Ron Paul’s 2002 Prophecy Speech-Amazingly Accurate!!!

15 Comments

1. 

   Arthur Gilroy on July 16, 2012 at 11:56 am

   A small move away from your ongoing dream state?

   Please.

   AG

2. 

   Marie2 on July 16, 2012 at 2:44 pm

   Come on — he was just pointing out some of the inevitable consequences of the DC consensus and the part of the GOP agenda that he didn’t like (not that that was enough for him not to vote along with them whenever it mattered).  Plus a lot of his boilerplate list is wrong at least within his defined ten-year time-frame;

   The Karzai government will fail, and U.S. military presence will end in Afghanistan.

   The US welfare state has not only not expanded, but it’s been contracting for decades.  Am assuming he meant “welfare state” for those in need because like any good Republican or Libertarian, he reviles poor people.  But he could retroactively claim that he meant welfare for wealthy people, corporations, and military contractors and then he’d be correct.    

   • 

     Arthur Gilroy on July 16, 2012 at 5:51 pm

     This is a perfect illustration of the process with clomp-clomp-clomping leftiness kneejerkers and Ron Paul.

     No matter how correct he is, he’s always wrong.

     Tell me…did any other nationally elected U.S. politician stand up in the spring of 2002 and say these things? Any of them?

     HELL no!!! In fact, even if they agreed with him in part or in principle they ran for the hills. DemRats and RatPubs alike. Hell, we wuz at war, an’ it’s downright unpatriotic t’say things like that. Why…you might not even get reelected! This man has had the courage to face up to the PermaGov in public for decades and the political know-how to survive while doing it.

     So complain away, Marie.

     The chickens are going to home to roost eventually. Sooner rather than later, I’m thinking.

     Sooner rather than later.

     Bet on it.

     

     Watch.

     AG

     • 

       Marie2 on July 16, 2012 at 9:38 pm

       Did you go through it line by line?

       I predict U.S. taxpayers will pay to rebuild Palestine, both the West Bank and the Gaza, as well as Afghanistan. U.S. taxpayers paid to bomb these areas, so we will be expected to rebuild them.

       When does this predicted rebuilding begin?  Now some of us might think that helping people in those countries to build certain public goods would be a good thing, but that’s not what Paul was advocating.

       ..Peace, of sorts, will come to the Middle East, but will be short-lived.

       Did I somehow miss the coming and going of that short-lived peace?

       In time, an oil boycott will be imposed, with oil prices soaring to historic highs.

       Oil boycott?  Nope.

       A coalition Arab Muslims nations to avenge the humiliation of Palestinians?  NOT gonna happen.

       Some of our moderate Arab allies will be overthrown by Islamic fundamentalists.

       It wasn’t Islamic fundamentalists that led to charge to oust Mubarek and Ben Ali, neither of whom qualified as “moderate.”

       An international dollar crisis will dramatically boost interest rates in the United States.

       Well, guess Greenspan and Bernanke screwed with him on this one by keeping the Fed rate as close to zero as possible for the past decade.

       Price inflation…

       Wrong again.

       Sorry but I’m not compulsive enough to dissect all of this dribble.  The few bit and pieces that he managed to get right were articulated better and more fully by plenty of people — including a few in Congress.  Bryan Dorgan completely nailed Gramm-Leach-Bliley in 1999 while Paul was blithering about fiat currency.    

       • 

         Arthur Gilroy on July 17, 2012 at 6:06 pm

         

         Please.

         AG

         • 

           Don Durito on July 17, 2012 at 9:31 pm

           How is someone’s generally correct take-down of Paul’s “prophesy” a “knee-jerk” reaction?

         • 

           BooMan on July 17, 2012 at 10:22 pm

           It’s not.  And, I give you Robert Byrd.

           Reckless Administration May Reap Disastrous Consequences

           by US Senator Robert Byrd

           Senate Floor Speech – Wednesday, February 12, 2003

           To contemplate war is to think about the most horrible of human experiences. On this February day, as this nation stands at the brink of battle, every American on some level must be contemplating the horrors of war.

           Yet, this Chamber is, for the most part, silent — ominously, dreadfully silent. There is no debate, no discussion, no attempt to lay out for the nation the pros and cons of this particular war. There is nothing.

           We stand passively mute in the United States Senate, paralyzed by our own uncertainty, seemingly stunned by the sheer turmoil of events. Only on the editorial pages of our newspapers is there much substantive discussion of the prudence or imprudence of engaging in this particular war.

