On the occasion of Saddam Hussein’s execution I want to revisit his interview with Dan Rather from February 23, 2003. Saddam Hussein told Rather that he had no WMD, he told him that Dick Cheney was nuts to think the Iraqi people would greet our troops with flowers, and, most memorably, he challenged George W. Bush to a debate to be aired via satellite. It makes for chilling reading now that we look back it at. Here’s an exchange from early in the interview:
Rather: Mr. President, do you expect to be attacked by an American-led invasion?
Translator For Saddam Hussein: We hope that the attack will not take place. But we are bracing ourselves to meet such an attack, to face it. I’m sure you’ve observed the general life in Iraq. You’ve been here for a few days now. We hope that such a possibility doesn’t take place, but you’ve been here. You’ve been here for a few days, and you’ve seen how the people live. They live normally. They get married. They establish relationships. They visit each other. They visit their neighbors.
They travel around Iraq. They are enjoying life in the manner that life is provided. But at the same time, they also hear the news…because the officials in the United States keep talking about attacking Iraq, about the possibility of attacking Iraq, which is why the people are in Iraq, which is only natural – that they get prepared for such a possibility.
Even though, God Almighty invites us…and we hope that — we pray to him that — the Americans will refrain from such an eventuality — to avoid both the Americans — to spare the Americans from committing such a mistake — and also to spare Iraq and the Iraqi people from being involved in such an experience. And those who would like to ride the bandwagon of evil, it’s up to them.
Go below the fold to see Saddam’s challenge to George W. Bush.
Rather: I understand. Mr. President, again, you’ve been patient with your time. What is the most important thing you want the p – American people to understand? What’s the most important thing you want the American people to understand, at this important juncture of history?
Translator For Saddam Hussein: First… Convey to them that the people of Iraq is not an enemy of the American people. It is only– people of Iraq are only opposed to the policy of the United States government, administration, against the people of the world, including the people of Iraq. Iraq hopes and looks forward to living in peace, and in fact, hopes and prays for all others, all peoples of the world, including people of the United States, to live in peace and to live in respect. And– respect amongst all people.
(OVERTALK)Male Voice: (UNINTEL) respect the will of others.
Translator For Saddam Hussein: If– the American people– would like to know the facts for what they are, or as they are, through a direct dialogue, then I am ready to conduct a direct dialogue with the President of the United States, President Bush, on television. I will say whatever I have to say– about American policy. He will have– the opportunity to say whatever he has to say about policy of Iraq. And this will be in front of all people, and– on television, in a direct—uncensored – hon – honest manner. In front of, as I said, everyone.
And then they will see what the facts are, and where falsehoods are. And I would not object to see this dialogue conducted on– by– by Mr. (UNINTEL).
Rather: Are you speaking about a debate?
Rather: This – this is new. You– you are suggesting, you are saying, that you are willing, you are suggesting, you’re urging a debate with President Bush? On television?
Translator For Saddam Hussein: Yes. That’s my proposal.
Rather: Well, that’s an interesting (UNINTEL).
Translator For Saddam Hussein: The American people, as we see on films – are great. On films, we see that the Americans, when they are challenged for a duel, they will not– decline the – the offer. As the Arabs would – would (UNINTEL). We are not asking for a duel. But… We are proposing that we should (UNINTEL) support the Americans, and – We are asking for a – a – a – an opportunity to be seen by the Americans, the Iraqis, and all of the people in the world in a debate that is shown on television, between myself and Mr. Bush, directly, to be watched by…
Translator For Saddam Hussein: This will be – This will be an opportunity for him, if he is committed to– to war, and if he has decided to– commit to wage war, this will be an opportunity for him, if he’s convinced– to– to convince the world. If he’s convinced in his own position, this will be an opportunity for him to convince the world that he is right in taking such a dec– (GLITCH). It could also be an opportunity for us – To – tell the world our own side of the story. And why we want to live in peace, and in security.
I believe that it is the right of the American people, the Iraqi people, and the world, of honor. Which makes it incumbent– incumbent upon us to say what we have (UNINTEL), so that– they– they will be clear about– our position.
Don’t you call for the truth to be released in the United States? This is how we hear. This is… And what we read, from-This is what we read and hear about the American philosophers, and (UNINTEL)–
(OVERTALK)In their books, and even in their movies…. So, why should we hide from the people? So, why should we discredit ourselves? Why should not we– why shouldn’t we disclose ourselves to the people? We as President – President of the United States, and President of Iraq, in front of our people.
Translator For Saddam Hussein: (UNINTEL) invite… Then we will either go (UNINTEL) to peace, to choose the path of peace, which is what we look for, and hope– Then we will spare both our people the harm and the loss. Or otherwise, the– whoever wants to decide anything other than peace, then he will have to convince his own people, with whatever– avenues–
Translator For Saddam Hussein: This is the– the gist of my proposal, my idea.
Rather: This is not a joke.
