Okay. I am willing to potentially make an ass out of myself this morning. I noticed during my morning reading that Prof. Alan Dershowitz said that the affidavit filed against George Zimmerman was “irresponsible and unethical” because it was so thin on details and because it was consistent with a self-defense argument. To be honest, i was disappointed that the affidavit didn’t provide any new information, but I am also confused by Dershowitz’s response.
The first thing I did was just google up something to explain basic pre-trial procedure. This case is unusual because there was no grand jury, but everything else should remain the same. Yesterday, Zimmerman had a hearing which set his arraignment for May 29th. He was not presented with an indictment. Or, if he was, it was sealed at the request of his defense attorney. This hearing seems to be something called for under Florida law, because much of what they discussed normally happens at the arraignment, such as hearing the charges, being informed of your rights, and discussing terms of bail. One reason we didn’t learn more about the charges is because Zimmerman’s lawyer deferred the bail question in order to avoid a public hearing of any evidence. Had he requested bail, the prosecutor could have presented evidence arguing against bail, and we would have learned new information.
In any case, it is normal to receive a complaint (affidavit) at an arraignment. An affidavit is not based on sworn testimony from a grand jury or other process. It’s basically the sworn word of the prosecutor that they have a case against you. If they lie, you can sue them later.
The difference between an indictment and a complaint is that an indictment is based on sworn testimony and a “complaint” is an “affidavit” signed against you by your accuser. If vindicated, you cannot “sue” the Grand Jury because they indicted, however, you could file a malicious prosecution action against someone who did sign an affidavit against you.
I assume Dershowitz knows that an affidavit is not supposed to be the same thing as an indictment.
An indictment, in this case, will be issued on the prosecutor’s authority. As far as I understand it, the place to hear the indictment is the preliminary hearing, which comes after the arraignment.
The state puts on evidence to show the court why the matter should be set for trial and the defense attorney has the ability to cross-examine witnesses. Some prosecutors would rather avoid a preliminary hearing because they do not want to expose their witnesses at that early stage and elect to go to the Grand Jury instead. Grand Jury proceedings are secret and defense lawyers can only be present if and when their own client testifies.
Yesterday, the judge ruled that based on the affidavit, Zimmerman can be held over for trial. But the evidence was based on the prosecutor’s word and the defense was not allowed to challenge the evidence.
It seems to me that the reason we didn’t learn anything new is because both the prosecutor and the defense had an interest in keeping new information from coming out. Perhaps both of them shared a desire to keep emotions calm. Beyond that, the prosecutor didn’t want to telegraph her case and the defense didn’t want to prejudice any potential jurors or have damaging information released.
Is Dershowitz an idiot, or am I?
Is Dershowitz licensed to practice in the State of Florida?
And btw, I stopped respecting Dershowitz’s opinion when he advocated torture.
I was wondering where I had heard his name before and why I was skeptical of his analysis. Someone told me he was an OJ lawyer though???
He was an OJ lawyer, but I don’t think he did a whole lot. I think he mainly advised them on things they could use for appeal. But he won the case, so there was no appeal.
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Alan Dershowitz interview
"But I will not let myself be reduced to silence."
I very much doubt it, but he is one of the best legal minds in the country. I think he’s half-nuts in a lot of ways, but I wouldn’t normally accuse him of not understanding criminal procedure.
Just don’t ever get between him and a camera, you could get hurt.
Booman,
Yesterday Micheal Smerconish was subbing for Tweety and he had Alan Dershowitz on discussing George Zimmerman affidavit files yesterday by the prosecutor. I heard when he said it was “unethical and irresponsible”. I was more taken aback by his tone, and how accusatory he was towards this prosecutor based soley on her press conference and I guess the affidavit and it just seems rather inflammatory towards her. It made me wary of even listening to what he said, he said it in such a bitter and rather partisan way too.