           And this is no small conflagration we contemplate. This is no simple attempt to defang a villain. No. This coming battle, if it materializes, represents a turning point in U.S. foreign policy and possibly a turning point in the recent history of the world.

           This nation is about to embark upon the first test of a revolutionary doctrine applied in an extraordinary way at an unfortunate time. The doctrine of preemption — the idea that the United States or any other nation can legitimately attack a nation that is not imminently threatening but may be threatening in the future — is a radical new twist on the traditional idea of self defense. It appears to be in contravention of international law and the UN Charter. And it is being tested at a time of world-wide terrorism, making many countries around the globe wonder if they will soon be on our — or some other nation’s — hit list. High level Administration figures recently refused to take nuclear weapons off of the table when discussing a possible attack against Iraq. What could be more destabilizing and unwise than this type of uncertainty, particularly in a world where globalism has tied the vital economic and security interests of many nations so closely together? There are huge cracks emerging in our time-honored alliances, and U.S. intentions are suddenly subject to damaging worldwide speculation. Anti-Americanism based on mistrust, misinformation, suspicion, and alarming rhetoric from U.S. leaders is fracturing the once solid alliance against global terrorism which existed after September 11.

           Here at home, people are warned of imminent terrorist attacks with little guidance as to when or where such attacks might occur. Family members are being called to active military duty, with no idea of the duration of their stay or what horrors they may face. Communities are being left with less than adequate police and fire protection. Other essential services are also short-staffed. The mood of the nation is grim. The economy is stumbling. Fuel prices are rising and may soon spike higher.

           This Administration, now in power for a little over two years, must be judged on its record. I believe that that record is dismal.

           In that scant two years, this Administration has squandered a large projected surplus of some $5.6 trillion over the next decade and taken us to projected deficits as far as the eye can see. This Administration’s domestic policy has put many of our states in dire financial condition, under funding scores of essential programs for our people. This Administration has fostered policies which have slowed economic growth. This Administration has ignored urgent matters such as the crisis in health care for our elderly. This Administration has been slow to provide adequate funding for homeland security. This Administration has been reluctant to better protect our long and porous borders.

           In foreign policy, this Administration has failed to find Osama bin Laden. In fact, just yesterday we heard from him again marshaling his forces and urging them to kill. This Administration has split traditional alliances, possibly crippling, for all time, International order-keeping entities like the United Nations and NATO. This Administration has called into question the traditional worldwide perception of the United States as well-intentioned, peacekeeper. This Administration has turned the patient art of diplomacy into threats, labeling, and name calling of the sort that reflects quite poorly on the intelligence and sensitivity of our leaders, and which will have consequences for years to come.

           Calling heads of state pygmies, labeling whole countries as evil, denigrating powerful European allies as irrelevant — these types of crude insensitivities can do our great nation no good. We may have massive military might, but we cannot fight a global war on terrorism alone. We need the cooperation and friendship of our time-honored allies as well as the newer found friends whom we can attract with our wealth. Our awesome military machine will do us little good if we suffer another devastating attack on our homeland which severely damages our economy. Our military manpower is already stretched thin and we will need the augmenting support of those nations who can supply troop strength, not just sign letters cheering us on.

           The war in Afghanistan has cost us $37 billion so far, yet there is evidence that terrorism may already be starting to regain its hold in that region. We have not found bin Laden, and unless we secure the peace in Afghanistan, the dark dens of terrorism may yet again flourish in that remote and devastated land.

           Pakistan as well is at risk of destabilizing forces. This Administration has not finished the first war against terrorism and yet it is eager to embark on another conflict with perils much greater than those in Afghanistan. Is our attention span that short? Have we not learned that after winning the war one must always secure the peace?

           And yet we hear little about the aftermath of war in Iraq. In the absence of plans, speculation abroad is rife. Will we seize Iraq’s oil fields, becoming an occupying power which controls the price and supply of that nation’s oil for the foreseeable future? To whom do we propose to hand the reigns of power after Saddam Hussein?

           Will our war inflame the Muslim world resulting in devastating attacks on Israel? Will Israel retaliate with its own nuclear arsenal? Will the Jordanian and Saudi Arabian governments be toppled by radicals, bolstered by Iran which has much closer ties to terrorism than Iraq?

           Could a disruption of the world’s oil supply lead to a world-wide recession? Has our senselessly bellicose language and our callous disregard of the interests and opinions of other nations increased the global race to join the nuclear club and made proliferation an even more lucrative practice for nations which need the income?

