I have to go vote and do some errands, but I want a thread for discussion of the Senate immigration bill. Apparently, Mitch McConnell supports it, which is interesting. It means that there is a pretty good chance that the bill will pass the full Senate. At the least, it makes it much harder for the right to launch a coordinated attack. So, let’s get a little ahead of ourselves here and ponder what it will look like on the House side once the Senate passes the bill with the support of the Minority Leader.
That gives Boehner plenty of cover to violate the Hastert Rule, right?
Does it also give enough cover to rank-and-file Republicans to support the bill? Or, I guess I should say enough rank-and file Republicans?
Is the bill even worth supporting? I don’t know what is in it.
Well I know one thing it doesn’t have; fuck these assholes:
http://www.metroweekly.com/poliglot/2013/05/sen-patrick-leahy-withholds-gay-inclusive-amendmen.html
That’s a shame but no surprise. They pushed for it rather than shelving it preemptively. It’s going to take a miracle to get something passed in the House, and the Republicans senators they need were not going to support it anyway.
The bill is a total disaster. It is going to destroy job prospects for students, American STEM/IT, and anyone who has interests in the employment of American workers.
The bill takes the lid off green cards. It also makes it CHEAPER to hire immigrant H-1B workers than Americans.
The bill is terrible. It must be defeated.
What us wrong with making more permanent residents through green cards? How else are they supposed to become citizens? Sounds to me you’re not just oppose to H1B1, you’re opposed to immigration period, which is what I always expected judging by your past language; first time it’s been spelled out tho.
I am opposed to H1B1’s tho. Make them citizens and bring them here if you “can’t find the skilled workers.” I suspect here lying.
They’re* lying, as in the industry.
I am opposed to both, and you should be too. You are my guess is 28 or 27. You have 2-3 maybe 6 years before you hit Norm Matloff’s notion of the age limit for STEM – 35. This is going to make a HUGE INCREASE in foreign STEM workers, who will displace domestic workers.
We have a HUGE oversupply of STEM workers. BIology is a disaster – there are thousands of post-docs who cannot move into permanent positions. This bill will increase the thousands to hundreds of thousands. There are hundreds of thousands of IT workers who have been replaced.
More importantly, this is eliminating our technology edge. By removing the incentives and jobs from Americans, we are seeing fewer and fewer US kids interested in this. Due to the perverse incentives in the university system (we charge huge fees for undergrads while CHina and India charge very little so that our students cannot afford to go to grad school, and we pay grad students who are often from CHina and INdia stipends and much of that is from our undergrads. In addition, the US students are actively harmed in their education by the incomprehensible accents and inability of the foreign students to speak English), we make it very difficult for our students to go to grad school.
This bill is a fucking disaster.
Well the university system has to be fixed, but China and India’s universities aren’t very good, and it shows in their work. And that shouldn’t be a reason to continue to support decades worth of limbo for people who want to become citizens.
We have a lot of these problems because the generations of before refuse to retire. There is a huge under supply in the mid-career positions bc no one can move up.
Wow. You agree that China and India have crap universities, and yet that is the source of the crap H-1Bs and green cards that are coming here. The Chinies and Indians are mostly incompetent, and are cheap labor. That is what you get – cheap labor.
I do not oppose immigration. I do oppose circumventing the immigration system with the H-1B system.
And yes I agree that retirement is a huge problem. That moron Claude Pepper removed the retirement age provision. Now we have universities stocked with aged moribund deadwood that make huge money and don’t do shit. This needs to change. We need a new “Retire at 70” movement, and when I get to be 70, I will retire and start this movement. For instance, the guy who is the editor of Science magazine is 75, and shows no sign of retiring.
CHina and India produce crap, but that is who is called the “best and brightest”. What they are is nothing more than cheap labor.
Ok, then it sounds like we’re in large agreement; I oppose H1B1s subverting the immigration system as well. But green card status–permanent residency– is the first basic step to becoming a citizen. Without that, there is no next step. How does that subvert the process?
We allow 1,000,000+ legal immigrants per year. This totally blows the door off that. Get an increase in teh immigration levels thru congress. This crap green card system is going to destroy the market for US IT and STEM workers.
We don’t owe shit to the world. We owe our children and citizens first crack at all jobs. No one else has any claim on jobs here.
And if you believe that this is wrong, apply for a job in Germany, France, China, India or any country that wants the US to take its overflow from failed fertility control. You will not be allowed to take a job in any of those countries. You cannot get a job in Canada unless you are a citizen or have a valid work permit. Canadians get first crack. The US should be the same – US citizens first, US citizens who need training second, everyone else third if at all.
If you’re a permanent resident of Canada, you are eligible for benefits and jobs, just like green card holders in the US.
I suppose the core of our disagreement is that I do not value Americans more than any other nationality, and I don’t support redistribution of wealth just in the US but worldwide.
Anti-American hatred is ugly. You need to re-evaluate your own thinking. I do value Americans more than others, because they are my children and my brothers. Other countries like India have refused to do anything about their fertility rate, their living conditions, and they expect that America will hire all the surplus Indians. For every American, there are 4 Indians and 4 Chinese. We are being overwhelmed by this tide of cheap labor.
Better watch your own butt. Your job is going to be threatened if this fucking piece of shit bill passes.
I don’t have an anti-American hatred, but I am more than willing to take a lower standard of living if that means it increases for others, especially those in abject poverty. Which is why if they want to become citizens and contribute to America, then bring them. However only as full citizens or on their way to that status, not bullshit second class status under H1B1 that lowers not only people’s wages who live here already, but lowers the wage the immigrant would make as a full citiZen.
Enough Republicans would support it in the House. That’s the governing coalition you spoke of even before the re-election — all the Democrats and enough Republicans to form a majority.
Those guys are between a rock and a hard place. There has to be a major realignment for them to have the kind of national stature to win the presidency. But there’s no way to get there without undoing what they’ve spent the last 40+ years creating. Those who are sitting fat, safe and happy in their districts are not down for that. Those who built their entire career around the Southern Strategy aren’t happy either. Buchanan wrote that weird column in which he delineated the problem but offered no solution. Most seem to think they should hold off for another cycle or two, but the handwriting is on the wall.
McConnel is a surprise. Does it have the unlimited H1-B’s that Micro$oft and others want?
Should have read the link first. Yep, this is another corporate assault on American workers.
What was your reward for selling your constituents down the river, you POS?
THis piece of SHIT is no better than Hatch now. He used to help American workers. WHAT THE FUCK IS UP WITH DURBIN?
The lid on H-1bs is being almost eliminated. THere is NO REQUIREMENT that American workers even be looked at. THis bill is a fucking disaster.
The lies told by industry are endless. No STEM workers? A HUGE LIE! We have OVER SUPPLY of STEM workers.
I wish that some of you chumps who are Grover Norquist Democrats and support this bill ask yourself: Why are the Democrats attempting to destroy the labor market in the high tech area by absolutely flooding it with hundreds of thousands, even millions of new workers?
The Democrats are in the pockets of people like Tim Cook or Mark Zuckerberg who are liberal on social issues but love cheap labor. This isn’t a labor party anymore and hasn’t been one for decades.