The left should be grateful to Bill Clinton for ending 12 years of Republican occupation of the White House, and for managing to get reelected. A fair assessment of his administration should take into account what didn’t happen simply because he won (twice), as well as what he accomplished legislatively and from a policy perspective. Yet, the party he bequeathed to the left was wanting in many respects. Perhaps the most glaring example of this is that Al Gore chose Joe Lieberman as his running mate, who went on to endorse George W. Bush’s reelection in 2004. In 2000, the party was dominated by New Democrats from the Democratic Leadership Council wing. This was not a party well-suited to deal with the radical opposition, particularly in the aftermath of the 9/11 terrorist attacks. It was also a party that had lost its populist instincts and had deregulated the financial sector. It was incapable of effectively resisting the Bush tax cuts or stopping bankruptcy reform.
The liberal blogosphere arose in a vacuum to assert leftist values that the Democratic Party had abandoned or lacked the courage to defend. So, it’s somewhat disconcerting that Hillary Clinton has emerged as a consensus choice of Democrats, more than 80% of whom want her to run to be the next nominee of the party. You would think that the party would be more forward-looking in its approach.
But, it’s not. It just isn’t. And as much as the right might want Elizabeth Warren to run, it probably won’t happen. The right has deep fissures that they won’t be able to hide during their primaries, but Democrats seem content to sweep their differences under the rug.
There is a real strength in Democrats’ unity. In fact, Hillary Clinton may wind up winning the support of Wall Street Republicans and possibly even neo-conservative Republicans. If the left remains content with her and doesn’t pull her significantly out of the center, she might be able to take advantage of an out-of-the-mainstream Republican opponent to win an election by a Nixon-McGovern or Reagan-Mondale margin.
If you think I’m not serious, consider this:
Two dozen interviews about the 2016 race with unaligned GOP donors, financial executives and their Washington lobbyists turned up a consistent — and unusual — consolation candidate if Bush demurs, New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie doesn’t recover politically and no other establishment favorite gets nominated: Hillary Clinton…
…The darkest secret in the big money world of the Republican coastal elite is that the most palatable alternative to a nominee such as Sen. Ted Cruz of Texas or Sen. Rand Paul of Kentucky would be Clinton, a familiar face on Wall Street following her tenure as a New York senator with relatively moderate views on taxation and financial regulation.
“If it turns out to be Jeb versus Hillary we would love that and either outcome would be fine,” one top Republican-leaning Wall Street lawyer said over lunch in midtown Manhattan last week. “We could live with either one. Jeb versus Joe Biden would also be fine. It’s Rand Paul or Ted Cruz versus someone like Elizabeth Warren that would be everybody’s worst nightmare.”
The knee-jerk reaction to this is that Clinton is the friend of our enemies and must be an enemy herself. But it is at least as possible that it is the fat cats who are making the mistake. They are assuming that a Hillary presidency would be like a Bill presidency, but that is not a safe assumption at all.
For starters, they are obviously different people whose agenda may not be identical. But, more than this, Bill Clinton’s presidency was constrained by the concurrent Gingrich Revolution in Congress. Had Clinton enjoyed strong majorities in Congress he, like Obama, would have had a more progressive record than he wound up having. Hillary Clinton may have more pro-business instincts and support than other possible nominees, but it’s actually the size of her victory (and whether or not she has significant coattails) that will most determine the ideological nature of her prospective presidency. During President Obama’s first two years in office, he had strong majorities and he rattled off more progressive legislation than any president since Lyndon Baines Johnson. The next four years haven’t been anywhere near as productive, but it’s not because the president has changed his worldview. His opponents now have the power to block him, and that’s the only thing that has changed and the main thing that matters.
Without more Democrats in office, no president, no matter how far to the left of Obama they might be, could accomplish much. This is a conundrum for the left because they want a standard-bearer who will trumpet their values, but they also want someone who is effective. There’s a big difference between the president who created the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau and the president who repealed Glass-Stegall. Where would Hillary Clinton land along that continuum?
I have never seen a candidate enter a presidential contest with more leeway than Hillary. She has the left wrapped up in her hip pocket and is on the verge of winning over the financial sector and the foreign policy elite on the right.
Much as I might want a strong leftward challenge, there isn’t any such challenge on the horizon, unless you think Bernie Sanders will get some actual traction. The tension lies between the advantage of locking Hillary into promises to the left and the advantage of her enjoying the maximal possible victory with the most coattails.
She looked strong in 2007, but nothing like this. She is a colossus and, with over 80% Democrats already on her side, she can do pretty much what she wants.
Half the time I wonder if all our effort over twelve years amounted to nothing, and half the time I feel like we’re on the cusp of finally crushing the conservative movement for good.
Strong analysis. If congress sends Hillary progressive legislation, she will surely sign it. How do we get that congress? Major demographic shifts, sooner or later. Maybe sooner if there are coattails in 2016.
The situation in the House is pretty sad, but (in the near term) it will last as long as left-minded people don’t go to the polls.
The situation in the House is pretty sad, but (in the near term) it will last as long as left-minded people don’t go to the polls.
Which means the politicians, starting now, have to push for things like a $15/hr minimum wage, among other things. You have to give people a reason to vote. And no, saying “Scary wackjob Republicans will f-ck up this country for good” won’t do it.
Actually, I think “scary Republians” will actually work this time. We could flip the senior vote if we don’t let them off the hook on the Ryan budget again.
