Carta in 1215 A.D., the English Bill of Rights in 1689, and the United States Declaration of Independence, Constitution, and Bill of Rights.
The Fourth Amendment provides:
- The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized
to quote an old-timer:
. . . The public does not realize that the crisis we face is a crisis of the rule of law, borne of the fact that the President of the United States has expressly arrogated unto himself the power to break the law, and is exercising that power on numerous fronts, not only with regard to eavesdropping. The reason they do not yet realize this is because this scandal has been depicted – by the media and, infuriatingly, even by Democrats – as being an eavesdropping scandal, not a law-breaking scandal. As a result, debate has centered over whether the government should be eavesdropping, not over whether the President has the power to break the law.
Former Daily Kos Blogger Before He Was Outed, “The Rule of Law;” Feb 28, 2006
Beyond our Constitution there is the Universal Declaration of Human Rights:
Article 12.
No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his privacy, family, home or correspondence, nor to attacks upon his honour and reputation. Everyone has the right to the protection of the law against such interference or attacks.
This Declaration is the basis of the Covenant to which the US is a signatory: International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights.
HAS ANYONE EVER HEARD OF THIS?
The Online Integrity Statement of Principles is simple:
- Private persons are entitled to respect for their privacy regardless of their activities online. This includes respect for the non-public nature of their personal contact information, the inviolability of their homes, and the safety of their families. No information which might lead others to invade these spaces should be posted. The separateness of private persons’ professional lives should also be respected as much as is reasonable.
- Public figures are entitled to respect for the non-public nature of their personal, non-professional contact information, and their privacy with regard to their homes and families. No information which might lead others to invade these spaces should be posted.
- Persons seeking anonymity or pseudonymity online should have their wishes in this regard respected as much as is reasonable. Exceptions include cases of criminal, misleading, or intentionally disruptive behavior.
- Violations of these principles should be met with a lack of positive publicity and traffic.
There’s plenty of law, just not enough lawyers.
What we need right here and now is a good lawyer who specializes in intellectual property, publicity, the internet, and the media. Someone who will go to bat for us on the issue of rights to privacy on the Net. Oh, yeah, we had one of them… looks like we just lost him.
- This diary was deleted along with all its comments by me late last night. No one told me to do it, and it’s unanimous that it was wrong to do it. I was wrong to delete, and I’m sorry for it.
I’m also sorry for what is going on here. As a community we’re better than this, and always have been.
The community has been on a bender of bashing. There’s a tone of nastiness, suspicion and conspiracy mindedness taking over in the on-going discussion. Maybe it’s from living too long in Bush’s cold war on terrorism. Maybe it’s open season. I really don’t know. I do know that I don’t want to take part in it.
What’s the solution?
I think the answer is communities who live according to, not rules, but by principles.
Now we see this all the time: “Don’t be a prick.” (Booman Tribune) “Do no evil”(Google)
Some individuals will always go outside the community principles, and some corporations will always go outside them.
The cost of these principles lies in suffering and sacrifice. And it seems to me our sense of justice is as strong as is our experience of suffering and sacrifice. The process to develop and maintain these principles is struggle. There’s no way around this. Life is a struggle.
When life is good, it’s seeking balance and equilibrium…..
The three prisoners who hanged themselves in Guantanamo…. well that’s about habeas corpus…. law that does, indeed go back to the year 1215. All law derives from the sanctity of life and the dignity of the human person.
There are two kinds of law: one that exists and is imposed on those who try to violate it, and another, the law to which one voluntarily promises to uphold. To be a signatory to the greatest laws of civilization, (like the Universal Declaration of Human Rights) or code of ethics like the Online Integrity Statement: to do it voluntarily and to abide by it is a greater thing, in my opinion, than to either feel restricted by the law that is imposed, or to find that the law is lacking. Law is created, based on the law before it.
And out of this voluntary law, like the Universal Declaration of Human Rights humanity and civilization progresses. Now that’s progressive
So I’m going to stop now. Anyone who wants to contact me, my email’s open. Best regards,
M.Suskind
Yes, suskind, you’re right. It would be morally reprehensible, if it wasn’t illegal, for someone such as a doctor or phone company, to publish information which a patient or customer supplied directly to them, in confidence.
