It should be obvious by now that John McCain wants to attack everyone, everywhere. In September 2013, Mother Jones made a map of the world showing that McCain has advocated attacking roughly half the Eastern Hemisphere’s land mass. Now he wants to attack basically everyone in Syria. Even the hawkish Jeffrey Goldberg thinks this is a bit much:
McCain’s second criticism: Obama is not attacking the root cause of the Syrian war, which is the behavior of President Bashar al-Assad’s regime and its supporters in Iran. He said the U.S. should be bombing government targets at the same time it is bombing Assad’s Islamic State enemies. I, too, am dispositionally interventionist, but it seemed to me that McCain was outlining not only a formula for chaos, but also a program that could not possibly be sold to the American people.
I asked him this question: “Wouldn’t the generals say to you, ‘You want me to fight ISIS, and you want me to fight the guys who are fighting ISIS, at the same time? Why would we bomb guys who are bombing ISIS? That would turn this into a crazy standoff.’ ”
“Our ultimate job is not only to defeat ISIS but to give the Syrian people the opportunity to prevail as well,” McCain answered. “Remember, there are 192,000 dead Syrians thanks to Assad. If we do this right, if we do the right kind of training and equipping of the Free Syrian Army, plus air strikes, plus taking out Bashar Assad’s air assets, we could reverse the battlefield equation.”
The U.S. could conceivably wage war on two fronts against two vicious parties that are also warring against each other, on a battlefield in which another set of America’s enemies — Hezbollah and the Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps — are also fighting. But this is a much too complicated mission for any post-Iraq War American president to prudently tackle, even a president not quite so reluctant as Obama.
For those Americans who are moving toward McCain and away from Paul on crucial questions concerning the U.S.’s role in the world, I can’t imagine that they would be able to stomach such a war, either.
If you think John McCain actually understands the complexity of trying to hold together an alliance to fight ISIS that includes Sunni governments in Amman, Riyadh, Cairo, and Ankara and Shiite governments in Baghdad and Teheran, I have a bridge to sell you in Brooklyn. The war in Syria is sectarian in nature, as are most of the problems within Iraq.
If you are trying to get Baghdad to govern inclusively, you can’t take the side of the Sunnis in Syria. If you can get consensus from the Sunni powers to eliminate the most radical and effective army on their side of the fight, then you’ve accomplished something. But, if you take it too far, everything will blow up in your face.
I wake up every day thanking fate that John McCain never got to order our armed forces around.
So kill ’em all and let God sort ’em out. Seems as if I’ve heard that line before somewhere. Guess it got lost in the fog of war.
Quips:
Don’t thank fate. Thank Sarah Palin.
192,000 killed by Assad, but McCain thinks it should have been us. U-S-A! I say we take credit anyway, since part of Bush’s war was to get ‘them’ fighting themselves ‘over there’ instead of us, here.
Great President or Greatest?
See? The Republicans really are better at foreign policy.
But does anyone “actually understand the complexity of trying to hold together an alliance to fight ISIS that includes Sunni governments in Amman, Riyadh, Cairo, and Ankara and Shiite governments in Baghdad and Teheran?”
Doesn’t look that way yet. My short read? Obama’s coalition of the willing fails for reasons of divided loyalty and incentives on the part of all concerned. I will grant Obama that this may be intentional and, if so, props to him. He tried. And America remains aloof. Ironic the only truly willing “allies” are Syria and Iran; so much has changed.
In the meantime… No-one seems to have a rational argument for fighting these people beyond the immorality of their public execution of innocents; which arguably hasn’t been an obstacle with other partners in the past. Follow the money; now we hear they have billions. Did they win the lottery? If we’re already buying their oil, never mind how many grey hands it has passed through, we have already tacitly bought in to this.
You follow ISIS into Syria and then you got to deal with Putin…and remember Putin has picked the Shia side of this sectarian 6th century conflict. If ISIS is pushed back into Syria, what do you think the Sunnis will do? I predict….nothing.
Things are crazy enough without McCain.
The fatal part of the US plan is the role assigned to the “moderate” rebels in Syria. Fuck them. They are useless, untrustworthy, guaranteed to fail.