Why is Paul Ryan still in Congress?
The inherent depravity of mankind, and turnout.
Don’t bet against St. Augustine.
It all depends who rides on Hillary Clinton’s coattails into Congress, state legislatures, and governorships. And how devastated the GOP is in its terminal conservatism.
And what happens in the election year of 2014 and the climate year of 2015. Not to mention the sudden belligerent turn in US foreign policy.
Neglect by the political class of policy sanity means that many chickens are coming home to roost.
The 2016 election will show whether progressives can shake their presidential fixation and focus on winning a large number of down-ticket races.
On reflection, progressive winning in down-ticket races will take some bruising primary battles and general election wins that reshape the governance of the Democratic Party. That is a very heavy lift for progressives.
In the absence of a massive shift in the political culture of the US, I am not hopeful.
It looks like corporatist US imperialism will continue to dominate the Democratic Party.
I keep wondering what Barack Obama is going to do after his term is up. Any kind of prognostication has to take that into account, because there’s no reason for him to slither away and hide like W. did. He’ll only be in his mid 50s and his influence, one way or another, will be gigantic.
What if he decided to return to the Senate, for instance? Mark Kirk’s term, conveniently, is up in 2016.
No way that he’s going to run for senator or even governor of a large state. It’s just too much of a downgrade in status. It’d be like, say, Lee Iacocca coming out of his retirement to take a job as CFO or Senior VP of Ford.
SCOTUS maybe.
This.
I’m pretty sure he’d love to be on the Supreme Court.
Well, that’s just by way of a thought experiment, mainly. I would think he’d want a break, if nothing else. My main point is that his influence is something to keep in mind when predicting the near future.
Although I really don’t like this idea of it being a downgrade in status. I know that’s the general assumption, but I don’t really think it’s appropriate in a republic. One of the things I like about Jerry Brown is that he served as mayor of Oakland, and then attorney general, after being governor of California.
A downgrade in status is inevitable for an ex-President. The question is what to downgrade to. I don’t see Obama on the rubber chicken circuit like Clinton and I certainly don’t see him doing nothing like either Bush. I do think he’s the kind of person who’d like to remain influential.
The Senate actually seems like an ideal platform for him – Senators have a lot of visibility and influence, but at the same time it’s not a very demanding job by the standards of high-level politicians. I do think he’ll want a break in 2016 although from a symbolic point of view it would be perfect for him to reclaim his seat and step down to his pre-Presidential job – very Cincinnatus.
John Quincy Adams went back to being a Congressman after he was president. He fought the gag rule re: slavery for years, and finally won, as described in the fantastic book “Arguing About Slavery.”
Obama will do something big, I’ve no doubt. Going back to being a senator would be fine with me, but I’d like to see him as Chief Justice, if we could get rid of Roberts. (Precedent for that too: Taft)
I think he’ll eventually get onto the Supreme Court.
Probably Clinton’s second term.
Son of Baldwin (a fantastic blog if you’re not reading it) recently had a post about LGBT appearing in advertising. It’s not a direct apples to apples moment, but it hits the same points of bein wedded to Clinton. I don’t trust her instincts, and those are important. It’s the same reason I’m wary of getting behind billionaires fighting in favor of action on climate change:
“It always makes me a little nervous–or maybe a lot nervous–when human rights campaigns are tied so closely to capitalist enterprises and when we respond so uncritically to the ideas capitalism introduces.
Queer people are owed human rights because we are alive, not because we’re corporate sponsored.
Because once one allows that to be the threshold, it’s only a matter of time before seedy ideas begin to get bundled with the humane ones.
Here’s to human rights and liberation for all because it’s morally right, not because it may be profitable. “
If corporate sponsorship alleviates the effects of climate change, so be it. Once we’ve averted the decimation of the human race we’ll worry about the corporate bootheel later.
Unfortunately, it’s a bit too late to worry about the overclass getting its hooks into LGBT rights. Without Hollywood and Madison Avenue gay rights would be set back another generation — never underestimate the ability of the WASP Heartland Revanchists to marginalize an ‘other’.
We can walk and chew gum at the same time.
At best, corporate-led solutions to climate change will lead to solutions at the cost of a bigger bootheel. More likely, they’ll lead to a bigger bootheel without real solutions.
Democracy works precisely because it extracts savory results from unsavory groups. The “pure of heart” are always a minority. You have to make alliances of convenience or you’ll never get anything done.
This type of “alliance of convenience” has a pretty solid history of being far, far more convenient for the corporations than for anyone around them.
I don’t mind compromising … when it has a chance of working. But it’s sadly amusing how wildly optimistic self-styled “realists” can be.
Hillary Clinton is looking absolutely fabulous for a candidate 2 1/2 years before the election, with no announced rivals. (Or have I got this the wrong way around? No announced rivals because she’s looking so fabulous 2 1/2 years before the election?)
Wrong way around, definitely. There’s never been any non-incumbent with anything close to this level of support. She’s basically polling like a popular (within the party) incumbent. Think in terms of defeating Obama for renomination in 2012, Clinton in 1996, or Bush I in 1992. The closest example was Dole in 1996 – but even he was about 15 points behind where she is now. Even that was enough to make it a romp.
Yes, but we still have 2 1/2 years to go. If the nomination’s already sewed up, it seems a very odd way of choosing a candidate. Hillary Clinton may “look” like an incumbent, but she’s not an incumbent. She’s not even in public office, and the election is still a long way off.