No, suskind, there is nothing inherently wrong with agregating the information which someone has already released to the public, and re-publishing it by way of connecting the dots.
There is no comparison here. Go to google.com and type this in the search box:
Armando lawyer Puerto Rico dailykos
<I’m feeling lucky>
And the #1 search result is? …..
Armando Llorens Sar’s Profile on McConnell-Valdes Law Offices
This horse has been beaten to death. Hell, I don’t even track dkos or Armando very closely, and I would’ve been able to come up with those search terms off the top of my head.
Now, who wants to talk about tossing around one’s credentials as a lawyer and spouting off partisan legal opinions without disclosing that you’re in the pay of someone who’s position you’re claiming is, sadly, the only possible conclusion the courts could reach?
The ease of finding information has no bearing on whether it is right or wrong to publish information.
Good point, but I would disagree to the extent that it’s not as simple as black and white. It may be easy to find some information, but still inappropriate to publish it. It may be difficult to find other information, but appropriate to publish it. That is not my point, though. My point is that Armando is the one who published the information, and made it publicly available. His identity is not private. The google link is offered as evidence to that claim.
Well, it was meant to be, but it looks like the link got chewed up by the system.
http://mcconnellvaldes.lawoffice.com/CM/Attorneys/ArmandoLlorensSar.asp
(or do a 5 second google search yourself and you’ll find it 😉 )
Well, if you want to argue situational ethics, that’s your choice. However, it’s clear that a poster has asked that this information not be published and you’ve linked to it twice. Why is that? You say it’s to prove a point that it’s easy to find — a point no one is refuting.
If you have an argument, you can make it without repeating and spreading the damage we’re arguing about.
Actually, I was saying that I didn’t want to, as you put it, argue situational ethics. I was saying that the only relationship between the question of how easy it is to find some information and the ethics of whether to publish that information depends on other factors. I was saying this in response to the interpretation that my original post suggested “easy to find” means “okay to publish”. But that wasn’t my main point. My main point is that Armando ‘outed’ himself. Armando made public the information (e.g. his first name, occupation, and place of residence, not to mention his picture, which I hear he’s also posted at TPM, but I haven’t verified that) that connects him as a professional to him as a blogger. Nobody posted anything that wasn’t already public. And I have no problem with re-posting the top result of a google query. It’s public. Armando made it public. Nobody outed him. That’s my point. I’ll leave it at that…. If nobody’s refuting that, then the case is closed and suskind might as well delete this diary too, because the comparisons are simply not valid.
Again, you’re arguing that because it was so easy, because he left what to you are obvious clues, that that makes it ok. No, it doesn’t. Armando has made clear he does not want his blogging publicly linked to his work and his private life. Further, he has maintained that in real life, he will be hurt by this.
So, what is your position? That no bloggers should blog anonymously? That the person’s desires in the matter don’t count? Because no matter what the legalities, or even the ethics, you have linked twice to information that you are aware is upsetting and perhaps damaging to the person involved. I think that’s wrong. It’s not helping your argument, nor is it proving any point other that the one I mentioned before — it was easy.
Well, that’s a pretty reasoned response. I see your position, I just don’t see the evidence for it; in fact, I think the evidence tilts in the opposite direction (disclosure: IANAL).
I’ll spare you the explanation of my opinion since you’re interested in neither ethics nor legalities, and answer your question. I don’t feel the least bit out of order for posting that link… twice, because there is nothing secret or private about it. I didn’t search on those terms last week, so I can’t tell you for certain what they would’ve revealed; but I don’t think the rankings would’ve changed that drasticly over the past week, and I’m confident that link would’ve been in the first 10 results, if it wasn’t number one as it is now. And, I’m certain I could’ve come up with those terms quite easily, even a year ago. This from someone who has never bothered to get a dkos account, and doesn’t even read the site every day.
As far as I can tell, the alleged blogger has done very little to protect his anonymity, and personally published multiple, clear links between his public persona and his private self. He has revealed himself, and nobody has revealed anything further about him than he already has, on multiple occasions. On purpose.