Translator For Saddam Hussein: No, this is something proposed in earnest. This is proposed out of my respect for the public opinion of the United States. And it is out of my respect to the people of the United States. And to the people of Iraq. And in– out of my respect to mankind in general. Humanity at large. I call for this, because war itself is not a joke. Whoever chooses war as the first choice in his life, then he is not a normal person. I think the – the debates would be an opportunity for us to insure peace and safety. Then, why don’t we–
(OVERTALK)Why don’t we – Why don’t we choose to talk, in which we will be respecting our people, as two– as the two highest authorities in our countries. The two needed to take the decisions, on the basis of their own– you know, decision-making apparatus.
Here in Iraq, we have our own apparatus, for reaching those decisions. And we know that in the United States, you have your own system. But we, as the leaders of the two countries, why don’t we use this opportunity in a debate, so that– we can show our respect to both our peoples, and to humanity. And then each of us can take the decision that h– h– he or – decides to take, according to what goes on.
Rather: Mr. President, where would this debate take place, that you imagine– what would be the venue?
Translator For Saddam Hussein: It will be in a place, as President of the United States, and Saddam Hussein will be in a place as President of Iraq. And then the debate can be conducted through satellite.
Rather: Oh. So, a satellite television debate. Live.
Translator For Saddam Hussein: And if Mr. Bush has another proposal, a counterproposal with the same basic idea then we’re prepared to listen to such a proposal.
Rather: Would you be prepared to come to the United Nations for this debate?
Translator For Saddam Hussein: The basic thing is that as far as debate to be heard in the natural, normal– in a (UNINTEL) accurate manner. In the United Nations, voices are not heard. Not always. And I do not mean that I go and I make a speech at the United Nations and then that Bush will make his speech at the United Nations. That is not what I mean. What I mean is that we sit– as we are sitting, you and I, now as– Here is– I will address questions to him and he will address questions to me. The position of Iraq and he will – the position of the United States.
He will explain why – ‘I will (UNINTEL) go to war.’ I will explain why we are insistent on peace and we want to maintain peace. And we maintain our (UNINTEL).
(OVERTALK)Translator For Saddam Hussein: Those people in the United States also – and other people will (UNINTEL).
Without make-up. Without – Without editing. Without – Without – Without prepared speeches which– which (UNINTEL) do not listen to. The people like listening to live debates. Live debates between–
(OVERTALK)Translator For Saddam Hussein: I believe people listen to psychological (UNINTEL) about people in the United States (UNINTEL). That they like to see live debate amongst people with – proof and counterproof.
Rather: Well, this surprises me. I want to make sure I understand.
Translator For Saddam Hussein: That this debate should be– shown–
Rather: A live international debate via satellite–
Translator For Saddam Hussein: That’s it. A live, direct debate through satellite.
Rather: How did this– who– who would moderate this debate?
Translator For Saddam Hussein: Any (UNINTEL) that you can moderate.
Rather: With respect, Mr. President, I have (UNINTEL) other problems. I’ve got enough problems already. But I–
Translator For Saddam Hussein: That’s another (UNINTEL PHRASE)…. But–
(OVERTALK)Translator For Saddam Hussein: – the responsibility of – The responsibility of displaying the truth as– as an outstanding man of the media– to carry out this responsibility is something that is on– of course you will do that while maintain – when you can play the truth he’ll be sparing people many– a lot of harm.
Rather: Well– first of all, I want to be serious that I– I appreciate– your confidence – Mr. President. I’m pausing because I’m tempted to ask a favor of the president. (Editor’s note: Rather is referring to Saddam Hussein) He has surprised me. I wonder for my good health if he could denounce me? (LAUGHTER)
Translator For Saddam Hussein: Denounce you?
Rather: Yes.
(OFF-MIKE CONVERSATION)
Rather: (LAUGHTER) Well, I – I think this is –
Translator For Saddam Hussein: I met you in 1990. And I’m meeting you now. We have not met– We are not partners in any enterprise or any – not competing with any people for any other – So this is the basics of–
Rather: I understand. (UNINTEL) I appreciate your remembering that we met in 1990. And I interviewed you in this great building. Given the sober moment and the danger at hand, what are the chances this is the last time you and I will see each other?
Translator For Saddam Hussein: You want me to say what I truly believe as it is?
Rather: Yes.
Translator For Saddam Hussein: Basics– basis is that (UNINTEL PHRASE) decides the destiny of man. But—and – God almighty says also that it is incumbent upon man to do what should be done on the ground. Then it is there that I can see– it is now that I can see that (UNINTEL) we have other meetings. No matter what happens. And I hope that Iraq and the United States, the people of Iraq and the United States will live in security and in peace. And in mutual interests, national interests without harm caused by any side to (UNINTEL).
It is to our everlasting shame that Saddam Hussein proved to be more honest and more prescient and more peace-oriented, than our own President…than our own government.