I may be wrong, but it seems to me that normally candidates would not announce until about a year from now. (Obama, for example, announced his candidacy in February 2007.) whereas Hillary Clinton always seemed to be the perpetual candidate, by default, whether she announces or not. I don’t see that this has done her much good in the past, and I’m not sure it will this time either.
The real problem may be that 2016 is an extremely crucial election for this country, and commentators are anxious to predict how things are going to go long before its really possible.
My only misgivings about Clinton regards how much she really buys into the centrist prolefeed. She and the other Third Wayers came of age near the nadir of liberal power and I don’t begrudge them of doing what they need to do to survive. However, like Clinton and Glass-Seagal or Obama and the inadequate stimulus/2011 debt ceiling debacle, I worry that her triangulation isn’t just mandatory ring-kissing but internalized freshwater aristocracy apologia. The Democratic Party can ill-afford another economic debacle like that at this juncture; we need another 8-12 years to flush out the judiciary and executive officers.
We’ll see in 2014-15, won’t we?
Well, it’s because of people like Booman that we CAN’T actually lock Clinton into the promises to the left. Violation of those promises is met with cries of the possible or firebagger.
Either way she said it herself, if I wanted someone who wanted to admit the Iraq war was a mistake I could vote for someone else. You don’t change who you are in your 50s and 60s after a lifetime.
And people mock me here when I say the fix is in.
I couldn’t have written a better proof of what I have been saying if I tried.
You write:
Conflicted, eh?
Can’t find solid ground?
That is because you are living in a dream world, Booman.
Sorry, but there it is.
If the unlikely chance of Elizabeth Warren making a serious run at the presidency actually did happen…provided of course that her rhetoric is not as full of shit as that of every other politician who has not been thoroughly non-personed by the PermaGov Media Complex (Full of shit being a damned good possibility considering how well she thrived at lovely old PermaGov Harvard, a morass of academic politics that puts even the U.S. Congress to shame.)…the media would strip her down so fast it would look like one of those old paper cutout costume things. One minute a respected professor’s clothes, the next minute an enemy of the state in full battle drag.
Like I’ve been saying, now that Christie is gone..he was quite possibly a decoy all along, someone so flawed that he could be toppled by a media attack with ease…it’s Jeb vs. HRC. Win-win for the 1%, lose-lose for everybody else.
On what evidence would any sane person think that? On the evidence of the last four Dem candidates? Clinton I, Gore, Kerry and Obama? Please.
You write:
Wow!!!
He came in second to the guy who was at the very least the prime benefactor of the JFK murder and was quite possibly…almost certainly, in my view…complicit in that plot.(Remember…LBJ had a hand in everything important that happened in Texas for decades. He was a control freak on an almost cosmic level.)
JBJ.
The savior of our liberal nation.
My ass he was.
Sorry, Booman.
And all of the time wonder when the centrist/progressive/left/call-it-what-you-will in going to wake the fuck up.
Yer dreamin’, folks.
I’ll admit…it’s a nice, comforting dream.
Wake up and smell the burning system!!!
It’s not as if there isn’t plenty of smoke, fer chrissake.
Later…
AG
Well done, Arthur. You’ve mastered the AutoTroll function on your Rand Paul Self-Sheepleizer!
And you have mastered the Daily Kos-o-lizer that you found in your cereal box. The site has degenerated totally into snark and rancid Dem talking points.
Welcome aboard!!!
AG
On the contrary, we’ve cited facts repeatedly that leave your crackpot nonsense exposed for the rancid slop of glibertarian-Limbaugh talkingpoints that it is. You’ve made it clear that you’ve got nothing but fact-free fantasies to peddle – as well as some obvious racial issues of your own. What’s your response? Why, to copy and paste your same old, sad old lists of talking points and add in a little bit more of your conspiratorial claims to unique insight into the USA.
Sorry, Arthur, but you’ll have to do a lot better than you’ve shown so far.
One man’s “fact” is another’s fiction. The winners write history, and they control the image-making media machines as well.
Here’s one ironclad fact for you.
“Nothing is true; everything is permitted.”-Hassan ibn Sabbah, the Old Man of the Mountain.
Another great teacher who prefers to remain anonymous put it another way.
“The universe will try anything once. If it works, the universe will use it. If it stops working, the universe will discard it.”
Bet on it.
AG
I’m not a fan of RonRand Inc, and I don’t think that the Permagov is 100% in control.
That said, I think a lot of what AG says is true, but it sounds more conspiracy-laden than it actually is.
This country has a critical mass of rich oligarchs who through their wealth, connections, corporations, and organization really decide what actually happens. You can see this any number of ways, such as the rich getting their economic policies implemented while 70% of Americans who are polled and agree on something entirely different are ignored. That can be with minimum wage, health care options, drug legalization, jobs rather than debt, etc, etc, etc.
This is what I consider the “Permagov”, as AG puts it. The rich trashbags who own and operate the country for their own benefit. Not a secret, shadow organization (although when you take a look at the NSA, CIA, and the way those organizations act far outside of the law, you sometimes wonder…). These same trashbags own and operate the media. They decide what you see and what you don’t. Which voices get TV shows, and which voices you can’t hear without paying a subscription fee. What political concepts are “ok” and which ones are “subversive”.