You don’t really have to be that bright to see this. SInce President Obama is very bright, I feel sure he does see it. And so, I believe this “central” part of his plan is mainly window dressing put there for idiots like McCain.
In reality, a key role will be played by the Kurds. BTW, did you know there are Kurdish territories in Syria as well? A lot of that territory too is now under Kurdish control, not Assad’s and not Isis’s.
The Kurds will not get their state, but their position in the region will continue to improve.
“Mainly window dressing put there for idiots like McCain.” With all due respect to the unfortunate victims there seems to be a highly theatrical quality about the provocation and the response. Perhaps that’s not such a bad thing but it seems to asphyxiate serious public debate of the underlying issues.
ISIS has created a new issue — itself. ISIS has to be eliminated before any other “underlying issues” can be addressed, if they’re going to be addressed. “Asphyxiating serious debate” seems to be normal practice in this great land of ours. That’s what McCain is for.
If anything, the ISIS phenomenon might actually force some serious public debate, McCain notwithstanding. Because the situation is clearly too complicated for that kind of grandstanding, and Americans are more skeptical than they used to be.
But in any case I do believe it is forcing serious private debate among Obama and his advisors.
When I read stuff like this I wonder if we’re even discussing the relevant issues:
Turkey wants neither Syria nor Iraq strengthened because she harbours sovereign ambitions at the expense of both. Snowden’s document dump suggests Turkey is a target for surveillance as a consequence of persistent dabbling in Sunni militancy yet it is also a significant recipient of Western global investment.
Aren’t we again privatising profit and socialising risk with this proposed military involvement?
“Aren’t we again privatising profit and socialising risk with this proposed military involvement?”
Not particularly. That is what Bush/Cheney were doing in their excellent adventurism, but I don’t see this as adventurism, I see it as dealing with a genuine, potentially long-term threat, and the threat is not only to oil.
As for Turkey, yeah. I didn’t know all the details, but the most obvious was not even mentioned, namely the Kurds. Turkey NEVER wants to strengthen the Kurds, but in my view the Kurds are key to any defeat of ISIS.
I have little sympathy for Turkey’s position, except with regard to the hostages. But yes, that is a great excuse. So why don’t they just stay out of this, that might be best.
We can just let McCain do all the heavy lifting himself, since he’s such a badass.
We are going to need to provide a whole lot of jets, though.
And yet, he keeps getting reelected. Even Arizona must come to its senses some day.
Don’t bet on it. Look at Texas.
Yea, look at Texas.
http://blog.chron.com/texaspolitics/2014/09/internal-survey-davis-trails-abbott-by-single-digits/
I heard Wendy Davis speak at a rally last week. She is a straightforward, effective speaker with a real grasp of the problems of most people today.
I came away convinced that if enough people hear what she’s saying she can win.
I’m glad I gave some money to her, but I’ve pretty much lost my faith in the American people over the last fourteen years. They seem to have removed a plug at the base of their brains.
I just learned that McCain is the most unpopular of any senator in his own state, at 30 approve to 55 disapprove. I’m spreading it around.
But the morons keep voting for him again and again. The best we can hope for is a heart attack or massive stroke. Then they will just elect whatever sleazeball the Koch brothers put up. So that won’t help either.
Since McRube was just re-elected to another 6 year term, I think we can discount any hope of rational voting by the idiots of AZ–that state is a dead loss to the nation.
Yes. McCain is a clear and present danger to the government of the United States of America and its foreign policy.
But he still has the more-bully-pulpit-than-the-President permanent talk show status and the “maverick” reputation that makes weak Democrats swoon and follow him in amendments that force his policies on the military and the President.
It’s not like he’s completely irrelevant. Democrats, if they would, could make him completely irrelevant.
We’ve all known of John McCain’s true ethics since way back in the reign of Bush the Elder, but it hasn’t seemed to make much difference to Arizona voters.
He’s mentally ill. Abusive, bi-polar narcissists are often attracted to politics.
Add the brain damage he probably acquired in captivity and he’s Sunday talk-show material, but not anyone who should influence policy or be taken seriously on any topic whatsoever.