Now, that alone is enough to keep me from having to think twice about publishing the link to his profile. But, in my opinion, his lack of disclosure and recusal has actually been harmful to the community: since he has written with the authority of a lawyer, using his pseudonym, to provide legal opinions to the community on subjects in which he clearly had a personal involvement.
Apart from you and him claiming that he doesn’t want his personal and private life connected, what has he actually done to protect his identity? Because, yes, as far as I can tell he has, as you said it, left obvious clues. Nobody leaked classified information here, nobody disclosed information which was previously agreed to be private, and nobody has trampled anyone’s right to privacy. Spoiled their fun maybe, but that’s it.
What do I not have the evidence for? The dude says he doesn’t want his shit published. You’re linking to it. I believe it’s wrong of you to do so. What evidence is required?
Are you saying he didn’t say that? Are you saying you didn’t link to it? Are you saying I need to prove what my own opinions are?
I’m also quite offended that you say I am not interested in legalities or ethics. I am. I said in my argument “Because no matter what the legalities, or even the ethics” because those things were not needed to make my point. Your stance was inconsistent regardless of the legal and ethical arguments.
Again, I’ll point out that your argument seems to be boiling down to the fact that it’s okay to publish this stuff because it was easy to get. Further, you now seem to be saying that he was asking for it. You’re free to make these arguments, but it doesn’t alter the fact that the person involved did not publish the information and is saying he does not want it published.
talk to Google then.
Perhaps they’ll accept Armando’s wishes for that information to not be put into the public record. But probably not. Since it’s not breaking any laws and he released it himself.
But hey, why argue facts when Armando’s feelings are hurt.
Your insulting, pissy comments here and elsewhere add absolutely nothing to a reasonable discussion, assuming that’s what you want.
really, I thought I just hold a view you don’t share.
And as far as my comments here and elsewhere, sorry you don’t feel they’re productive, I happen to disagree. I happen to think, and other members of this community agree, that they have some merit. I don’t see how talking about the facts of the case and stating my opinion is unproductive or not contributing. You may not like my style, but you can’t really complain about that right since you’re defending the king of complaints about style, armando.
But, then again, since I have never had a run-in with Armando, actually have a high opinion of him for some things, and just have my own opinions on the ridiculousness that is this whole case, my thoughts should be immediately discounted because you don’t like my tone.
I’d point you to my other comments from yesterday to back up my assertions and explain a bit why I am starting to get a wee testy, but they’ve been deleted.
And, hey, check out your own response in this thread and see who got ‘pissy’ first.
But hey, why argue facts when Armando’s feelings are hurt.
This, I did not take as a difference of opinion. Neither is it a matter of “tone.” This is a passive-aggressive way of saying 1) that I’m not using facts, and 2) that my argument is based on protecting Armando’s feelings, neither of which I appreciate.
And, no, I do not take this sort of thing as being productive. I’ve been blunt in this thread and perhaps that comes off as pissy, but I have not smeared, name-called, or insinuated. If I have something to say, I say it.
I did read your comments in yesterday’s thread. In my opinion, there were good points made on both sides about both the legal and ethical issues. However, again in my opinion, it largely detracts from any argument you may be making when you take petty swipes at the people you’re arguing with.
Well, I used that as a form of rhetoric because that was the general gist of your arugment and so many yesterday — he asked us to not Google him, when he was he got upset and it’s the worst thing to happen ever. That’s not logic in my books and it’s damn near impossible to argue against something that is based on good will or feelings. So yes, it was a swipe, but one that I didn’t employ until the same arguments were being trotted out again and all the well reasoned arguments that were presented yesterday are now down the memory hole. Which, I suppose, makes it easy to make a claim in retrospect that mine at least were “pissy and unproductive”… I mean, how can I prove you wrong?
Did you deserve that swipe in terms of Armando? Probably not, but in my mind the argument does. Armando made his info publicly available. Google connected the dots. A right wing mag published it. End of story. Next time, use this as a cautionary tale in terms of public disclosure if you want to remain anonymous and blog. But a martyr for the cause Armando is not. I’d pick stark, Gannon, or soj for those honours.