War with Iran? That is a serious subject. Raising taxes to the levels of the 1970s? Heresy. Communism. Treason.
I don’t think the Permagov exists in the sense that it is directing everything from the top-down. But, I do believe that the rich trashbags would love to see the completion of the transition from capitalism (1920s-1940s) to fascism (1940s-1980s) to corporate oligarchy (1980s-now) to an aristocracy. Conservatives inherently want an aristocracy. They worship wealth, they desire to be led by someone who has been blessed by Mammon and has the correct last name and genealogy. Etc.
They want the “death tax” eliminated. This allows their children and all of their heirs to own and operate the country. They want the Federal government neutered and reduced to a military for foreign conquest of resources, labor and trade agreements.
And they have the money, power, and many state governments at their command already. Take a look at how many “mainstream conservatives” discuss, openly, secession, revolution, and nullification of Federal laws. It isn’t about states’ rights. It’s about getting rid of democracy and any semblance of a middle class and getting to the neo-feudalism that makes every wealthy trashbag a lord. I mean, listen to the way the Kochs talk about themselves. Or Bloomberg re: going straight to heaven, or how our poor, poor billionaires are potentially concentration camp victims right now.
They have money, they can buy land, and with conceal-carry and Stand Your Ground laws, they can own and operate their own police force. Think knights. The Federal Government is a hindrance because every lord is king on their own land otherwise. State governments don’t care, because a lot of them have already been captured.
AG uses language that I’d consider conspiracy-theory language, and that can be ineffective when trying to describe something that is in reality right out in the open. Telling someone to look in the shadows at midnight isn’t as effective as pointing out specific laws and observable reality and history. But I’m me, and AG is AG. We all think and express it differently.
I don’t think he’s a bigot because of the other thread discussing LBJ’s civil rights stuff as a step back, because in case you haven’t noticed, black kids still get lynched by non-blacks, while the non-blacks go free.
The civil rights movement wasn’t a step back, but it was also countered by the government (CIA, state/federal sentencing guidelines) dumping heroin, crack and unequal protection laws on blacks as soon as they got the right to eat at white lunch counters.
I consider AG as someone who sees the same structural problems as us lefties do, but uses different language to describe it, and has different political beliefs on how to solve it.
That said, anyone who can acknowledge the reality that this country is being controlled by oligarchs, for their benefit, and that it isn’t going to end well for everyone else if we don’t stop it is at least awake.
We may not share the same dreams as AG, but we’re both awake and observing reality.
To make that assertion clear, go ask a 25 year old walking down the street how they feel about any number of issues that you, I, or AG discuss, and just look at the blank stare they return. That is, if that 25 year old isn’t busy staring at their smartphone posting nonsense on facebook like a well-trained 25 year old American.
The enemies of our enemies can be allies, even if it is only temporary. Hell, the few “liberals” who come here and gloat on the Democrats being neo-liberals can still be allies, right up until us progressives/leftists take back the government and impose confiscatory tax rates on them. I’ll use a libertarian to elect a progressive any day of the week.
Thank you n1cholas.
I am not as “conspiracist” as you may believe. I do not think that orders are often sent down from some secret bunker on high to lowly political frontmen and journalists who do the dirty work. It seems to me to be more of a hive mentality. Those who belong to the established Permanent Government have learned their various roles well as they climbed the ladder of achievement. Ivy Leaguers learn one way, the military another, intelligence people a third and media people/economics people/professional politicians etc. do the same. The winners…those who begin to climb into positions of real power…already know which way the wind is blowing before they walk into a meeting room and they have already decided to go whatever direction that wind sends them which is why they are walking into that room in the first place.
So “the PermaGov” is largely a done deal without much talking taking place or orders being necessary.
The blatant theft of the 2000 election and the total silence about it from the entire DemRat establishment is proof enough of this as far as I can see. With very few exceptions…probably Gore, maybe a few others…I cannot imagine that there were many threatening communications sent to people about “what will happen if you pitch a bitch about this.” Everybody knows the game in the big leagues, just like every pro athlete knows that once the game is declared over there is almost no chance of changing the verdict no matter how many bad calls or cheating plays may have been involved. The last prominent U.S. political possible whistle blowers were JFK, RFK and MJK Jr., and the message that those assassinations sent to their surviving peers was quite clear.
After that?
A tweak here, a word there, maybe a phone call to a prominent TV news producer or newspaper editor…
And so on.
That’s how it works.
As long as both candidates are part of the centrist club, the fix is pre-fixed. Then the fixers can sit back with a cigar and some expensive cognac and watch the show.
So it goes, for real.
Later…
AG
n1cholas, how would President Rand Paul and the Congress he would work with solve the bigger problems you bring up here? He is not interested in being an ally of our movement, at all. Neither is AG. He identifies some of the problems, but his remedy is wildly off.
The rule of the oligarchs? Civil and voting rights? Gun laws? States’ rights? Under a Paul Presidency, they’d sail far, far south of where we would want them. QUICKLY.
The security state? Foreign policy? Totally untrustworthy. Look how Rand has responded recently to the Ukraine/Russia and Palestine/Israel disputes. And do you think he’d be hot to defend privacy rights for Arabs, Hispanics and African-Americans? I wouldn’t even trust him to defend privacy rights for Asians.
Brian Schweitzer – unlike Sanders, will require rethinking the polarization as usual and that will be good.
are you for real?
Barack Obama’s first term was pretty much cleaning up shyt that took hold during CLINTON.