My father was a WWII POW. Years ago he watched a TV special on Viet Nam Vets, he right away identified the kind of selfish POW McCain had been. Despite life endangering injuries and long durations of captivity, there is a type of POW whose selfless concern for the welfare of other rises. My father could read it in the way the other POWs spoke never with derision but in a subtle way not including him in the circle of camaraderie.
“I wake up every day thanking fate that John McCain never got to order our armed forces around.”
Or for that matter, Sarah Palin.
John McCain is a danger to America. If we could get him to understand that problem, I am sure he would advocate bombing John McCain.
Folks are finally waking up to the fact that McCain wants war all the time anywhere?
where have they been?
Look who the primary advertisers are on those shows: Boeing, Lockheed Martin, et al. And drugs and health care products for the rubes. Is it any wonder McCain has a permanent cot in the green rooms?
The Saudi Kingdom had undermined Syrian society by funding mosques and madrasses teaching fundameltalist Wahhabism. A decade long missionary enterprise to force regime change, the nation is in turmoil due to an alliance with the US, France, UK and later NATO partners. To learn more about Saudi royalty and the Islam school of Wahhabism, here an excellent article. A long read in two parts.
[Links added are mine – Oui]
So which is the fake? AQ? Mafkarat? Every few days, for those unfamiliar with this particular area of the internets, somebody calls out Jihad Unspun as a CIA plant. This has been going on for years.
○ Clinton’s 21st Century Statecraft and the Land of the Two Rivers
A longer version posted in my diary – Quite Depressing Really, Obama and the ISIS Crisis.
Of course McBoob has deformed and perverted judgment about all matters of foreign policy, and likely has some form of mental illness at this point.
But Repubs have clearly designated Lindseypoo and McBoob as their point men for explaining the Repub position on our next war against IS, and the corporate media (as always) is playing along in perfect harmony. Americans have already been manipulated by their useless media into seeing the IS as a terrible threat to suburban Peoria. If there are any Dems in Congress who seriously resist new ME wars, they seem already to be quailing in the face of the “conservative” media campaign that “something must be done and it better be BIG!”.
As Shaun writes above (if I understand him correctly), the idea that some sort of effective anti-IS “coalition” can be formed is pure fantasy, and Obama is well aware of it—but “something must be done”. I am less sanguine that this means it will be nothing but pure flyboyz theater, “a tale told by an idiot, signifying nothing”. With the corporate media blasting the Repub “It’s War!” position 24/7, theatrical gesturing will become inadequate.
Reports are the IS is experiencing a large increase in volunteers, and in finances. Its bulging coffers and secure supply lines are not being explained to us, nor are its history and early allies (such as Saudi Arabia) being discussed by “leaders” like McWar (or Obama for that matter). IS has long since passed the stage by which it can be seriously threatened by US air strikes and the (offensively useless) ground forces that are actually available (and willing?) to strike it.
Add in the hilarity of proposing that we simultaneously attack Assad’s forces (one of the few IS enemies present on the battlefield!), and one can see what an absolute fool’s errand this is. Putin’s very clear support for Assad makes even war with Russia a possibility (which irresponsible imbeciles like McCain utterly discount). Also, too, no need even to decide which “enemy” need be defeated first, IS or Assad! Attack everyone! Clausewitz, anyone?
It now seems highly likely that “defeating” IS is going to be a battleground issue for the 2016 prez campaign. Repubs are going to use the standard “terrorist” and fear-mongering themes that they have perfected to encourage national bed-wetting, aided and abetted by the warmongering corporate media. And in truth, crushing the IS units and regaining “control” of the territory they have conquered would require corps-level armored and mechanized infantry formations with an actual will to fight–and that means the Imperial Sturmtruppen. Of course, they can destroy all organized military units in their path, but they cannot “win” anything over there. That is simply axiomatic by now.
The question is whether the escalation to another ME ground war can be stopped? What will Hillary’s position be? (rhetorical question, haha) Anyway, McRube’s prominent teevee yapping makes clear the “conservative” movement is building the case for their next “existential” war of choice—since almost anything in the ME can utterly destroy America and all we stand for!
This seems a startling omission under the circumstances. The American public deserve better regarding what is done in their name.
Here’s an update of a few of McCains recent companions.