Oh, and I am glad I know his potential bias now when I read his legal opinions frontpaged at the blog of record, dailykos. Just like I would for anyone.
CookTing didn’t ‘connect the dots’ on Armando, the NRO did. I don’t think they really cared one bit about what Armando’s wishes were on the matter. And the info is out there already. Linking to the search results of Google on innocuous terms is what people do on the Internet everyday. That’s the internet. It ain’t changing anytime soon. And searching for the very info ARMANDO released to the public when he wanted to be seen as an authority on a subject (i.e. lawyer) is not rocket science.
If he cared that much he could have, no had an obligation to, not link his real identity to his blogging identity. EVER. Then he would have an expectation of privacy.
Google, as I mentioned above, doesn’t troll the internet trying to discern who wants what info linked to whatever. Armando linked his real life to his blogging life and they indexed it. Then it was totally easy for anyone to find. Left or right.
That’s just life. Whether it was morally right or wrong for the NRO to publish the info as a means to discredit him, well, that’s for them to decide. I can have an opinion, but many others would disagree… i.e. their audience vs. Armando’s audience, dkos. Just as (actually) outing Gannon and outing starkravinglunaticradical and soj was for the left to decide. Where was the outrage over those?
(sorry, just me being pissy and unproductive again I suppose)
You refer twice to “my argument.” What do you imagine that is? So far, I haven’t presented an argument, merely pointed out the implications of what people are saying in comments to the people saying them.
I find it disturbing that you so readily attribute to one commenter the perceived stance of everyone else you’ve been arguing with on this issue. Also that you imagine you know both my motivations and my stance on other issues. And as well, that you see fit to serve this all up as a cautionary tale.
I read the previous threads, and wasn’t exactly impressed with what I saw there. The glee in some comments was sickening, imo.
That said, my stance on the issue is that it was wrong of the right-wing mag to publish the information. They did not connect the dots. They did not google it. They took the information from some asshole with a grudge and published it. That, in my opinion, is wrong.
I also thought it was wrong when it happened to the others you mention and I’ll still think it’s wrong if it happens to someone else. I don’t take glee or satisfaction in witch-hunts, whether they happen to someone I like or dislike. If it happened to you or me or anyone, I’d be upset. I’d also argue with anyone who tried to justify it.
You ask where the outrage was in those instances — well, the “outrage” you’re questioning has been largely generated in response to people celebrating. I’m sure you’ll correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t remember any diaries here justifying Stark’s or Soj’s outings. I don’t really think Gannon’s situation is comparable, but I didn’t like some of the feeding-frenzy that went on with that either.
On your last point about Stark and Soj. There aren’t any diaries here justifying Armando’s outing. Only three by Suskind (two now deleted) that defend Armando, and one asking why those two were deleted. In Stark’s case, she was outed by kossacks, but few here defended her. But Armando gets outed with his own public information and a howl goes up in his defense. It’s strange.
There aren’t any diaries here justifying Armando’s outing.
Oh?
Open Letter to Anonymous Bloggers: Blogging!=NOC Status by Brian Nowhere
Celebrated Lefty Blogger Outed as WalMart Contractor by donkeytale
Hey, Armando! by digdugboy
So, we have 1) bloggers have no right to anonymity, 2) it was bound to happen, and 3) he deserved it. These all sound like justifications to me, and that’s not even getting into the comments.
In stark’s case, there was no need to rush to her defense because no one was standing by the outing or justifying it here. The information was not published by a blog — it was posted in comments. The comments were removed. Stark got plenty of sympathy here on this site. It is not at all strange when you look at the incidents in context.
From an ethical standpoint, perhaps not, but from a legal standpoint (i.e., the tort of invasion of privacy) it makes a huge difference.
Well, I think everyone’s pretty much settled on the fact that nothing illegal happened. The argument seems to be on whether it was ethical, or more simply, right or wrong.
Some people evidently think there was nothing wrong with it, in which case they have a right to that opinion of course, but what’s bothering me a lot is that some people seem to be arguing it’s ok because of Armando himself.