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All particulars and evidence (case file) was ordered sealed at the request of the defense lawyer Mike O’Mara. Zimmerman’s lawyer mentioned he was very recently retained and the volume of evidence will take some time to review. Looking at State Attorney Angela Corey’s track record, she does not take the matter of gathering sufficient evidence lightly. So, Alan Dershowitz is making and ass of himself like so many others who have jumped the gun to make assumptions without the facts. Does Dershowitz respect the courts?
"But I will not let myself be reduced to silence."
Dershowitz making an ass of himself? However many times you have to make an ass of yourself before you are officially an ass once and for all, I am sure Dershowitz passed that threshold a long time ago.
Alan was playing the role of defense attorney. What was startling was how mouthy he was towards the professionalism of the prosecuting attorney. He came across sounding too much like ‘you lie Joe Wilson’.
Alan was playing the role of defense attorney. What was startling was how mouthy he was towards the professionalism of the prosecuting attorney. He came across sounding too much like ‘you lie Joe Wilson’.
I still don’t understand why this tragedy is a political story…it’s a law enforcement issue…
We need to be discussing the Progressive War On Moms!
Had the police and prosecutors done their job initially then it wouldn’t be a story at all – why they failed/refused to do their job makes this a relevant story, and fixing the system to ensure that this kind of failure doesn’t happen again makes it political.
Naaaahhhhh…not until some progressive shoots (or is shot by) some mom.
Saaaay!!! Now I know what’s happening!!! Anybody who wants to make a point in the media about an important societal question…white-on-black crime for instance, or the war on women or the total idiocy of of so many right wing quasi-neanderthals…all’s they have to do is shoot (or get shot by) someone who is a good image of that societal problem in an area with a truly lame police force and justice system. Like about 98% of the country.
Whadda buncha maroons we are!!!
We could save the woild in no time!!!
Later…
AG
The Zimmermann case is global news not because a partly white man killed a black man. It happens all the time. It is not even global news because the relevant police authorities failed to investigate properly. This is regarded as par for the course in much of the USA. It is global news because the Republican Right acted as if in their opinion a white man is perfectly justified in shouting an unarmed white man if he is even slightly suspicious of what the black man might be up to and regardless of whether he comes to that view on the basis of prejudice or objective evidence. It is the Republican Right which have made this a global story.
@libertyforall:
go fuck yourself in the dick with a picklefork.
Brendan… My Aunt Kathy told me when I was 8 years old, “it’s not a dick, it’s a penis”
Get it right, Dude?
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Does Alan Dershowitz have an issue with Norman Finkelstein?
"But I will not let myself be reduced to silence."
Whether or not you’re wrong on this is completely irrelevant of whether or not The Dersh is an idiot. He’s beyond an idiot; he’s an advocate of war crimes, and will defend an Israeli genocide if he had to.
Sigh.
More two dimensional thinking in a multi-dimensional world.
You do know that there is a fairly obvious third choice, don’t you Booman?
Yup.
Sigh…
AG
“Angry” is the right word to use. he seemed angry at Angela Corley based solely on the affidavit??? It made no sense to me that he would seem so angry
Not that I have much experience, but the complaint appears no more or less detailed than others I’ve read. All it does is provide a brief outline of the events at issue and the basis for the charge. There’s nothing to be gained from adding additional details beyond the bare minimum necessary to establish probable cause (why give away trial strategy, or lock yourself into facts/testimony that might not hold up at trial?), and I doubt there is an affirmative obligation to argue the defendant’s version of events, as Dershowitz seems to suggest (or to disprove an affirmative defense that the defendant may or may not use at trial). I think Dershowitz is just being a dishonest jerk on this one.
I would not say that Dershowitz is an idiot. He is a criminal defense attorney, probably most famous for the von Bulow case.
Dershowitz is a smart lawyer from the technical standpoint, but I don’t consider him a man of honor. Obviously he likes high profile cases. Maybe this was just his way of signaling Zimmerman’s defense team that he’s available for hire as a consultant.