I don’t think making the anniversary of Robert E. Lee’s surrender at Appomattox a national holiday would advance the cause of national unity. It would be nice if such a thing were uncontroversial and uniformly embraced, but that’s not the America we live in. In fact, proposing such a thing shows the same lack of introspection that progressives so correctly accuse conservatives of lacking.
It supposes a more perfect union than, in fact, exists or than has ever existed.
Real introspection requires us to look at the Conservative Movement not just for what it is, but for its integral and inseparable role in our nation’s character. We don’t have to agree that America is fundamentally a center-right country to acknowledge that conservatism is a bedrock aspect of our political culture.
The Confederacy is with us still, and will remain so as long as conservatism is the core philosophy of one of our two major parties. Republicans may not openly mourn slavery, but they won’t join us in celebrating the demise of secessionists from an overbearing federal government.
To try to force them to celebrate Lee’s surrender at Appomattox is taking things too far. It’s enough that they consent to live in union with us even as we craft a more perfect country that is not to their liking.
The flip side of a consensual polity is that every actor has a veto. It only takes one actor to say “we will not coexist”, and the whole house of cards is down. That is where we are.
Then there are two questions that might remain:
Question 2) has no answer and question 1) is therefore without interest — it might have been structurally without interest a priori.
I agree with cramming this down Southerners throats is harsh and over the top.
But I listened to these people for 8 years of Bush tell me the following repeatedly. “America Love it or Leave it”. Thus my opinion is they have the same choice to make for themselves. They either have to love America or leave it! No one is forcing these people to live here as a matter of fact the country would be far better off for the most part if they packed up and moved out. Let them share their massive hate with some others.
If anything it doesn’t take it far enough. Allow Loomis to fill in the blanks:
My polling station when I lived at my parent’s house was Robert E Lee elementary. And the exit to get to their house is right at the Stonewall Jackson Shrine. Fuck these traitors.
Besides we need another federal holiday. And April fills in the blanks between February and May.
This.
When supposed “conservatives” are doing crap like this IN MY NAME, I say cram it long, cram it hard and cram it unrelentingly down their throats.
Theirs was an ideology built upon an inhuman, genocidal “tradition” and they own all of it, not just the parts that suit them. The more we can make their entire agenda clear and inescapably stuck to their hides the sooner we can get that ‘more perfect’ union.
If I had my way all the monuments to the traitors of the South would be treated like this one and this is the treatment that their hallowed battle flag would get
That the stain of the confederacy has been encouraged to fester in the American body politic is a sin.
We can’t force them to celebrate it right now. But I think constant discussion is great. Force conservatives to talk about how evil the Confederacy was at every possible opportunity.
The fact that the Confederacy lost is indeed a great thing and deserves a lot of celebration.
This seems the correct approach and has the added benefit of being doable, not that our useless and craven corporate media would ever take it up in any way.
Of course one does not have to Google too long to find rightwing apologias for slavery, and conservatives have long loved “discussing” how noble, virtuous and wonderful the original Confederacy was, to such effect that I wonder if a majority of (white) Americans aren’t actually sympathetic to its memory. Rhett Butler’s last stand conversion and all that Lost Cause garbage basically became the Official Story. Certainly there is widespread respect for Lee and Jackson due to their martial abilities and successes. They are (still) seen as America’s greatest generals by many!
To some extent, the Unionists fled the field in the battle for the nation’s memory of the war upon seeing the adamance of the defeated South’s entrenched nostalgia, and just refused to engage with them, apparently out of politeness! Hence the abandonment of Reconstruction and the erection of Jim Crow, a reticence that extends practically to the present day….
It may be doable but I’d rather see our finite resources targeted at things that are more likely to make a real difference for people. Campaign finance reform at a constitutional level, for instance. We might be able to convince enough libertarians to get on board with that that it’s crossover appeal pushes it over the top. Same for corporate rights reform.
Yep, politeness on our side is a problem Too many of us don’t like to make the other guy uncomfortable, or we resort to the Both Sides are Guilty retreat.
And in what context/setting would we be able to force a conversation? The MSM might talk about it for a few days, perhaps get a loudmouth RW talk show host like Eric Erickson to oppose the measure. A few brief segments, and the media moves on, preferably to something which doesn’t tick off the southern states, which still count in their ratings.