Just out of curiousity I did a Google search and found the following item, in a list of profiles of speakers at a conference on April 9, 2005.
Armando was a panelist in the session on eDemocracy: When Goverment Goes Online His profile reads as follows.
Usually the organizers of such meetings just post information supplied by the speakers, and I have no reason to suspect that wasn’t the case here. I really don’t see why, having presumably put this information out into the public domain himself in April 2005, why Armando is getting so upset about its being circulated now. (Maybe he now regrets having published it then, but that’s a separate issue.) But I don’t see why the rest of us have to get sucked into this melodrama. Couldn’t we instead be discussing more important issues like how to ensure that elections are run in demonstrably verifiable ways, problems with Diebold and other e-voting systems, and so on.
Incidentally, it turns out that the audiotape of the edemocracy session is on-line (click to hear it). I’m listening to it now (it’s 1:17 long). If there’s anything interesting I’ll post again (but I may give up before I listen to the end).
Sorry, the correct link for the audio-tape of Armando’s session is here (the one up-thread is wrong. At the beginning of the tape the moderator introduces the panelists. My transcription of the part on Armando (0:38-) follows.
So it’s clear that at least in April 2005 that Armando was openly identified by his full name and professional affiliation. That being the case, retrospective classification seems inappropriate.
I find this continuing drama to be really funny.
I’ve always looked at blogonyms as a sort of writing aid, as Samuel Clemons used “Mark Twain” or Ben Franklin used “Silence Dogood” and “Poor Richard”. A sort of “equipment” to don when writing, like a dancer puts on her slippers.
This sort of thing that Armando experienced is NOTHING compared to what the right and the entrenched corporate Dems are willing to do to maintain the status quo. How did they silence Scott Ritter? Go google Scott Ritter, pedophilia. There was no real proof, but some supposed internet bedcrumbs … and voila! Think if you piss someone off they won’t contact your boss, email your spouse, send something to your mother that you think of as private? I’m not just talking about allegations like those about Ritter. How many posts and comments have you typed out in despair, in anger?
We are in the endgame of a putsch that’s been going on since labor began its serious fight against Capital, well over a century ago. This game is for keeps, and if a real resistance builds up steam what happened to Armando will look like chicken feed.
Don’t do this unless you’re willing to be exposed. Don’t hit that keyboard unless you’re willing to defend it later.
This is a culture war, an asymetric culture war, and there are no clear battle lines. Armando reaped what he sowed, and in the end what he churned out into the interweb conflicted in bad and uncomfortable ways with his meat life. Tough. Politics is a blood sport.
Wait, are you actually arguing it’s ok because everyone does it?
Where did you get that?
All I’m pointing out is that we’re going to see more of this. As Jeffersonian Democrat’s very cogent comment points out, there will be plenty of dividing and conquering going on as we go into the next two elections. It is no coincidence that this attack took place to coincide w/ Yearly kos. Given my history w/ Armando and the pathetic sell-out that is Daily Kos, I will admit that this episode didn’t sadden me much.
All I’m saying is that everyone should keep in mind that this is going to happen, and if anyone starts to be perceived as effective, then they shouldn’t be suprised if it happens to them. That Armando left so much amunition around just made him an easy target. There will be more. I wouldn’t be suprised to see another frontpager’s nasty blogging to be tied at some point to his political work as a consultant in his state to cause him problems with more progressive people he might work with.
I’m not condoning it, just pointing out that it’s the state of the world as we live in it now. College Grads are finding their internet footprint hurting their job searches. Students are getting expelled for their online posts & teachers losing their jobs.
Don’t blog and try to be active unless you’re willing to defend what you’ve posted.
Where did I get it? Because repeatedly arguing that 1) it’s inevitable, 2) it was nothing compared to other stuff, and 3) he’s done this and that bad thing to bring it on would lead most people to conclude that you think it’s okay. Now you’ve made clear you don’t condone it — I’m glad we cleared that up.
okay, cool … sorry I wasn’t more clear.
Mark Twain! What fun he is missing here in the weblog era…all he had to work with was the slave era to invoke the GAN (Great Amerikkkan Novel) clause.
Keep up the good work….