DADT
DOMA
CLINTON
the financial sector meltdown which had its seed in the repeal of Glass-Stengall
CLINTON
the consolidation of media properties?
CLINTON
we’re on our third generation of young Black men as fodder for the Prison Industrial Complex
CLINTON
fucking welfare ‘ reform’.
CLINTON
that so many suspect actors would LIKE Hillary Clinton..
thus proves to me once again why my suspicions of her are correct, and that she cannot be trusted.
period.
we’re on our third generation of young Black men as fodder for the Prison Industrial Complex
http://weeklysift.com/2014/03/31/slavery-lasted-until-pearl-harbor/
Third? Don’t you mean… 8th?
This should come as no surprise when you understand why the DLC was founded – to “make the party safe, or safer, for white men.”
Love that article.
A second GHWB term might have been less damaging. The Newtlet 1994 takeover of the House would have been far less likely. GHWB would have continued to struggle to get his agenda (NAFTA, capital gains tax reduction, flag burning amendment) passed because there wasn’t popular support for it. GHWB would have been even more out of touch in a second term than his first one — and eight years of that family would have been enough of them for at least a generation (translation, no GWB that SCOTUS could hand the WH to).
Little chance that Clinton would have gotten another shot at the WH after losing in 1992. Might also have killed off the DLC as not politically viable. Or maybe the problem is that rank-and-file Democrats are as easy to bamboozle as Republicans and electing a DINO in 1996 and that the Bush and Clinton dynasties is what we want after two hundred years of the delusion of democracy.
4 more years of HW Bush would have meant 2 jurists like Thomas instead of Ginsberg and Breyer. That would have created a lot of problems, but worst of all is that we’d never have had a free or fair election again.
Speaking only of the DADT part of your post, I wish people would realize that DADT was a step forward, not backward. People talk like there was gay equality in the services before Clinton dastardly instituted DADT.
In reality, the armed forces were a nightmare for gays, particularly in peacetime. People were kicked out of the service for just being gay. There were “fag hunts” (sorry for the offensive word, but that was the term used) and gays were lucky if it just resulted in being kicked out and not beaten (almost certainly), crippled or defaced (often) or even killed by mobs of drunken bullies.
In 1952, gays and gay marriage were a joke. It took incredible guts and used up a lot of political capital to achieve DADT. Maybe not in Massachusetts or California, but certainly in Illinois and Arkansas. I doubt if it’s even accepted now in Alabama and Mississippi.
DADT was only a step on the way, but it was a giant step — forward, not backward.
Correction: 1992 not 1952. A Freudian slip? Possibly. But in fact, the situation regarding military homosexuality in 1992 had changed little, if at all, from 1952.
Couple thoughts. Maybe even a few.
1. The idea that Hillary Clinton will govern like Bill Clinton is incredibly sexist. Anyone asserting the idea without first doing a thorough self-examination isn’t worth engaging.
For me, I’ve seen very little evidence of how Hillary would actually govern, except as she was a Senator. And as a Senator, she was by and large part of the left-center, rather than center, coalition.
The one thing she seems to share with Bill in her tenure at State is a political cautiousness that can be problematic. It’s often put forward that she is more ready to intervene militarily than the President might be. I tend to see in this a response to perceived politics rather than a visceral hawkishness.
The key thing for me is that that tendency can and likely will be checked by political reality. Yes, there is a faction in the beltway that is pushing to invade Iran. Public opinion is solidly against it. No war. It will be that way with Hillary Clinton. She will be worse than Obama, but better, I’m sure, than her husband was, because our politics are now better. Yes, our politics are now better, despite it all.
2. We fall into a trap when we think that the key factor is the President and that the President’s personal beliefs make things happen. Who Hillary is and who President Hillary will be are two totally different things. She will respond to her environment much more than her environment will respond to her.
The key then is the coalition that will elect her. Booman’s long-running theme, to put it briefly, is that President Hillary Clinton will take Obama’s majority coalition and make it even larger. Like Booman, I would love to see a left candidate who will broaden our coalition like Hillary is poised to, but that candidate is not there. Very likely Obama is as left as we will get in my lifetime as a President, in terms of his personal preferences.
Our system functions through governing coalitions. It has oligarchic and democratic features. Hillary is in a position to strengthen, however ironically given that she’s a legacy admission of sorts, the democratic features. Center-left is as good as we’ll get in this country outside massive structural changes to government that I don’t see happening any time soon. The more likely changes would swing things rightward.
What I’m hoping for is that the next three years of working with Iran creates an atmosphere where people no longer feel compelled to invade Iran.
I think that that’s precisely what will happen.
This is an interesting case, because the most important people in my mind who prevented war with Iran were Condi Rice and GW Bush. I can’t stand either one, but the moment it was going to happen was 2005, and they, warmongers they are, knew that the idea was insane and stopped Cheney.
What Obama is doing is in some ways much more important, which is that he is, contra Bush, successfully spending his political capital from 2012 in a rapprochement, however tentative, with Iran. That was politically inconceivable, despite being diplomatically sensible, before 2012. My regret is that the rapprochement with Iran has tabled a real rapprochement with Cuba. Obama is politically cautious, with good reason, and this is the cost of that.
What? You mean context matters? Who holds congress, matters? This is too complicated for my internet commenting brain. I can’t get good self-righteous retorts out of that.