Maybe Starbucks’ Howard Schultz could go back to the drawing board after the Race Discussion disaster and tweak it on the more specific topic of the Appomattox national Johnny Reb Surrender Day. If they did, I’d double the amount of hard earned money I send them in a given week. For sure, some of their stores in the Old Confederacy would probably be fire bombed, but at least a big corporation would be standing on principle for once.
I’m thinking also we need a big blockbuster movie to rival the pro-South Gone With the Wind. Apparently Glory! wasn’t blockbuster enough, and the recent Lincoln was too constitutionally complicated, with too little action, to get folks riled up. Probably this would be yet another Spielberg production, and we’d need one or two wildly popular Southern actors to be on the other side of the camera to sell it especially in the border states. Try to bring in Theodore Turner to co-produce. Get that Univ of Kintuck basketball fan southern lady singer/actress from a big family whose name escapes me to play the leading female role.
We’ve been too easy on the southern traitors– for 150 years. It’s high time in this anniversary year that we speak up and lay down the law.
Every year on Appomattox Day I consider burning a Confederate battle flag, and every year I decide not to–because 1) I’d actually have to buy one of those vile things and 2) accidentally lighting myself on fire would be stupid.
I’m more interested in efforts towards a holiday celebrating finalizing the agreement with Iran. as far as a ll the bridges, etc seabe mentions, a local discussion/ free for all in each instance about the name and local history would be constructive
Nah, it’s a recognition that national unity is not possible, certainly not if parts of the country refuse to see the defeat of the Confederacy as a good thing. It’s a loud F YOU to the neoconfederates, and dares their representatives in Congress to officially side with the Confederacy, again. I’m sure that’s not a problem for many of the gentlemen from South Carolina, but (Western) Tennessee and Arkansas may be in trouble. Ditto (South/Central) Florida and (Northern) Virginia.
Sounds like a great holiday to me and the perfect tonic for an era of nullification, voter suppression, and anti-healthcare laws. Neo-confederates would still have their Stone Mountain and any of a million other shrines to their failed war, and in any event they could always create a confederate holiday on the same day (don’t several states have a confederate holiday on MLK Day?) or choose to “celebrate” it differently.
Interesting points, but you should read one of my favorite bloggers talking about the progressive fear of wielding power, for a different take. He goes by the name ‘Booman.’
This is an interesting question. In general I saw shove it down their throats and make them defend it publicly. The Japanese still have truth issues about their culpability, in a lot of ways similar to the old confederacy.
So, in that manner I think having them own it and all the rest is a good idea. It is true that my relatives in Jackson, MS absolutely would hate the idea.
Happy Appomattox Day
As far as I’m concerned, the Robert E Lee Memorial (maintained by the US Park Service) shouldn’t exist. It was built by George Washington Custis (Martha Washington’s grandson who she and George reared after the death of her son).
More disgusting is that it wasn’t designated as the Robert E. Lee Memorial until 1955! Almost a hundred years after the USG came into possession of it.
Interesting how the designation as the Robert E. Lee Memorial happened as it just so happens the year after the Brown v. Board of Education decision. I bet that Strom Thurmond and some of the other Fergit Hell Boys were leading that pack. Would be interesting to see if there was a recorded vote.
Fuck ’em.
When Robert E Lee and Stonewall Jackson have state holidays: Fuck ’em.
While the Stars and Bars are officially the state flag: Fuck ’em.
While even one “Confederate” (read: traitor) State allows Klan masks or Cross Burnings: Fuck ’em.
Until the seditionists stop running for office: Fuck ’em.
Shove it down their throat that their traitorous great-grandfathers LOST, and their “heritage” is hatred that has come home to roost.
The south were traitors that fought a war to secede and lost. They should be remembered that way and the federal government should play no part nor provide any support for memorials to the Confederacy, nor especially, its generals. Let Conservatives celebrate or not as they choose, but let’s remember the facts about the civil war and get rid of monuments to traitors.
But pushing back against Lost Cause mythology is useful. There are communities that have banned the flying of the traitor flag, renamed schools, etc.