Ok, I only made one comment about this on Friday and I’ll make it again.
I believe we are not seeing the big picture here. Maybe it’s the old military training but I see this as classic divide and conquer. We are so busy arguing amongst ourselves that we are missing things like Cheney’s office declaring themselves immune to classification oversight last week. Nor do I believe that it is a Rovian scheme, but rather the same tactics he uses, filtered down obviously, used by one or a few GWB die-hards with keyboards and internet access. It’s classic Sun Tzu and the opposite side is using our weakness (i.e. progressives being so divided) against us.
Are we going to continue to bicker amongst ourselves and let them win? Or are we going to wake up and unite despite personal feelings, one way or the other toward the person in question, out of principle and teamwork?
I never had a problem with Armando over at Kos when I was there, in fact I remember that he gave me a compliment on one of my post. But that is neither here nor there. What happened to him, whether his fault or not, could happen to any one of us who becomes high-profile enough. Welcome to the world of dirty tricks. Let’s try and put a stop to it, we can start by uniting.
And that’s all I have to say about this.
gOD THIS GUY IS GREAT, A BETTER PRIMA DONNA THAN EVEN ILLUSIONS OF MAGICIANS WHEN tHE lATTER FLAMED OUT OVER ALL THE BLOG INSPIRED HYSTERIA OF THE HURRICANE KATRINA ERE BOOTRIB.
MY HATS OFF TO YOU SIR.
I KNOW THIS WAS ALL ABOUT PRINCIPLES NOT THE FACT THAT YOU WERE FOOLISH ENOUGH TO GET YOURSELF INTO A POSITION TO LOSE SOME BUSINESS OPPORTUNITIES BECAUSE YOU TOO WERE FOUND OUT POSTING ON SOME MILDLY LEFTISH POLITICAL WEBSITE AND THUS FELT A KINSHIP WITH ARMANDO, BUT INVOKING THE CONSTTITUTION AND THE MAGNA CARTA TO DEFEND YOUR OWN AND APPARENTLY ARMANDOS OWN FOOLISHNESS?
haHA. EXCELLENT. YOU SHOULD CONSIDER WRITING FOR THE BRITISH THEATRE.
recommended again. hERE hERE!
In the diaries of someone who deleted not one but two diaries here and on MyLeftWing, wiping out literally hundreds of comments, simply because the discussion wasn’t going the way he wanted it to go.
Hey sus, why not just let it go?
The subject you raise is interesting to me but the guy who owns the blog is getting pretty annoyed and I’m sure not going to waste a great deal of energy posting in the diary of a guy who apologetically deleted 2 diaries yesterday. Why bother?
Not only that, but isn’t Armando’s full name posted in the context of this diary?
I thought that was a no-no?
Why, it’s as if the whole point of the exercise is to keep people talking about Armando.
My point is that Armando himself, voluntarily disclosed his identity (real name, screen name, employer) over a year ago, and that we shouldn’t lend an ear to his complaints, but you’re right, in the process of telling people we shouldn’t pay any attention to Armando, it’s turns out we are paying attention to him…
What we should be paying attention to is how to make sure elections are run honestly.
It would be a problem if it hadn’t already been published on the web in April 2005 based (presumably) on information supplied by Armando himself to the organizers of the meeting. Furthermore, in the tape of the session where he was a panelist, the moderator gives Armando’s full name, says he’s a guest blogger at Dkos, and also says he’s a lawyer at McConnell Valdes. That being the case, I don’t see any problem in republishing that information here.
OTOH, I agree that, in the cases of bloggers who have not themselves volunarily disclosed their real names as well as screen names, we shouldn’t randomly go around outing them.
But in Armando’s case he has created a huge soap opera over his supposed “outing” when this information has been openly available for over a year in at least one place (see the links I posted above), and maybe others as well (I haven’t made any efforts to search systematically). That being the case, I think he is out of line in complaining.
Didn’t Benjamin Franklin write to several papers with various names?
As to the outting of a blogger, I think it’s up to the person blogging to divulge their personal information… anything else is basically an attack on one’s privacy.
From another blog
Yes indeed. You’d think they’d be a bit more self-conscious over there…..