It’s been a long time since some non-incumbent prez candidate had a primary nomination locked up from the start, hasn’t it? Plus, I thought we are always told that a primary opponent is needed to sharpen the heavily favored prez candidate up. Hillary sure seemed to me a feeble and not particularly effective campaigner in 2008, didn’t seem very “authentic” in the role. Must just be me, given all this massive poll enthusiasm.
Anyway, if she really has no non-fringe opponents, there may be a tactical downside to all this unity, since whatever Repub emerges will have again been vomited out of a competitive field, with the nutcase billionaires having paid for one or another corrupt conserva-stooge to preach their preferred message.
At some point perhaps the country will get a clue and remember that the Congress is actually the branch that makes for any real change under our constitution. As others have said, it would be quite a thing to see Hillary vetoing (or overtly wrecking) bills from a Dem dominated Congress. As all here note, she’d likely be as lib’rul as the Congress turns out to be.
In the big picture, America’s decision to ignore global warming and ruin the planetary environment of course very likely means that all our efforts over the past twelve years amounted to nothing (or amounted to rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic). This is another issue which doesn’t seem to bring out much passion in Hillary, unlike superpower militarism and protecting our useless “ally” Israel.
As others have said, it would be quite a thing to see Hillary vetoing (or overtly wrecking) bills from a Dem dominated Congress. As all here note, she’d likely be as lib’rul as the Congress turns out to be.
She wouldn’t have to veto bills. She could just use Manchin, or some other dirtbag, to water them down(aka the 2017 version of Holy Joe or Ben “Bad” Nelson).
if a credible left candidate entered into it, the left, and all of those of us who don’t trust Hillary would flock to them in a nanosecond.
You really think Elizabeth Warren would have a problem getting
$$$$
and
volunteers?
No. Don’t think so.
That’s it. Candidates invite comparison and until the campaign season actually starts and a few names get announced all this Sturm und Drang about Hillary matters very little.
Sure, but only about 20% of Democratic voters don’t trust Hillary. Warren would have no trouble getting voters or money, but she’d still get trounced.
Maybe, but as they say, that’s why you
play the gamerun the race.Actually, Elizabeth Warren would probably get trounced by Hillary, but if she managed to beat here she would probably win the presidency. The problem, and I wouldn’t consider it much of one, is that she wouldn’t be capable of getting the kind of mega-support Hillary can potentially muster because she would not bring much cross-over.
The thing about Hillary and the The Clintons more generally, is that they are popular with the financial sector and trusted more on foreign policy than Paulites and Tea Partiers by the Republican Establishment.
Those are not good things from a policy perspective, but they are powerful factors that could lead to an immense blowout.
Progressives have to weigh the upside of an immense blowout versus the advantage of a truer ally in the White House.
And, there really isn’t a right answer to that because from a policy perspective more can be done with bigger numbers, but there are decisions (especially of war and peace) that a president makes that can swamp legislative accomplishments.
In short, if you don’t trust Hillary on foreign policy, it’s a major risk to go along with her because you think she’ll crush the conservative movement.
As an analyst, I see her immense upside. As a progressive, I know she could be a godsend in breaking gridlock. But that doesn’t sell her for me. I’m still ambivalent, at best.
The conclusion I reached from your article is that progressives need to focus on congressional races rather than primaries. It’s hard to look away from the glare.
Because there is no Presidential race in 2016. Because Democrats/liberals/lefties have been ordered to STFU — Hillary is the one and you can’t do anything freaking thing about it.
Hey — and liberals decry SCOTUS rulings as taking away our Democracy when the people (Republicans and Democrats) are cool with dynastic rule selected by our corporate overlords.
“Democrats/liberals/lefties have been ordered to STFU…”
By whom, exactly? Could you provide something like evidence for this supposed fiat, because this sounds like the sort of fever dream which I had supposed was Arthur Gilroy’s particular territory.
Here’s one guy.
http://www.msnbc.com/the-cycle/watch/why-dems-should-worry-more-about-electability-198256195696
It’s really annoying for half wits to tell me what I need to worry about. I really don’t like Phil Griffin.
That’s a long way short of some mass conspiracy to silence the Left. It’s one guy’s opinion, and it isn’t even a prohibition on discussion. I think it’s ridiculous when the right-wing crazies go on about being forbidden to speak (by the voices in their heads, apparently) and it’s no better when people create these fantasies about how the Left is being silenced by Those Mysterious Forces No-one Can Quite Name.
It’s one guy selling fear due to some childhood disappointments. He’s pretty much telling people to shut up and get in line because it’s hopeless without Hillary. I don’t have time for conspiracies. What is with the need to blow up the Clintons? This was right after Obama’s reelection. I figured something was up. Seeing the clowns on MSNBC spend productive days talking about hypotheticals years before we even have a primary is troubling. I’m with Jon Stewart when it comes to the Hillary talk.
“The knee-jerk reaction to this is that Clinton is the friend of our enemies and must be an enemy herself.”
The people who believe this are stupid and need to be run out of the party for the benefit of everyone. They can fire up their Third Party like they are always threatening to do so as to scare the Democrats to the Left, get their butts kicked like everyone knows they will – even the most vociferous advocates, which is why they never have the courage of their alleged convitions – while the rest of us laugh all the way to the White House.