           In only the space of two short years this reckless and arrogant Administration has initiated policies which may reap disastrous consequences for years.

           One can understand the anger and shock of any President after the savage attacks of September 11. One can appreciate the frustration of having only a shadow to chase and an amorphous, fleeting enemy on which it is nearly impossible to exact retribution.

           But to turn one’s frustration and anger into the kind of extremely destabilizing and dangerous foreign policy debacle that the world is currently witnessing is inexcusable from any Administration charged with the awesome power and responsibility of guiding the destiny of the greatest superpower on the planet. Frankly many of the pronouncements made by this Administration are outrageous. There is no other word.

           Yet this chamber is hauntingly silent. On what is possibly the eve of horrific infliction of death and destruction on the population of the nation of Iraq — a population, I might add, of which over 50% is under age 15 — this chamber is silent. On what is possibly only days before we send thousands of our own citizens to face unimagined horrors of chemical and biological warfare — this chamber is silent. On the eve of what could possibly be a vicious terrorist attack in retaliation for our attack on Iraq, it is business as usual in the United States Senate.

           We are truly “sleepwalking through history.” In my heart of hearts I pray that this great nation and its good and trusting citizens are not in for a rudest of awakenings.

           To engage in war is always to pick a wild card. And war must always be a last resort, not a first choice. I truly must question the judgment of any President who can say that a massive unprovoked military attack on a nation which is over 50% children is “in the highest moral traditions of our country”. This war is not necessary at this time. Pressure appears to be having a good result in Iraq. Our mistake was to put ourselves in a corner so quickly. Our challenge is to now find a graceful way out of a box of our own making. Perhaps there is still a way if we allow more time.

         • 

           Arthur Gilroy on July 17, 2012 at 10:46 pm

           Oh.

           You mean the Robert Byrd who for a long period of his political life belonged to the Ku Klux Klan? And then changed “alliances” in order to remain in power?

           And you had to nerve to post a picture of  Ron Paul in Confederate drag?

           Get real, Booman.

           Ron Paul has been a consistent proponent of universal individual freedom for over 40 years.

           Get real.

           AG

         • 

           BooMan on July 17, 2012 at 11:52 pm

           I never posted a picture of Ron Paul in confederate drag.  I may have published it, just as I publish everything that you write.  It may have even been posted by a front-pager here, but I exercise the same control over them that I do over you.  Which is to say, basically none.  

           But I wouldn’t care anyway because Ron Paul has more connections to the white racist movement in this country than any other single federally-elected official.  

           You just don’t care about that, as you’ve made crystal clear.  

           And I have blasted Robert Byrd for his past.  I have never forgiven him for his actions.  I asked him to try to redeem himself by endorsing Obama, which he did do.  I was very happy to see him close that circle at the end of his life.  

           Find me a progressive blogger who wrote more often about Byrd sordid past and his need to redeem himself.

           No, they were all gushing over his anti-war stance while I was pointing out that he was a grand wizard of the KKK.  

           I treated Byrd the same way I treat Paul.  He was one of the worst racists in US Senate history, and probably the most powerful.  But he did come around.  Go to a Ron Paul rally and report back to me about how many Aryans you encounter.  Go read through the Aryan websites and see what they have to say about Dr. Paul.  

           Get real. Get real, indeed.  

         • 

           Arthur Gilroy on July 18, 2012 at 5:37 am

           I never posted a picture of Ron Paul in confederate drag.  I may have published it, just as I publish everything that you write.  It may have even been posted by a front-pager here, but I exercise the same control over them that I do over you.  Which is to say, basically none.  

           Forgive me. I misremembered who posted that picture.

           However…as I have stated before, “connections” to a racist movement and approval by members of that movement are entirely different things. You will of course bring up the old newsletter idea and say that he does indeed have connectons to that movement because a decade or so ago there were people working on that newsletter that were connected to racist movements, and I will point out that if you allow Robert Byrd some sort of credit for his change you must also allow Ron Paul the same credit.

           Anyone who writes the following for publication is not a racist. Not in my book he is not. (Ron Paul, Government and Racism, April 16, 2007 )

           Racism is simply an ugly form of collectivism, the mindset that views humans strictly as members of groups rather than individuals. Racists believe that all individuals who share superficial physical characteristics are alike: as collectivists, racists think only in terms of groups. By encouraging Americans to adopt a group mentality, the advocates of so-called “diversity” actually perpetuate racism. Their obsession with racial group identity is inherently racist. The true antidote to racism is liberty. Liberty means having a limited, constitutional government devoted to the protection of individual rights rather than group claims. Liberty means free-market capitalism, which rewards individual achievement and competence, not skin color, gender, or ethnicity.