To what end? To govern as a Wall Street Republican like Obama? Democratic apparatchiks are delirious at the thought of a landslide. It means mucho dinero for their consultant operations, and lobbyists and big city machines and their own personal Cayman Island accounts. But it means nothing to the voters if it doesn’t mean fundamental economic reform.
I think you’ll find that the main attraction of a hypothetical Clinton landslide is that it might, hypothetically, yield just enough in the way of coattails for the Democrats to take back the House. Sure, the usual money men will make sure they get their cut, just as they do on the GOP side, win or lose, but you aren’t going to get fundamental economic reform absent a Democratic House. Is a Clinton landslide a necessary condition for the House reverting to more civilized hands? I have my doubts, but it’s probably the best chance we are going to get before 2022 when redistricting is up for grabs again.
And will get fundamental reform from a Democratic House full of Lieberdems?
Well, you have a choice between a Democratic caucus which has moved left in recent years (and in which there are, actually rather fewer Blue Dogs than there used to be) or a Republican caucus full of pop-eyed lunatics, morons, racists and proud sponsors of domestic terrorism by the NRA. Difficult choice, isn’t it? If you can find a third alternative militantly liberal party that is ready to govern – i.e. has the votes in the House and the Senate, please, by all means, share your wisdom.
What’s your plan, other than to advocate all or nothingism until the cows come home?
The original subject was how a great landslide can be achieved by moving Right, not Left.
So you argue that we can’t have the Left and a Right Democratic House is better than a wingnut House and I ask again, who profits? Not me. Not my family. Why should we care? Why should we even vote? For more empty promises? For “we won’t screw you as bad as the other guys?” It is abundantly clear that in this grand Center-Right coalition there is no room for white workingmen and damn little room for working people of any race or sex.
I think the jist of the subject is that even if Clinton isn’t as “left” as Obama, she could have extensive coattails.
Unless your political argument is that we should all just sit and home and let the lunatics on the right totally control the Federal government, you have to utilize whatever tools (pun intended) you have to do good.
In this case, I think Clinton fucking destroys her opponent in 2016, barring the economy being totally shit or some sordid scandal coming out and sticking to Clinton.
Progressives/leftists/people who still give a fuck would be wise to USE this opportunity to get Democrats who aren’t right-leaning or centrists into office. Not just Federal office, but local, city, state office, where incumbency often means semi-permanent control of that seat.
A thought experiment. Clinton wins in 2016. Progressives don’t just sit at home crying into their soy lattes and get real progressives elected into all sorts of offices. By 2020, Clinton can win again, and more progressives can be elected to local/city/state offices. And, just maybe, Federal offices too.
This is a solid victory, even if Clinton isn’t a progressive liberal like Elizabeth Warren.
Because you have to take control of the government before you can use government to correct the court of the state. Period.
Either play the game, or lament that Hillary Clinton won’t be bringing in an utopian social democracy by June or July of 2017.
Your choice.
Obama isn’t Left and early in his administration made crystal clear that he despises the Left.
Hence the scarequotes in my original post.
Doesn’t change a bit of the reasoning behind what I said.
Go back to my first post in this chain. Rinse. Recycle.
IOW, to quote the King James Bible: “What profit it a man to gain the whole world but lose his own soul.” Or something like that. I haven’t read the Bible in forty years.
I’m not talking about purity. Don’t put words in my mouth. I’m saying that selling out to gain a big majority that will pass TPP, net non-neutrality, unlimited H1-B visa and the like will profit professional politicians and their hangers-on, but be a disaster for the majority of people. Obviously, you have to compromise enough to win, but going Republican to get a huge majority that can only pass pro-business legislation makes no sense except to the professionals who will get their pound of flesh.
Whoa, whoa, whoa.
We have a crazy-as-shit Republican House.
TPP? Not passed, and not looking likely to pass.
Net non-neutrality? Uncomfortably close to being passed, but an earlier, much more net-neutral set of rules passed by the FCC was stopped in its tracks by judges appointed by Republican Presidents.
Unlimited H1-B visas? Not happening, and extremely unlikely to happen.
All of those things are LESS likely if we elect a better Congress and maintain the Presidency.
Look, there’s plenty to be angry/disappointed about, but you could pick some more realistic concerns. Me, I’d pick the near-abandonment of Labor- remember EFCA?
Other than that and immigration reform, Obama’s first Congress gave us very little to be angry/disappointed about- that Congress kicked ass. If Hillary had a Congress as good or better than Obama’s first, she’d govern well domestically. I can’t imagine her vetoing Democratic bills and budgets.
Let me close by saying it’s simply too early to be sure of ANYTHING, much less a Hillary coronation. The rush to predict the 2016 outcome is unproductive. A Dem landslide would be extremely valuable, though.
What’s that got to do with electing a more right wing House so long as they call themselves Democrats.
Yes, I remember EFCA. That’s when I lost hope for the Democratic Party.
Every single Congressional Democrat is now to the left of every single Congressional Republican. A study of voting patterns in 2013 showed this to be literally, not metaphorically, true. So, it’s literally impossible to elect “a more right wing House” by electing more Democrats. I’m interested in shrinking the Blue Dog caucus as much as you are; it’s important to note that the Blue Dog caucus IS a lot smaller than it was in 2007.
The parties are extremely polarized, and our bases want to keep it that way. The Democratic Party has been dragged to the right from where it was at 30 years ago, but it’s not to the right of where it was 6 years ago.
Booman in the original post was talking about dragging the Democratic Party further Right to increase the (expected) majority in 2016. I repeat, to what purpose?
If power is achieved by abandoning “the base”, why should they care if “their” Party is in power or not.
I’m not arguing against going Right to return to power, which was Bill Clinton’s 1992 argument. I’m arguing against going Right for unstoppable power that can’t do anything but deliver “goodies” to multi-millionaire contributors, freezing out the common man. Booman is arguing for just that. Power for its own sake.
Do you wonder why the majority of the voting age population doesn’t vote? They don’t care which team wins. They care what the winning team is going to do for them. And they know the answer is “nothing”. The five years of the Obama administration have taught them that. Only bankers count.
Why not? It was an obvious disastrous strategy within two years for anything but furtherance of the “Reagan Revolution.”
It worked for the limited purpose of regaining power.
Had a better chance to defeat NAFTA and a capital gains tax reduction had GHWB remained in the WH for four more years.
So the creation and implementation of the CPFB has been for the bankers? The ACA?
Take a look at the accomplishments of Obama’s first Congress again. All those Bills he signed into law. If we want to talk about the actions of the Executive and its Agencies, compare the performances of the NLRB, and the Justice and Labor Departments, under Bush and under Obama. There are other examples. Republican, my ass!
You seem to believe the President want to govern as he has since the House was taken by The Insane Party and the Senate became Filibusterrific.
I don’t have time to look up the CFPB, which shows how important it is to the general public. And I was talking about what was done in the immediate aftermath of the 2008 election when Democrats held all the power. You seem to be more interested in making excuses for Obama than the lives of 150 million working people who are much more interested in their families’ future than in making excuses for Obama, including black workers who have expressed grave disappointment to me.
The Senate’s problems can be laid at the feet of Harry Reid, DEMOCRAT.
The Consumer Protection Financial Bureau is empowered to directly prevent financial institutions from abusing people like they did in the past. Many more than 150 million people will be helped by this Agency.
No more fraudulent subprime lending; no more usury rates for credit cards; clearer explanations of investment products and fairer treatment of investors, an important consideration for the many millions of middle-class Americans with pensions and other retirement vehicles.
You would be interested in the work the CPFB is doing to tear down the current payday loan business model; the Bureau is empowered to take many actions without Congressional approval, so it has the teeth. Listen to CFPB Director Richard Cordray:
“The business model of the payday industry depends on people becoming stuck in these loans for the long term, since almost half their business comes from people who are basically paying high-cost rent on the amount of their original loan,” he said. “Loan products which routinely lead consumers into debt traps should have no place in their lives.”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2014/03/25/is-the-cfpb-about-to-break-the-payday-len
ding-business-model/
The Senate Republicans filibustered the President’s nomination of Cordray for a long, long time. McConnell and many others were extremely explicit in their explanation: they acknowledged the Cordray was a good, nonpartisan public servant and highly qualified, but THE GOP WANTED TO PREVENT THE CPFB FROM FUNCTIONING AT ALL, even though it had been created by a law passed by that first Obama Congress you disparage here.
How was the filibuster finally broken? That horrible DEMOCRAT Harry Reid cut an excellent deal by maintaining and strengthening his leverage over McConnell’s caucus, month after month.
This, and more, is all worth taking the time to look up.
Isn’t that the agency generally regarded as toothless? Didn’t Republicans and DINO’s gut it? Who have they taken to court? Who has been sent to jail?
No, they didn’t gut it. That was certainly the GOP’s intent with all the filibustering of Cordray’s appointment; they were unsuccessful.
Question: why do you think the Republican Caucus was so very desperate to kill the CPFB if it was set up to fail” been effectively running for a year or two. The beauty of what the Bureau can do is that they can compel financial institutions to make operational changes which protect us. I’d like to prevent the crash in the first place; that’s preferable to trying to put crooked financial executives in jail after the crash.
this is lunacy.
Lunacy? Look, I know the score. Politicians are interested in envelopes, free stock in favored enterprises, legal fees for “advice”, investment in spouse’s business, et cetera. A very few are also altruists who try to do something for their constituents while they are filling their pockets. This is the system my whole life, my father’s life, my grandfather’s life and for all I know all of human history. City Hall and the US Congress are like Serpico’s police force. If you are not on the take they will get rid of you. Booman, you know New Jersey. Can you say with a straight face that it’s different in New Jersey? I used to think that it was different in the suburbs, but gradually I learned that it was not. That zoning commissions would happily bend the rules against unanimous homeowner opposition if the chairman got the contract to sell the deviated property. That my state assemblyman, a Democrat, supposedly working for his constituents would sell them out in order to get a huge tax break for Sears. It’s no different. Maybe even FDR and Howard Dean had feet of clay. Maybe FDR worked so hard for the people only because the alternative was Communist revolution that would leave him penniless. Motives don’t matter, only policy. If you give up on policy, why be in the game, unless you can get a ghost job, or a fat contract, or a scholarship for your kid, et cetera.
The LieberDems/Blue Dogs are basically gone. There are only 10 Blue Dogs, and several of them are retiring. They can’t get Republican crossover votes anymore, and the Democrats are less tolerant of renegades, so I don’t expect to see many more either.
Well I’ve got Tammy Duckworth and Dick Durbin.
While Joe Lieberman endorsed McCain in 2008, he did not endorse Bush in 2004. He at least nominally supported the Democratic ticket and spoke in support of Kerry at the Democratic convention.