           April 16, 2007. Hmmmm…

           When were these “newsletters” published? The late 1980s and early 1990s, right?

           If he ever was a racist…an idea that his actions as a doctor throughout his life totally belie…then by 2007 it appears that he experienced a change of heart at least as profound as that of some old Ku Klux Klanner like Robert Byrd who you are so generously ready to forgive.

           But…oh, wait a minute!!! Byrd was a Democrat and Paul isn’t. And…you are a Democrat too, right? Oh. Now I understand. It’s just politics. I am so relieved!!!

           You do not believe that so-called free market capitalism is a viable idea? Fine. Do not continue to accuse the man of racism because you disagree with his economic positions.

           As far as going to a Ron Paul rally and reporting back to you about how many “Aryans” I encounter? Define your terms. “Aryans” in terms of genetic inheritance? Members of “Aryan superiority” movements? Just plain old people with whitish skin? What the fuck is an “Aryan,” anyway?

           Here is a viable set of definitions:

           Ar·y·an  
           n.

           1. Indo-Iranian. No longer in technical use.
           2. A member of the people who spoke the parent language of the Indo-European languages. No longer in technical use.
           3. A member of any people speaking an Indo-European language. No longer in technical use.
           4. In Nazism and neo-Nazism, a non-Jewish Caucasian, especially one of Nordic type, supposed to be part of a master race.

           Hmmmm…

           Do you mean “non-Jewish Caucasians?” If you do…how am I supposed to tell who is “non-Jewish” and who is not? Should we all wear t-shirts proclaiming our (probable) genetic inheritance? Need we undergo a gene scan of some sort by a reputable laboratory and wear dogtags proclaiming our ancestry?

           You see, Booman…taken to its extremes you are guilty of racism as Ron Paul defines it above. Are there whitish-skinned majorities at Ron Paul rallies? I imagine so. Will there be a whitish-skinned majority at the Democratic convention this year? Yes, there will be. So what!!! There will also be masses of cheap political hustlers at that convention and also masses of corporate lobbyist types. Is Barack Obama part of that section of his party’s support system? The jury is still out regarding that kind of question.

           Or is it?

           Now…what if there are members of Aryan supremacist movements at a Ron Paul rally? Are there members of splinter groups present at Obama rallies? I imagine so. Were there black nationalists or Israel-Firsters working in groups that supported Barack Obama in Chicago? More than likely. Is Barack Obama thus to be tarred and feathered with the terms “black nationalist” or “Zionist?” Ludicrous on the face of it.

           So it comes right around again to politics as usual. You’re a DemocRat and you are using whatever comes to hand to oppose a RatPublican.

           Great.

           I so love blind, vicious partisan politics!

           Shall I publish a picture of you in James Carville drag?

           Please.

           Over and out.

           AG

         • 

           BooMan on July 18, 2012 at 11:05 am

           What part of “I never forgave Robert Byrd” didn’t you understand?  

           You don’t get to be a Grand Wizard of the KKK and set a record for filibustering a civil rights bill and get forgiveness from me.  

           As for Ron Paul, he can start by denouncing in the harshest terms all the white racist groups and individual leaders who have been his strongest and longest supporters, and return all the money they’ve given him over the years.  

           When I use the term Aryans, I am referring to racists who self-identify that way.  

         • 

           Arthur Gilroy on July 18, 2012 at 12:57 pm

           What part of “I never forgave Robert Byrd” didn’t I understand?

           These parts:

           I asked him to try to redeem himself by endorsing Obama, which he did do. I was very happy to see him close that circle at the end of his life.

           And

           He was one of the worst racists in US Senate history, and probably the most powerful. But he did come around.

           Sounds like “forgiveness” to me.

           AG

         • 

           BooMan on July 18, 2012 at 3:27 pm

           Read more carefully.  

         • 

           Arthur Gilroy on July 18, 2012 at 10:54 pm

           Write more precisely.

           AG

         • 

           Arthur Gilroy on July 17, 2012 at 10:39 pm

           Weighted in terms of importance. (I’ll give a maximum of 100 points for an idea and then some percentage of how accurate it was as a “score.”):

           Our government intervention in the economy and in the private affairs of citizens, and the internal affairs of foreign countries, leads to uncertainty and many unintended consequences.

           100 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           I predict U.S. taxpayers will pay to rebuild Palestine, both the West Bank and the Gaza, as well as Afghanistan. U.S. taxpayers paid to bomb these areas, so we will be expected to rebuild them.

           25 points in terms of importance.
           10 points in terms of accuracy….w/more to come. Bet on it.

           Peace, of sorts, will come to the Middle East, but will be short-lived. There will be big promises of more U.S. money and weapons flowing to Israel and to Arab countries allied with the United States.

           40 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           U.S. troops and others will be used to monitor the “peace.”

           100 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           In time, an oil boycott will be imposed, with oil prices soaring to historic highs.

           No official “oil boycott” yet, although sanctions have been imposed on Iran. Oil prices are pretty damned high, though.

           50 points in terms of importance.
           40 points in terms of accuracy.

           Current Israeli-United States policies will solidify Arab Muslim nations in their efforts to avenge the humiliation of the Palestinians. That will include those Muslim nations that in the past have fought against each other.

           100 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           Some of our moderate Arab allies will be overthrown by Islamic fundamentalists.

           100 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           The U.N. will continue to condemn, through resolutions, Israeli-U.S. policies in the Middle East, and they will be ignored.

           100 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           Some European countries will clandestinely support the Muslim countries and their anti-Israel pursuits.

           100 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           China, ironically assisted by American aid, much more openly will sell to militant Muslims the weapons they want, and will align herself with the Arab nations.

           100 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           The United States, with Tony Blair as head cheerleader, will attack Iraq without proper authority, and a major war, the largest since World War II, will result.

           200 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           Major moves will be made by China, India, Russia, and Pakistan in Central Asia to take advantage of the chaos for the purpose of grabbing land, resources, and strategic advantages sought after for years.

           100 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           The Karzai government will fail, and U.S. military presence will end in Afghanistan.

           Still to come. Karzai may remain, but the U.S.will be gone. A wash

           An international dollar crisis will dramatically boost interest rates in the United States.

           100 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           Price inflation, with a major economic downturn, will decimate U.S. Federal Government finances, with exploding deficits and uncontrolled spending.

           100 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           Federal Reserve policy will continue at an expanding rate, with massive credit expansion, which will make the dollar crisis worse. Gold will be seen as an alternative to paper money as it returns to its historic role as money.

           Too early to tell. This presumes that “gold” and the libertarians eventually win. I give it a pass.

           Erosion of civil liberties here at home will continue as our government responds to political fear in dealing with the terrorist threat by making generous use of the powers obtained with the Patriot Act.

           300 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           The draft will be reinstated, causing domestic turmoil and resentment.

           100 points in terms of importance.
           0 points in terms of accuracy.

            Any day now. Aaaany day now, though…let one more “anti-insurgent” war start, and see what happens.

           Many American military personnel and civilians will be killed in the coming conflict.

           300 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           The leaders of whichever side loses the war will be hauled into and tried before the International Criminal Court for war crimes. The United States will not officially lose the war, but neither will we win. Our military and political leaders will not be tried by the International Criminal Court.

           Not necessarily “hauled into… the International Criminal Court for war crimes,” but…Mubarak? Assad I? Saddam Hussein? Dead as a motherfucker, or damned near. Bush II? Cheney? Still alive, if that’s what you want to call it.

           300 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           The Congress and the President will shift radically toward expanding the size and scope of the Federal Government. This will satisfy both the liberals and the conservatives.

           100 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           Military and police powers will grow, satisfying the conservatives. The welfare state, both domestic and international, will expand, satisfying the liberals. Both sides will endorse military adventurism overseas.

           200 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           This is the most important of my predictions: Policy changes could prevent all of the previous predictions from occurring. Unfortunately, that will not occur. In due course, the Constitution will continue to be steadily undermined and the American Republic further weakened.

           300 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           During the next decade, the American people will become poorer and less free, while they become more dependent on the government for economic security.

           300 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           The war will prove to be divisive, with emotions and hatred growing between the various factions and special interests that drive our policies in the Middle East.

           300 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           Agitation from more class warfare will succeed in dividing us domestically, and believe it or not, I expect lobbyists will thrive more than ever during the dangerous period of chaos.

           500 points in terms of importance.
           100 points in terms of accuracy.

           Lemme see.

           Multiply roughly 4000 points in terms of importance by 1350 points over 23 items in terms of accuracy.

           About 70% accuracy.

           Not bad. For prophecy.

           If only our drones were as accurate.

           But…oh well…

           Who cares about a buncha ragheads anyways, right?

           Riiiiight…

           Wake the fuck up.

           AG